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#95640 - 10/21/03 10:06 AM Group specific martial arts classes
Anonymous
Unregistered


I can understand why some classes are split into age groups or grades etc. but what do you all think of martial arts classes that only teach specific groups?

I have come across Karate for Christ who only teach Christians, several womens martial arts groups that won't even let males over 15 in the dojo and a gay and lesbian group.

What do you all think about these types of group?

Incidently I also run classes for a specific group; they are called people [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]
Sharon
Sorry this should have gone in the Martial Arts Talk section.

[This message has been edited by wadowoman (edited 10-21-2003).]

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#95641 - 10/21/03 10:18 AM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
Yoseikan Student Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/02/03
Posts: 1166
Loc: UK
[QUOTE]Originally posted by wadowoman:
I can understand why some classes are split into age groups or grades etc. but what do you all think of martial arts classes that only teach specific groups?

I have come across Karate for Christ who only teach Christians, several womens martial arts groups that won't even let males over 15 in the dojo and a gay and lesbian group.

[/QUOTE]

ahhhh, wow! I had no idea. Thats an awesome idea. Right I'm off to start my own club for 19 yr old male students of mixed race that weigh no more than 10 1/2 stone. I think I'll be a 12th dan..........

seriously, each to their own, but why? It can't make for good training.

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#95642 - 10/21/03 10:47 AM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
JohnL Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 4309
Loc: NY, NY, USA
Hi Sharon

Given that some people train in MA's as a social activity, it seems like they're creating a specific group of people with similar ideas that they would like to train with.

Nothing particularly wrong with it. I don't see any great benefit either.

I guess if I were to attend a gay MA group and while grappling was grabbed by the nuts, at least I'd know the guy was gay as opposed to guessing. I'm not sure if that's a benefit or not [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif[/IMG]

JohnL

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#95643 - 10/21/03 11:50 AM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
xerxes Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 515
Loc: Georgia, USA
I have a book called Fighting Arts( I think a later edition had a different title). One chapter deals with a martial art from India called Kalaripayit. You have to be hindu to become a student.

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#95644 - 10/21/03 12:37 PM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
JohnL Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 4309
Loc: NY, NY, USA
Kalaripayit does come from India but as far as I'm aware you don't have to be hindu to practice it.

JohnL

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#95645 - 10/21/03 02:56 PM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
charles mckey Offline
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Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 1368
I think it largely depends upon what they claim to be teaching. If it's a social thing, I guess it doesn't particularly matter how the class is made up, although there's a lot to be said for broadening one's horizons further, imo.

If it's self defence, I don't think groupings by particular beliefs are especially detrimental to training (or at least I don't see why they would be). I have concerns about these groups "ghettoising" themselves, but hey, it's their choice.

In terms of self defence though, I think groupings according to physical characteristics could be detrimental - the idea of women's only self defence (when women are far, far, more likely to be attacked by a bloke, sadly) seems fundamentally misguided. Not only are they not training for the most likely scenario they could face, it strikes me that they're subconciously reinforcing the idea of the male as some unbeatable bogeyman, too dangerous even to be allowed in the class. Hopefully such classes serve as a "toe in the water" type deal, and the participants go on to armbarring muscular he-man types in later classes [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

Me, I don't care who's in the class - an arse kicking from a 200lb christian is probably much the same as one from a 200lb heathen [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif[/IMG]

[This message has been edited by charles mckey (edited 10-21-2003).]

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#95646 - 10/21/03 03:09 PM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
charles mckey Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 1368
[QUOTE]Originally posted by JohnL:
I guess if I were to attend a gay MA group and while grappling was grabbed by the nuts, at least I'd know the guy was gay as opposed to guessing. I'm not sure if that's a benefit or not [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif[/IMG]
[/QUOTE]

Arf! I should think you'd both be too concentrated on not getting tapped out - leastways, I'd hope so... [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

Out of interest, how many people here do, or have attended, mixed grappling classes (male/female, I mean)? Was inappropriate contact (for want of a more elegant phrase) a problem? Apocryphally, I've heard that it does put women off training in grappling arts.

[This message has been edited by charles mckey (edited 10-21-2003).]

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#95647 - 10/21/03 04:04 PM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
xerxes Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 515
Loc: Georgia, USA
[QUOTE]Originally posted by JohnL:
Kalaripayit does come from India but as far as I'm aware you don't have to be hindu to practice it.

JohnL

[/QUOTE]

Well, that's what it said in the book. At least one of the authors went to India and interviewed the instructors. Of course, just because those particular instructors restricted their classes does not mean that all Kalaripayit instructors would do that.

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#95648 - 10/21/03 04:14 PM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
xerxes Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 515
Loc: Georgia, USA
[QUOTE]Originally posted by charles mckey:
Arf! I should think you'd both be too concentrated on not getting tapped out - leastways, I'd hope so... [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

Out of interest, how many people here do, or have attended, mixed grappling classes (male/female, I mean)? Was inappropriate contact (for want of a more elegant phrase) a problem? Apocryphally, I've heard that it does put women off training in grappling arts.

[This message has been edited by charles mckey (edited 10-21-2003).]
[/QUOTE]

Check out my post in the "sparring" thread of a few weeks ago. The females in our class have to wrestle whoever is available just like the males do. Do arms and hands brush against a breast or a crotch? Sure, from time to time. Is it a big deal? Not for anyone, as far as I can tell.

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#95649 - 10/21/03 04:44 PM Re: Group specific martial arts classes
Reiki Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/30/02
Posts: 3400
Loc: MiddleEarth
[QUOTE]Originally posted by charles mckey:
Out of interest, how many people here do, or have attended, mixed grappling classes (male/female, I mean)? Was inappropriate contact (for want of a more elegant phrase) a problem? Apocryphally, I've heard that it does put women off training in grappling arts.[/QUOTE]

We do it all the time and have not had any problems. We grapple anyone, any time, no inappropriate contact, no big deal.

The only difficulty is for the smaller women/girls grapplng the larger blokes but its actually great practice and good to try out techniques.

An armbar or choke is just as effective on the larger ones....... [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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