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#83130 - 05/06/05 09:48 PM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: someotherguy]
Ace Offline
Member

Registered: 05/04/05
Posts: 101
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
yeh.... but are you saying its impossible to learn untill you have sufficient self control? thats like saying you cant learn how do do a triple spin flying bicycle kick untill you have the proper control of your body. that doesnt change the fact that you still need to have a basic understanding of what the fudementals are of the technique....

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#83131 - 05/06/05 11:03 PM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: Gawl]
BaguaMonk Offline
Member

Registered: 12/18/04
Posts: 404
Loc: DALLAS TX BABY
Quote:

This is why formalized systems always fail in incorporating this "technique" because it is not really a technique. This kind of awareness and sensitivtiy comes from intrinsic energy, if you formalize it and are able to do it quite well, it will probably not be very effective, even if you send someone flying back, that means NOTHING.People ask "how do you do it" and they want it in specifics, there is no way to do this, the only way to do this is by practicing internal arts, it is a way your body moves and learns that you are able to acquire this skill. The reason why is because there are countless ways for the body to generate this power, I will summarize some for you guys.

In fact, true fa jing shouldn't send them flying back, it should kill them or create an internal injury. In the case of Shaolin arts with these principles, it would break or destroy external bones, or shock the organs by rocking the physical structure.

Here is some a quick summary of some of the bases of some systems.

Taiji: by relaxing and realization that power comes from the whole body, initiated by the mind, one is able to easily have perfect body mechanics, added with concentrated mental intention to hit a specific target. Sensitivity and intrinsic training allow you to instantly sense ANY opening ANYWHERE in the body by either constant contact or quick observation. From ANY position immediately upon which the opening is seen/detected, your body explodes into your exposed opening. Wether this be your shoulder, elbow, knee, head, arm, fist, wrist etc. an entire shockwave will be sent through your body, from the the dan tien (hara) originating from the immediate signal from your mind, all the way down into the ground, back up into the waist, through the arms, into the hands (or whatever your striking with). A true master can create internal injuries even with just his shoulder. All of this in a split second of silk reeling energy.

Taijis is like a bamboo swaying in the wind, it absorbs only as much as it is given, and springs back both the combined force of the opponent and user.

Xingyi: Initiated the same way that taiji (from mind and dan tien), the back leg springs from the ground, the front leg stops and absorbs the momentum, in which the energy comes back up from the ground all the way to the waist and into the fist (or whatever your strikin with). Since countering and attacking are immediately linked together, you are using the opponents momentum (usually your grabbing him pulling him toward you) moving forward, as well as your momentum movign forward, combined with internal concentrated energy and full body power. Very deadly.

Bagua: Bagua teaches you how to also loosen and strengthen your body. From the conditioning (forms) your body becomes loose, and strengthen (chi) in the ligaments of your body. Bagua undulates, twists, compresses, and explodes. It is like an Iron sheet of metal being twisted until it gets white hot in the middle, and explodes. The body mechanics and footwork add to this of course.

Xingyi uses alot of leg compression, and expansaion. In more of a linear way, while Bagua does the same but from ankward positions, and angles. Taiji uses both, but the modern methods mostly incorporate pushing or Chin Na. True Taiji uses many, many strikes. They is to be relaxed, the compression is not done by tensing the physical muscles. Conditioning helps greatly, and is almost necessary if you want to discover the full potential. For the most part, all the training is for reaching an opening in your mind, in which then you are able to do the exact same with almost no form, and no movement. Real masters can push people far away, or strike, without barely moving because of this. They ARE moving and their whole body is still striking, but less becomes more.

Plz read this if you can. Thanks.

PS. The main ways are this, upwards, downwards, and straight. You see, once you realize the basics, and your body has a "feel" for it, you NEVER need to think about specifics again, your body AUTOMATICALLY moves and pushes t he way it should be. This is why too much thinking, and over-thinking it will only lead to average results, as opposed to being natural.The punch was not created by a Japanese master, or Bruce Lee. There is no one way to do it.




I keep hearing this "turn the wrist that way, use these knuckles etc." Thinking like this will hardly produce one inch power, and you will be limited to only ONE way of achieving this. A taiji practicioner can generate this power from any angle, position, or body part. Why? Because it is natural, and comes from being completely free and aware as opposed to restricted by constant mental thought. Fa jing, the true name for one inch power, is as natural as simply moving your hand or arm. That is what you want, not something that you have to think or formalize. If you say "this is the one inch punch, here is exactly how to do it" You will only have on way of generating this power, and in a fighting situation, this is not what you want. It is so natural that it can be achieved in almost countless ways.
_________________________
Truth comes from the absolute stillness of the mind...

