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#9289 - 07/28/03 07:07 PM Re: self defense
MrVigerous Offline
Former Administrator

Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 2498
Loc: UK
Ender

You clearly know the likely opponents in your area and their capabilities better than I do. You must of course train and operate in the manner that you believe best serves your self protection. I agree that in certain circumstances maiming and indeed killing strikes may be both rerquired and justified. My only concern is the very high level of difficulty required to stop and opponent cold with some of these techniques as compared to the much more mundane punch
on the jaw. If I ever come up against a person who looks at me and grins after ive just bounced my best right hook off of their jaw, I shall certainly consider retiring from the MAs - if indeed I survive the subsequent arse kicking [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG]

Regds
Mr V

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#9290 - 07/28/03 10:15 PM Re: self defense
ninja-raiden Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 03/13/03
Posts: 922
Because of the vigerous weight training and boxing I do, I understand the power behind a jaw punch. I would not use it if in a situation where someone is throwing strikes, but it'd be perfect for the situation described.

"Ninja i hope this doesn't offend but rather than risking a head but that in my opinion means you to sacrafice speed for power, why not try to break their nose with a punch or a palm heel? It may not have the same power but its so much faster than a head butt that could be telegraphed."

Because if performed well, a good headbutt would not only do the job, but also have the element of surprise that a punch or palm heel to the nose wouldn't have.

Of course though, I would use common sense before self defense. Depending on the attacker's size and energy level, I would try to just submission him with some basic hapkido defenses.

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#9291 - 07/30/03 04:58 AM Re: self defense
kempo_jujitsu Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 1914
Loc: illinois, usa
kyusho jutsu
there are two very useful pressure points on the jaw on both sides so thats four.(there are more actually but...)
a light strike at the correct angle on any one of them will make the opponent dizzy at the least, in many cases they will fall unconcious especially since you will be hitting them pretty hard.
what you do from there is up to you...so i would agree a punch to the jaw can do wonders, there are many many other targets on every part of the body, but i would agree "head shots" are the easiest, quickest, and require the least amount of thought on your part in a stressful situation, its a common target, and a natural response.
head shots usually work better too, be it the jaw, temple, or eyes...doesnt matter just hit em.
if you DO have time to see it coming and think about the technique...then i might do something else..but if its somewhat sudden(which it probably will be) a good ol fashioned knuckle sandwich work about every time.
now you will all say what if you dont hit that pressure point....well if you miss that point you still crack them in the jaw...but if you just go for the jaw in general youll never hit the pointat the correct angle. (thats why we PRACTICE)

but in general, i would say it dont matter much...JUST HIT EM!!!!! im all about pre-emptive strikes, if you can tell someone is gonna attack you..why wait...just knock the crap out of em and go home safe.

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#9292 - 07/30/03 05:04 AM Re: self defense
kempo_jujitsu Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 1914
Loc: illinois, usa
....and if you get the ko with the pressure points....the opponent will be no worse for the wear...he will wake up in about 20 minutes, nauseated and with a terrible headache...but not injured, and certainly not dead. (hope he doesnt crack his skull on the way down though lol)
so no worries of getting arrested for brutality or murder [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#9293 - 07/30/03 07:41 AM Re: self defense
Ender Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/29/03
Posts: 2253
Loc: Burlington, Ontario, Canada
Mr. V, Kempo_Jujutsu...

You both make very solid points. I have been swayed.

Gotta get me a heavier bag though!

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#9294 - 07/30/03 09:48 AM Re: self defense
MAGon Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/22/03
Posts: 1737
Loc: Miami, Fl.
Mr. V, IMHO, you are right on! Given the scenario in the thread, I'd generally react, no, more correctly, TRY to react (The "Fog of War", the "Fog of War"!!!) as you recommend. My only qualifier would be that, if at all possible, my first blow would be to the nose, followed by as many as I could get off to the jaw. I like the disorienting effect the shock of the blow combined with the sharp pain and blurred vision brought on by tearing has. But if this isn't possible... THE JAW!!!
Sorry, Ender, but I believe Mr. V is also right in that substituting a rib shot for one to the jaw is a poor trade. I have several times been on both ends (Striker and strikee) of broken ribs. As Mr. V said, it was only AFTER the encounter, when the adrenaline wore off, that the effect on the ribs was felt.

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#9295 - 07/30/03 09:58 AM Re: self defense
Anonymous
Unregistered


I have to agree on the rib thing too.
I once had two broken ribs and a cracked sternum in a competition (not deliberatte, I went in the same time as my opponent). I knew I had been hit, but won that fight and two more.
I didn't realise anything was broken until several days later.

On the other hand, I have been knocked out by one hit to the jaw on two occasions. Nothing was broken or even dislocated, but it did stop me!
Sharon

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#9296 - 07/30/03 10:03 AM Re: self defense
Fisherman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/16/03
Posts: 1656
Loc: Colorado, USA
It was posted above to "never rely on one technique". This is a great statement!
I would try and set the attacker up so I could provide an opening where I could get off an efficient attack. Where the opening is presented is where I would aim my strike, hopefully getting a KO from this strike. If the attacker is not KO'd but is stunned from the blow, this is where you move in a THROW! Toss that b@st@rd on his head. Throws can be very disruptive to an attackers intention.

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#9297 - 07/30/03 04:46 PM Re: self defense
Big Bear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/15/03
Posts: 1068
Loc: Northern Ireland
Great replies folks. Cheers and keep them coming!!!

Big Bear

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#9298 - 07/30/03 05:12 PM Re: self defense
madhag Offline
Member

Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 150
Loc: Seattle, WA
here's my formulated response to the given scenario:
1) take a deep breath to subside my nervousness
2) start singing the national anthem
3) forget a strike to the jaw or headbutt- reach out with my two hands, grab his ears, pull his head down fast with my knee coming up to meet his face. Smash. repeat.
4) klingon death grip
5) finish my singing
6) repeat from step 1 and rinse

Disclaimer: In reality, training hard and practice are within my control at this point. The above instructions may be modified or deleted at my discretion, at any time, in accordance to actual scenario. No animals were injured or killed.

[This message has been edited by madhag (edited 07-30-2003).]

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