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#92802 - 04/09/03 01:28 PM Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
Anonymous
Unregistered


As promised on a previous thread, I have spoken to my policeman student about the carrying of kubatons.
It turns out that Khayman and I were both misinformed. They are neither legal even if on a key ring nor is this a "grey area".
Apparently, the law is very specific on this and kubaton are in the same category as nunchukkas; fine if being carried to and from the dojo for training purposes but an offence if carried at any other time.
Just thought I would pass it on.
Sharon

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#92803 - 04/09/03 01:42 PM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
Khayman Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 724
Loc: Wiltshire, UK
I knew they were are illegal from my days in the police. The grey area is if the police officer knows what it is, many would not. I've even seem kubotan pens made of plastic. The law is the same in the UK for most martial arts weapons, they can be carried to and from a place of practice, they must be carried via a secure means such as a locked bag, so they cannot be accessed easily and you must return straight home after training no detours. This includes stopping off to a bar etc.

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#92804 - 04/09/03 02:13 PM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
There are certain areas of the U.S. that have similar laws regarding carrying weapons to and from the dojo.

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#92805 - 04/09/03 04:44 PM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
MrVigerous Offline
Former Administrator

Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 2498
Loc: UK
Just to clear up the law in the UK, the Prevention of Crime Act 1953 Section 1 provides that:

"Any person who without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, the proof whereof shall lie on him, has with him in any public place any offensive weapon shall be guilty of an offence."

Section 1(4) of the act defines an offensive weapon as:

"...any article made or adapted for use for causing injury to the person or intended by the person having it with him for such use by him or by some other person."

If this catch all legislation didn't cover it (which in my view it does),the kubotan is specificaly listed in the Criminal Justice Act 1988 (Offensive Weapons) Order 1988 as a proscribed item.

In short its a proscribed item unless you can show that in the circumstances it is not. I think most police officers nowdays would recognise a kubotan and realise that its primary function is not for keeping your keys together.

Regds
Mr V

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#92806 - 04/09/03 07:08 PM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
Jamoni Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/17/03
Posts: 1514
Loc: St. Louis, MO, USA
A friend uses a length of deer antler, (with or without a perpendicular spike), attached to a key ring. "I just really like deer, officer!"

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#92807 - 04/10/03 07:41 AM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
MrVigerous Offline
Former Administrator

Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 2498
Loc: UK
That's the point really isn't it. The essence of the kubotan is more HOW you use it than WHAT it is. On this basis, a nice thick pen is just as usueful. Another legitimate item is a tube of hardwood with the ends rounded off. Looks fairly innocuous, doesn't have a point on it, made of wood not metal - far easier to pass off as "oh just a bit of wood I had in my pocket after some DIY" That being said, in reference to my previous post on the law, even a toothrush is an offensive weapon if you use intend to use it as such. Obviously proving this is virtualy impossible in most cases and so arguably the "improvised" kubotan can circumvent current legislation as long as you say the right thing if challenged. Not that i'm advocating anything like that of course....

Regds
Mr V

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#92808 - 04/10/03 08:02 AM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Of course not Mr.V. Who would recommend such a dispicable act? Certainly not I [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#92809 - 04/10/03 08:58 AM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
mark Offline
sword of magnamity

Registered: 03/04/03
Posts: 1284
Loc: uk
a steel parker type pen works wonders as a kubatan.

And my personal fav, a mini maglite.

"They dont like it up`em Captain Manwaring"!!

Mark

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#92810 - 04/10/03 02:09 PM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
MrVigerous Offline
Former Administrator

Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 2498
Loc: UK
Yes a mini-maglite! My personal fav. Well actualy my personal fav is one of the huge maglites with concrete in it...erm "cough" well, hmm....

Regds
Mr V

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#92811 - 04/10/03 04:35 PM Re: Kubaton/Ya Wara Bo and law in UK
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
LOL!! I like to use a roll of quarters. You are never broke and the impact with one of these gripped tightly in the fist is great. And afterwards you can go get a burger and stiff drink to calm down. [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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