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#83132 - 05/07/05 05:26 AM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: BaguaMonk]
Ace Offline
Member

Registered: 05/04/05
Posts: 101
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Ohh, and just for the sake of theBruce Lee arguements, i do believe he learnt the wing chun varient of the one inch punch, so in his case it doesnt stem from JKD, but wing chun, his original martial art style...

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#83133 - 05/07/05 02:51 PM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: Ace]
someotherguy Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 69
Quote:

yeh.... but are you saying its impossible to learn until you have sufficient self control?




Correct, you cannot do a good one inch punch until you understand how to generate power in a punch in general. you don't LEARN the 1 inch punch, it comes as a consequence of your correct application of general body mechanics. There is no specific "1 inch punch technique" to learn, in JKD or Wing Chun.

You comparison to some mythical bicycle kick is particularly inappropriate. It is the minimizing of a motion. The 1 inch punch is just an example of the application of the various concepts in Wing Chun

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#83134 - 05/07/05 04:40 PM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: Ace]
BaguaMonk Offline
Member

Registered: 12/18/04
Posts: 404
Loc: DALLAS TX BABY
I do not think Bruce Lee learned from "WC." But it was certainly at the core of his martial experience and what would eventually lead him to discover how to generate this power. What really helped was internal practices, he was obviously known for meditating, and he descrbes wu wei (or the wuji state of mind), as if in no-mindedness, in pretty good detail. He was known to practice internal arts in private, he even demonstrated the entire yang form at least once (he did criticize them alot though). If you look at the video, his whole body shakes. In comparison to an internal stylist, his internal power is actually kind of weak, or maybe just the manifestation of it. Either way until I started learning and understanding arts, it USED to be impressive.

This power can be used to break arms, chin na, etc. For example, once you have somebody twisted or grabbed in Tai ji Chin Na, you use this explosive energy to simply break the arm. It can be used for jumping, shit almost anything, it all comes down to the mind, and how it can lead every ounce of muscular body mechanics, and the natural energies in the body to accomplish one task.
_________________________
Truth comes from the absolute stillness of the mind...

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#83135 - 05/08/05 06:08 AM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: BaguaMonk]
Ace Offline
Member

Registered: 05/04/05
Posts: 101
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Agreed, bruce Lee was renowned for training non stp all day, whether it be shadow boxing while walking down the street, or carrying a dumbell round with him, or whatever else he did... but it was also well known that he dabbled in many types of drugs and was known for using steroids, but still, just small things he would do all day, including walking on the balls of his feet, gave him conditioning many other people wouldnt have, merely cause they dont do enough.

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#83136 - 05/09/05 04:13 PM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: Ace]
BaguaMonk Offline
Member

Registered: 12/18/04
Posts: 404
Loc: DALLAS TX BABY
What you said just brought chills down my spine Ace. I never knew Bruce did that, I do stuff like that, and have, all my life. For example: When I got up stairs I only go up on the VERY edges, on the VERY tips of my feet, and VERY fast. When I see an obstacle, I jump over it elegantly. When I'm on a sidewalk, I balance and walk along the side of it. I'm always in the mood for sparring, and sometimes envision a practicioner who creates openings for me to strike. Whenver I'm alone somewhere, and no one sees me (aka an elevator, waiting, etc.) I always practice Bagua footwork, or move my arms in acoordancee to my waist (simulated blocks) etc. I don't really take dumbells with me or anything like that, but my mind always does that kind of stuff.

Interesting, perhaps that is why I'm such a quick learning in martial arts. I never really though about the positive effects have on me until now, but its always just been kind of for fun. I should look at it in a more "training" approach, and schedule certain things, maybe it will help.
_________________________
Truth comes from the absolute stillness of the mind...

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#83137 - 05/10/05 05:46 AM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: BaguaMonk]
Ace Offline
Member

Registered: 05/04/05
Posts: 101
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
You learn something new everyday, dont you? i also did lots of this untill recently, when i did a complex tear to the lateral side of my minisculis... guess thats what i get for dabbling in martial arts... lol, but yes, it not only increases your alertness and co-ordination/conditioning/mindframe, but helps if youve got a bunch of skin heads looking at you who decide not to give you a group hug because they have just seen you punch a hole through that tree... lol

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#83138 - 05/10/05 09:52 AM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: BaguaMonk]
Neb Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 23
Loc: Tas, Australia
Quote:

I do not think Bruce Lee learned from "WC." But it was certainly at the core of his martial experience




Have u forgotten the JKD was Bruce Lee's OWN style and that he made it from other styles he learnt he was taught just like us... he was just exeptionally good. He made it famous but I doubt he created the technique...
_________________________
run before you fight fight before you injure injure before you maim maim before you kill

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#83139 - 05/10/05 10:17 AM Re: 1 inch punch? [Re: Neb]
Bodiharma Offline
Member

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 40
Bruce Lee created Jeet Kune Do, he studied Wing Chun for a little while, First Form, Second, and the Wooden Dummy, then he moved to the USA.

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