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#85985 - 05/10/04 02:20 PM What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Listen dude, you have to get a grip on it. Just because you haven't learnt how to channel your ki into a useable force, that doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. Ever heard of Qi Gong masters who can throw people across rooms without touching them? Using a ki blast. That is what it is. And this is the engery arts forum, and thus talking about a verified energy art, i.e. cryokinesis, is perfectly acceptable.

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#85986 - 05/10/04 02:22 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Oh, and btw mate, you've got ur sig wrong. You've spelt art wrong.

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#85987 - 05/10/04 02:34 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
creative Offline
Member

Registered: 04/26/04
Posts: 401
Loc: UK
[QUOTE]Originally posted by icemonkey:
Listen dude, you have to get a grip on it. Just because you haven't learnt how to channel your ki into a useable force, that doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. Ever heard of Qi Gong masters who can throw people across rooms without touching them? Using a ki blast. That is what it is. And this is the engery arts forum, and thus talking about a verified energy art, i.e. cryokinesis, is perfectly acceptable.[/QUOTE]

ive heard of these things too. But never seen them. I dont think anyone minds you saying anything so long as you can put some real support behind it.In fact most would love for there to be support behind some of the things that are said to be true.

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#85988 - 05/10/04 03:25 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
still wadowoman Offline
Improved beefier techno-prat

Registered: 04/10/04
Posts: 3420
Loc: Residence:UK- Heart:Md, USA
ice monkey, who are you addressing?
Sharon

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#85989 - 05/10/04 03:44 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Ozmo Offline
Member

Registered: 12/22/03
Posts: 142
Loc: Kuopio, Finland
This forum is for the serious discussion of topics regarding the so called "internal" martial arts, not some fictional mumbo-jumbo that even a ten year old should be able to prove not to exist. We get a lot of people who have trouble separating fact/fiction and as you may, or may not have noticed by now, most people here, including our venerated moderator are getting pretty tired of people posting the kind of stuff you do.

Cryokinesis isn't a word and chi-blasts have been thoroughly discussed and disproven.

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#85990 - 05/10/04 04:25 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
Well dude...

I am the moderator of this and the pressure points forum. I am sick and tired of kids getting on this forum rattling on about chi blasts, kenesises and other DBZ ignorance that is being posted here.

You CANT do a chi blast, neither can any one else. Go and study with a real internal martial arts master and calm down.

Kempoman
Moderator - Energy Arts
FightingArts.com
P.S.

Time to tone the posts down.

[This message has been edited by Kempoman (edited 05-10-2004).]

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#85991 - 05/10/04 05:50 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
nekogami13 V2.0 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/10/04
Posts: 2643
Loc: Texas, USA
Legend, myths are numerous.
There are many claims,from Osensei to insert name here, of being able to affect/knockout/throw people without touching them-none of them are ever proveable or seem to work on anyone except their own students.
Cryokinesis,telepathy,pyrokinesis,blah, blah, blah have never been proven. Everyone who claims they can do it always fails or refuses to be tested,usualy under some lame excuse.

The only thing I have observed about ki/chi powers is certain people use the claims of possessing those powers to exploit gullible, naive or mentaly unstable people.

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#85992 - 05/10/04 09:44 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Rimrag Offline
Member

Registered: 06/12/04
Posts: 28
Loc: Phila. Pa. USA
Well, I don't think I am "mentally unstable"
but I certainly DO believe in the power of KI to overcome martially and heal medically. I have MYSELF overcome half a lifetime of medical probs via KI to the shock and dismay of my city's healing "professionals" who are upset that they cannot push their hypertension pills and toxic nostrums. Again, I do NOT advocate that you defy your doctor but just do WHAT THEY CANNOT via KI!

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#85993 - 05/10/04 10:15 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
nekogami13 V2.0 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/10/04
Posts: 2643
Loc: Texas, USA
Rimrag, do you claim to be able to knock people out from several feet away, read minds, levitate, shoot ki balls at people?
Have you set up a website selling books, video tapes showing others how to do this?
Do you believe you can perform telekinesis, cryokinesis, pyrokinesis, telepathy?

No? Then you are probably right, you are not mentaly unstable or a conman.

