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#94201 - 08/15/03 04:46 PM Re: Strangles and Chokes
Anonymous
Unregistered


Try bending the thumb in on itself (you have to do it quite hard, try it on yourself)
In most people it causes a fair amount of pain.
Obviously not a finishing technique, but it will loosen an attacker's grip sufficiently to follow up if you are being strangled/choked/grabbed by a stronger assailant.
Sharon

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#94202 - 08/16/03 04:44 PM Re: Strangles and Chokes
Yoseikan Student Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/02/03
Posts: 1166
Loc: UK
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chen Zen:
To be a competant martial artist you should be able to block. [/QUOTE]

Disagree. Sorry for taking this out of context and I'm not being funny Chen, but I couldn't block my own punches, at least not a combo. If blocking is about reacting, then its all BS in my opinion. I can get out of the way, parry or cover, but I can't block. If you are interested in an explanation please see my post on reactive blocking in the main section. (I'd possibly be willing to compromise on outside to inside block across the body - but only just!)

With respect

Alec.

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#94203 - 08/16/03 04:55 PM Re: Strangles and Chokes
Anonymous
Unregistered


Has anyone worked out how to escape from a gull wing choke? My partner and I have bothalmost passed out trying to escape from this, nothing seems to work quickly enough to escape. Any ideas?
Sharon

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#94204 - 08/16/03 08:51 PM Re: Strangles and Chokes
xerxes Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 515
Loc: Georgia, USA
That is a term I haven't heard. Please describe a gull wing choke.

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#94205 - 08/16/03 09:05 PM Re: Strangles and Chokes
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Thank you Sharon. Are there any benefits to folding it in instead of out?
Yoseikan Student, of course you cannot block every attack, unless there is a huge speed difference however you should be able to block two or three attacks in a row and this is the length of most peoples combos. Wing Chun sticky hands teaches you how to block almost all attacks with a single hand. I cant pretend to know much about Karate especially Yoseikan but as a hand dominated art I would think that a karateka would have exceptional or at least above average blocking skills.

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#94206 - 08/17/03 03:29 AM Re: Strangles and Chokes
Anonymous
Unregistered


Chen,
Two benefits, for me at least. Firstly I find it easier to fold it in against a stronger/bigger opponent if I am grabbed or choked than folding it out. Secondly, it makes them let go quicker as most seem to find it more painful.

Xerxes, a gull wing choke is quite difficult to describe in writing but I will try.
The attack is done from the side, let's assume your attacker is on your right.
his right arm goes under your right arm pit, forcing your right arm up. His left arm goes around the back of your neck and he grabs his own wrist, digging into the left side of your neck and pulls in towards himself.
If this is clear as mud, perhaps someone else can explain it better.
It is not as difficult to do as it is to right and is very effective. I have never met anyone who can escape from it.
Sharon

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#94207 - 08/17/03 08:38 AM Re: Strangles and Chokes
judderman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 1400
Loc: UK
The gull wing sounds very similar to what I know as a scarf hold.

I don't know any escapes, but I've guessed at one.

If applied as above, use your left hand to pull the attackers elbow downwards, this (hopefully) should allow you to pull your right arm down. This should remove the pressure from around the vessels in your neck. (the next bit is a bit iffy)

Dependant on the flexability in your shoulder, curl your right arm around your attackers face, chin, nose ~ anything ~ that will cause a degree of pain, or even apply your own choke, and lossen the grip further. From here either pull down with both arms to release the grip or twist left, so you are now in a guillotine choke, which I think is a little easier to escape.

You could try elbow strikes to the back of the head/neck ~ but it probably wouldn't do much.

The problem with these is they can require a degree of strength. Also if you are not quick enough or effective enough, instead of encouraging your attacker to loosen their grip, they may try harder to force the choke.

This is just my guess, nothing else.

Budo.

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#94208 - 08/17/03 08:43 AM Re: Strangles and Chokes
judderman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 1400
Loc: UK
Also the thumb lock.

My favourite of locks!!!

I find that to ensure the base of the thumb (where the thumb meets the wrist) is "blocked" before shoving the tip of the thumb toward the base (folded in).

I have never have this fail and the results are quite impressive. To be more effective, only apply the lock for a second, or pulse it. Too much and the area goes numb.

Budo.

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#94209 - 08/17/03 04:30 PM Re: Strangles and Chokes
Yoseikan Student Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/02/03
Posts: 1166
Loc: UK
Chen, how do you define blocking? To me it is a concept where my opponent attacks me, I read it and then react to the attack in a way that stops it. A barrier like defence. This concept in my opinion is flawed.

Now if you say that when you use the term blocking, you mean attacking an attack, or recieving an attack, or manipulating an attack, then I can understand the merit in that. However to stop an attack with a 'block' is very difficult, in sparring I see people parry and move, but never block in the way that they do in line work. The reason in my opinion is that if they try to collect attacks with large blocking movements, they end up getting hit, alot. Why don't classical MA fight each other as they fight the air? i.e. using blocks and stances? because if they did they would get hurt.



[This message has been edited by Yoseikan Student (edited 08-17-2003).]

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#94210 - 08/17/03 04:49 PM Re: Strangles and Chokes
Raven Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/13/03
Posts: 549
Loc: Sin City
i don't know if anybody else posted this already i was too lazy to read all the posts but a simple thing you can if the person is in front of you and if their ears are in arms reach. I don't know how to describe it but you know when you splash water on your face...do u know how you 'curve' you hands, well you do this except you don't hold your hands together. you just with you hands `cupped` you slapped their ears..i can't explaind it..basically when you slam your `cupped` hands on their ears it stuns them extremely that'll let go of you...i have no idea how it works but you should try it one someone you don't like...do it not to soft but no to hard either and you'll see what happens..if u do it right.

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