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#85994 - 05/12/04 06:27 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Fisherman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/16/03
Posts: 1656
Loc: Colorado, USA
The constant argument is...
"There is no proof of chi, but we know it exists".
I actually agree with this, however, not to the gross level that some of the ignorant, inexperienced, cartoon watching morons post on this forum.
Please, please please - read a friggin book. Preferably by a well known author, not just some idiot kid who makes a web site containing information from every episode of a cartoon he has watched.
This is why a lot of the time the more knowlegeable people on this forum choose not to answer questions. Because the questions asked shouldn't even need an answer. If you have seen someone shoot a ki ball and they have not been drawn by an illustrator please let us know. In the mean time please educate yourself in REALITY!!!!

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#85995 - 05/13/04 05:14 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Ice monkey is f-in evil!!

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#85996 - 05/13/04 05:15 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


but then again, my name is Gokai, which means 'misunderstanding', so don't believe a word I say.

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#85997 - 05/13/04 05:18 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Kempo, I appologise for being tetchy, but I have read these forums a bit and I just think that you guys may be being a bit closed-minded to the existance of (as you put it) insert-your-favorite-here-kinesis. There is always the possibilty of something existing, and I don't see why someone should be called stupid or whatever for expressing that belief.
For example, if this was a Christian forum and I started citing Hindu beliefs and was slammed for it, the it would be a situation of religious intolerance (although admittedly its a bit stupid to talk about another religion on a Christian site...)
However, I am not a little kid who watches too many cartoons. I do realise that most of the things you read on the net are a big smell pile of bull, but that doesn't discount the possibility of some of it being true. Perhaps people (including me) misunderstand the use of ki/chi/whatever. Perhaps those people are merely using a different area of ki's power. We don't know. You don't know. ad thus you should at least allow the rational discussion of such matters.

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#85998 - 05/13/04 08:58 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
[QUOTE] We don't know. You don't know. ad thus you should at least allow the rational discussion of such matters[/QUOTE]

Never a problem with a rational discussion of any topic but extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

Kempoman
Moderator - Energy Arts
FightingArts.com

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#85999 - 05/13/04 09:38 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
Icemonkey
"In fact, when ever I make a ki ball, it is cold, as opposed to the tingly, push/pull effect most people report."

"Personally, I feel a kind of coldness between my hands, with the occasional pins and needles type of tingle."

Could you explain which one it is? Do feel a tingling sinsation or not?

The problem with being open minded about any kind of kenesis is there is nothing what so ever to back it up. Chi/ki is a different story. I believe in some of the claims of people involving chi but am skepticle of most. I believe it is possible to remedy minor problems with chi training but doubt very seriously it could do anything for more serious health problems like cancer. I believe knockouts can result from pressurepoints and energy worrk but not to the extent of a no touch knockout. There are a lot of things we can't explain but are possible. Everyone i've seen who claimed any kind of kenesis was a con artist, and i've seen a lot, in person not on tv or the net.

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#86000 - 05/13/04 10:49 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Could you explain which one it is? Do feel a tingling sinsation or not?

I'm sorry, my mistake! I wasn't really clear. Apparently, most people have a constant tingling feeling when they create a ki ball, but I feel occasionaly tingles on my fingers. Just little ones and spread apart. The cold thing is what is strange for me, I think.

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#86001 - 05/13/04 10:50 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


imho I think it's all to do with what the individual feels. There's no set way to do anything, no teacher can teach it, only guide you down a certain path. If someone can fire blasts, great, they're spesssial [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG] , but if they can't, well it's their body.
"Being mortal is what makes the impossible, possible."

btw me and Ice monkey are buddys, so I'm likely to back him up or slate him - heavily.

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#86002 - 05/13/04 11:45 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


[QUOTE]Originally posted by icemonkey:
Kempo, I appologise for being tetchy, but I have read these forums a bit and I just think that you guys may be being a bit closed-minded to the existance of (as you put it) insert-your-favorite-here-kinesis. There is always the possibilty of something existing, and I don't see why someone should be called stupid or whatever for expressing that belief.

Right on. It doesn't really matter who believes and who doesn't. He has a right to promote his oppinion.

And to you Kempoman, I don't think it is quite fair for you to lock threads and stuff just because you don't share their views on it. I don't mean any offense by it but I just had to tell you what I thought.

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#86003 - 05/13/04 11:58 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
nekogami13 V2.0 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/10/04
Posts: 2643
Loc: Texas, USA
If you disagree with the sane people grounded in reality who do not allow themselves to be mislead or are not delusional, mentaly unstable-therefore not believing in the various "kinesis'"-LEAVE! stop posting here-go find a DBZ site or site devoted to becoming a Jedi knight.

Kempoman is the moderator of the enrgy arts section-which means he does have the right to delete,lock, modify postings under this section. If you don't like his locking of the inane, puerile, delusional crap you have been posting-again, LEAVE!

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#86004 - 05/13/04 12:18 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
[QUOTE]Originally posted by kimono5:
And to you Kempoman, I don't think it is quite fair for you to lock threads and stuff just because you don't share their views on it. I don't mean any offense by it but I just had to tell you what I thought.[/QUOTE]

kimono5

Your opinion is valuable thank you for sharing it in reasonable manner. However, this is a site for serious martial artists and this website and forum (especially the Energy Arts section) have certain goals. I will not allow this place to become a joke from people posting silly things. If someone posts a reasonable post about a subject that I don't believe in it will not be locked. My opinon is not important, the contents of the posts are. I dont mind A thread about 'chi blasts' that contains a rational discussion. What I will not allow is posts that begin with a extraordinary statement, a request for proof and then a response to that request for proof that ignores the request for evidence. That is not debate and it will not help anyone.

On a side note there has been absoultely no proof or evidence offered to support the existance of chi balls, chi blasts, kenesises, levitation or other wild claims on this forum. No one has been able to produce the effects that they claim in a controlled situation/experiment. So the onus is on those who make wild claims to back them up with evidence. Now, that said I agree that skeptics tend to be a little dismissive (usually from having to debunk the same claims over and over and over with no offer of evidence to support the wild claim) and we can work on the tone of the posts in the future. I really want to make this forum a place for serious discussion. I am open to the possibility that I am incorrect, but I have not been shown to be as of this point in time.

I will offer my challenge again. If you can move me with your chi, hit me with a jing blast or in some way stop (non physical) me from pouring a glass of water on your head I will pay you $1,000.00 US.

I have had no takers. There is a larger prize ($1,000,000.00 US) offered by the JREF (James Randi Educational Foundation - www.randi.org) for anyone to prove the existance of any paranormal abilites. No one has even passed the prelimanary tests to date.

If we can all agree to have serious rational discussion on these subjects I am open to letting a couple of theads go ahead.

But as neko said there are always other sites that will allow any kind of drivel you would like to post.

Kempoman
Moderator - Energy Arts
FightingArts.com



[This message has been edited by Kempoman (edited 05-13-2004).]

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#86005 - 05/14/04 05:08 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Yo Scott.

I rise to your challenge!!

Allow me to demonstrate an experiment I performed earlier!!!

(assistant with glass of water holds water above my head.)
Ka...
me...
ha...
me...
(proceeds to tip cup over my head)
HAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!


...
....
...
...

Oh crap now I'm all wet.

Well It's not really possible then is it.
Unless you dodge out of the way that is.

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#86006 - 05/15/04 09:19 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
nenipp Offline
Veteran

Registered: 04/13/04
Posts: 1205
kempoman, you wrote:
"I will pay you $1,000.00 US."
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't US stand for united states and if my memory serves me, there are only 52 of them, so you can't possibly pay me one thousand and therefore I will not let you try the waterthingy on me )

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#86007 - 05/15/04 10:10 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


You're a fu----g spastic. You really are. Did you not notice the $????? DOLLAR. D-O-L-L-A-R.

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#86008 - 05/15/04 04:23 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
waas13 Offline
Member

Registered: 04/06/04
Posts: 82
Loc: Kelowna, B.C.,Canada
Hold on hasn't it been proven that by activating more percent of our brains telekenetics are attainable?(trust me i dont think anyone can do it now)
Correct me if im wrong but dont we only use 10-25% of our brains?!
replies?,Ty [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]

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#86009 - 05/15/04 04:32 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Reiki Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/30/02
Posts: 3400
Loc: MiddleEarth
Just as a note, I dont know why icemonkey feels his ki as cold, sometimes I notice when treating other ppl that I get a cold or painful feeling. I treated one lady with cancer and experienced a lot of pain up my arms!

Generally I feel the ki flowing from the healing centres of my hands - in the palms, also the feet. I can also feel it coming in through the crown chakra at times, and can often "hear" it. Mostly I feel ki as warmth and tingling, buzzing sensations.

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#86010 - 05/16/04 09:54 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
nenipp Offline
Veteran

Registered: 04/13/04
Posts: 1205
S G,
I realise that you are of course completely right and it is dollars, not states he is offering.
Now, realising this I naturally reconsidered the challenge...
...but...
...I feel that kempoman is a powerful fighter with a very strong "one point" so I'm afraid I can't be sure to do the trick without seriously harming him, so the answer must still be no )

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#86011 - 05/16/04 11:12 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
The i'll conduct the test with you. Give me the glass of water and try to stop me with out touching me. Scott can watch. It will be up to him if he still wants to pay yout the money. Even though i don't think there will be any payout for this test. I don't think it will work.

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#86012 - 05/16/04 11:26 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
[QUOTE]Originally posted by waas13:
Hold on hasn't it been proven that by activating more percent of our brains telekenetics are attainable?(trust me i dont think anyone can do it now)
Correct me if im wrong but dont we only use 10-25% of our brains?!
replies?,Ty [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif[/IMG]
[/QUOTE]

Yes we only use 10% of our brain. It hasn't been proven that activating any more of our brain will give us any special powers. It is just a theory. The only way to prove this theory is to actually do it. Doctors have been able to stimulate different part of the brain but haven't given anyone the ability to use more than 10%. No one has ever proven they can levetate, read minds or move things with there mind.

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#86013 - 05/17/04 07:39 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


[QUOTE]Originally posted by nekogami13 V2.0:
If you disagree with the sane people grounded in reality who do not allow themselves to be mislead or are not delusional, mentaly unstable-therefore not believing in the various "kinesis'"-LEAVE! stop posting here-go find a DBZ site or site devoted to becoming a Jedi knight.

Kempoman is the moderator of the enrgy arts section-which means he does have the right to delete,lock, modify postings under this section. If you don't like his locking of the inane, puerile, delusional crap you have been posting-again, LEAVE!
[/QUOTE]

My friend, if you are calling me mentaly unstable then it must be from personal experience, from that little insulting and pointless rant. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But please, keep yours to yourself, as if is quite offensive, and shouldn't be seen in public.

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#86014 - 05/17/04 07:41 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


[QUOTE]Originally posted by laf7773:
No one has ever proven they can levetate, read minds or move things with there mind.

[/QUOTE]

At the risk of being flamed again for being an open-minded person, might I refer you to Uri Geller? I know there is no empirical proof for his powere, but there is no proof against either. And I think that in this situation, current science has failed to disprove him.

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#86015 - 05/17/04 07:43 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Ki! Ki! KI KI KI!!! I'm a monkey...

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#86016 - 05/17/04 08:50 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
[QUOTE]Originally posted by icemonkey:
At the risk of being flamed again for being an open-minded person, might I refer you to Uri Geller? I know there is no empirical proof for his powere, but there is no proof against either. And I think that in this situation, current science has failed to disprove him.[/QUOTE]

Uri Gellar has been thoroughly debunked and proven to be a fraud by James 'Amazing' Randi.

PS

I learned to bend metal by watching videos of Uri. He is a magician/mentalist/cheat nothing more.

Scott

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#86017 - 05/17/04 09:30 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
There is a difference in having an open mind and having a blind eye to reality.

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#86018 - 05/17/04 10:31 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Kempo, be careful before slagging off Uri, he's a good friend of Dan (ice monkey).

Just so you know.

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#86019 - 05/17/04 11:33 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Son Gokai:
Kempo, be careful before slagging off Uri, he's a good friend of Dan (ice monkey).

Just so you know.
[/QUOTE]

Son Gokai,

I am not slagging off on anyone. Truth is truth. Uri uses standard mentalism techniques to perfom his bits of 'psychic' experiments. This I have no problem with (as I do the same in my acts),
but it is when those skills are passed of as evidence of or actual psychic powers that I have a problem. People can (and are) led astray by these types (usually with large sums of money missing from their bank account)
and by others who claim to talk to the dead. The gullible types make life decisions based on the misinformation that is given out by these pseudo-psychics and that is never a good thing.

Scott

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#86020 - 05/17/04 12:31 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Tom2199 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 834
Loc: England
what are these mentalism techniques exactly? and how are they performed
please elaborate

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#86021 - 05/17/04 12:40 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
Tom2199,

I can't or rather won't divulge 'secrets of magic' on this or any other public message board. If you are interested you may get a book called "13 Steps to Mentalism" by Corrinda. This is a very good book on mentalism as it covers most of the effects and gimmicks used by us.

Metal bending videos are available over the web or at your local magic shop. Gellar is convincing to the untrained eye, to the trained eye he is doing an effect.

Thanks,
Scott

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#86022 - 05/17/04 12:42 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Kemps (can I say that?) (Are you sure it shouldn't be 'hemp'...? Just a thought... [IMG]http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif[/IMG] )

Ok, my apologies about the accusation.

But according to ice monkey, there are some things he actually can do which are for real. I haven't seen them myself, but I think Dan is right...

Heheh!

I HAVE A LATIN EXAM TOMORROW!!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
SOMEONE HELP ME!!! GCSE LATIN IS SCARY!!!!

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#86023 - 05/17/04 12:53 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Kempoman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/15/00
Posts: 1484
Loc: Houston, TX
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Son Gokai:
But according to ice monkey, there are some things he actually can do which are for real. I haven't seen them myself, but I think Dan is right...
[/QUOTE]

Yes, and according to my son I can actually pull a quarter out of his ear! Look, magic is magic. It is designed to fool you. Before I became a magician/mentalist/hypnotist I thought David Copperfield was really really real. The fact was that my belief did not make it so. I would love this invisible force stuff to be real but at this
point

I remain...Unconvinced.

Scott (who wished more people knew how to think critically)

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#86024 - 05/17/04 01:09 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


ok.... tell me this one. How can you read someone's mind? If you think a colour do your eyes turn that colour? If you think a number do your pupils undergo mitosis?
That's what mystifies me.

I don't care about the spoons, it's just a waste of silverware....

My email is bull99@kingswood.bath.sch.uk - save space on the forum.

Forum = market place

Forum, fori, neuter noun 2

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#86025 - 05/17/04 01:11 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
If you want to be open minded, then be open minded. Don't be close minded to reality. It's ok to be open minded but you still need to ask questions, request proof and look for proof from others outside of those who are making the claims. Don't you think if someone could actually levitate that everyone would know about it? Don't you think the military would want to know the secret for there trrops? Do you realy think YOU would be witness to the proof of levitation but no one else in the media or military would be all over it? Be open minded with a RATIONAL mind.

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#86026 - 05/17/04 01:12 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


being mortal is what makes the impossible possible

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#86027 - 05/17/04 08:48 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
sophia Offline
Member

Registered: 09/27/03
Posts: 143
Loc: toronto
laf777, 'we only use 10% of our brain', where did you get this information. You have been grossly missinformed. Check out any university's department of neuroscience online resources. I do not know where the 10% figure came from but it simpl is not true.

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#86028 - 05/17/04 11:08 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
laf7773 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 4064
Loc: Limbo
Please tell us what the real percentage is. The fact is we use 100% of our brain but in comparison to what is believed of the potential of the brain we are believed to only use about 10% of it's potential. There was no point in going off on another tangent about how much of a percentage of our brain we use. I was just trying to flow with his line of thought to get my point accross. But if you want to bicker about semantics at least post some information. Don't just hit and run.

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#86029 - 05/18/04 07:37 AM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


On the Uri Gellar thing, I would have to disagree with you, Scott. I have been to his house many times (he's a friend of my Dad), and what he does isn't a magic trick. He's not that kind of person. No matter what you see on the tv or internet or whatever, Uri's actually a pretty sound bloke who just gets a bit odd on telly and gets a lot of schtick he doesn't deserve.
A few examples of things I have seen him do. If you have a rational, provable way to do it, please let me know.

1. Making radish seeds grow in his hand. And it wasn't just him who did it. I had one in my hand, as did my Dad and a friend of mine, and only his and mine grew. We had bought the seeds before hand, before you say anything about that.
2. Making my watch work. It had been dead for over a year, and I don't know if it was battery or what, but he took it in his hand, did the whole "Work!" thing, and it did.
3. Making a crystal very hot just by holding it. As far as I'm aware, this is scintificly impossible, but this crystal was hot enough to start ice melting on contact.

There are many more stories I could tell you that have happened when he's around, but I don't have all day to write it...

Dan
Icemonkey

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#86030 - 05/18/04 12:57 PM Re: What the hell is your problem?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Or use kamehameha.

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