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#431762 - 03/18/11 01:32 PM Overtraining / Recovery
JKDGuy_1985 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/09
Posts: 25
Loc: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Hi

First here's my current workout schedule

Monday
- Bench Press
- Squats
- Shoulder Press
- Triceps Extension
- Push Ups

Tuesday
Off

Wednesday
- Martial Arts (Mostly heavy bag training for 10 rounds)

Thursday
- Deadlift
- Bent Over Rows
- Bicep Curls
- Wrist/Reverse Wrist Curls
- Close Grip Upright Rows

Friday
Off

Saturday
2 Hours of intense indoor tennis with a friend

Sunday
2 Hours of intense indoor tennis in a tennis league.

For my compound lift, i'm mainly using 5 x 5, going for strength. For isolation movement i'm doing 3 x 10.

Lately I find that i'm always tired and more depressed than usual. My performance gains in pretty much all my lift have stalled. My energy level are rather down as well. I think I might be overtraining ?

One thing i'm never sure about, is what is the ideal recovery time for exercises? When I squat, i'm usually sore for 4-5 days, samething in my chest when I bench press. I try to eat a healthy diet, but I do stay away from supplements, trying to keep it "natural". Heard supplements are bad for your kidney ?

How long should I wait between workout sessions? Should I reduce my physical activity ? Please help, I don't know what to do anymore, would really appreciate some input.

Thanks
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Thats what she said...

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#431764 - 03/18/11 06:07 PM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: JKDGuy_1985]
Matakiant Offline
Member

Registered: 02/08/11
Posts: 121
Well I'm not a complete expert when it comes to lifting weights but if I recall right muscles recover in about 1-7 days depending on the severity of tearing in the muscle fibers.

The nervous system can take up to around 2 weeks to recover.

What I would humbly suggest you may try is to take a break from weight lifting for 2 weeks.

Once those 2 weeks are up revise your workout.. If you are lifting your ''maximum'' every work out give every muscle/muscle group 5-10 days rest after the work out.

You should be able to tell once the muscles have recovered they should have regained full range of motion the stiffness, soreness & swelling should be gone and most of all that the muscles strength is slightly better than during the previous work out (if you can't tell then equal is good enough provided all soreness is gone)

When your on your resting period just practice your martial arts, tennis whatever light activity you can think of though you should try to place your weight lifting so you can recover a bit for your tennis.

And of course nutrition, don't just eat like a madman after work outs obviously get your proteins, antioxidants, acids and others but don't go overboard. During recovery our muscles ability to intake carbohydrates is reduced so keep that in mind.

Anyway that's what I suggest you try doing, I'm sure somebody will give you a different suggestion so it's all up to You! I suggest you browse around the net information regarding weight lifting has greatly improved over the years and if you have the patience to read scientific studies, articles and the like You'll gain a lot more knowledge which will ultimately make your work outs more efficient and productive.

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#431769 - 03/19/11 04:00 PM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: JKDGuy_1985]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
What are your actuall goals? are you a martial artist? A tennis player? a bodybuilder? At the moment you seem to be trying to be everything and its no wonder you are overtrained and hitting burnout.

Training 5x5 can work wonders, but you are over-egging the pudding with the amount of exercises you apply it to, and also killing th benefit by sticking in related movements in different rep ranges.

I am happy to sort something out for you, but its going to look a lot different to the above.

I get the sense that tennis is a structured part of your life, but is the 'martial arts' just you working a bag for fun, or do you undertake actual classes in an art?

Bit more info, and decide what you really need from your training, and with that info I will go to work wink
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Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#431770 - 03/19/11 05:04 PM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: Cord]
JKDGuy_1985 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/09
Posts: 25
Loc: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Hey Cord

You're right that i'm trying to be everything and it's not working. Been considering dropping a martial arts to focus on tennis but I have a hard time doing so, but the way things are going now, I can't deal with the exhaustion anymore since it started to affect me not only physically but mentally as well.

I used to take classes in kickboxing many years ago but i've stopped to train on my own, so now i'm just training on my heavy bag/speed bag from time to time for fun and to maintain my ability's.

Guess what I really need from my training is something to maximize power/strength for tennis without bulking up too much (tennis players are usually lean) as I think it's the sport that I want to focus on for at least the next 6 months instead of the martial arts since I play tennis even more often in the summer.

Do you think I could fit both tennis and my strength training routine without being completely exhausted/sore all the time ? I do understand that i'm doing perhaps too many exercises, what would work best for me ?

Thanks Cord, really appreciate your help!
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Thats what she said...

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#431771 - 03/19/11 05:58 PM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: JKDGuy_1985]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Perfect! smile The mot important step is deciding on your goals, and prioritising from there.

You can certainly train to improve your tennis performance, and I think it would be wise to drop the heavy bag work in service towards this goal.

A couple more questions: Do you train in a gym, or at home? and also, is all tennis training purely weekend based?
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#431773 - 03/19/11 09:37 PM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: Cord]
JKDGuy_1985 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/09
Posts: 25
Loc: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
I have my home gym, olympic barbell with weights and a power rack. Will maybe add dumbbells in the future, still not sure on that.

Tennis for now is week-end only, but at the end of april, that might change to once in the week/once in the week-end or something like that.
_________________________
Thats what she said...

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#431774 - 03/20/11 04:45 AM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: JKDGuy_1985]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
OK, no problem smile

We have to cut your volume right back, and MTK is right that as your overtraining has now been lomg term, you do need to take some time off - one full week including tennis. Your symptoms are an injury, so you need to rest and heal.

During your week off, you should aim for a minumum of 10 hrs sleep per night, eat clean, but eat big, and do nothing other than a gentle full body stretching routine every night before bed. Use this stretching time to quiet your mind - think of nothing but the sensation in your muscles.

The routine itself is going to be very basic.

Tuesday:
Squats 5x5
Barbell RollOuts 5x10

Thursday:
Deadlifts 5x5
Bus Drivers 5x10

Weekends: Tennis.

Every day: Stretching before bed. on rest days make it developmental.

That's it.
Remember that 5x5 means that the 5th rep is as explosive as the 1st - you are not trying to fatigue the muscle, you are trying to ingrain an explosive response between nervous system and muscle fibres - big difference.

Links for exercises:
Bus drivers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMGEVo77bHI

The movement originates in the hips and core, not the arms, the arms perpetuate the transfer of the weight, they do not make it happen on their own.

Barbell roll outs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8np24WmTy_E

When you find the kneeling version easy on the 10th rep of the 5th set, its time to progress to this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATYdM_-TW5s&feature=fvst
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#431775 - 03/20/11 08:52 AM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: Cord]
JKDGuy_1985 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/09
Posts: 25
Loc: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Thanks for the tips Cord, really appreciate. That roll outs and bus drivers exercice look pretty cool, never seen those before.

Does 10 hrs sleep per night really make a difference? I usually sleep 8-9 hrs per night right now.
_________________________
Thats what she said...

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#431776 - 03/20/11 09:11 AM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: JKDGuy_1985]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
In your intensive recovery week, yes. In normal training 8-9 will be fine. Right now you need the rest for the body to recover and your brain chemistry to normalise. A week of total rest should be enough, and a big part of that recovery is the sleep and the nutrition.
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#431780 - 03/20/11 06:45 PM Re: Overtraining / Recovery [Re: Cord]
JKDGuy_1985 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/09
Posts: 25
Loc: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Few questions about the program.

What would you recommend for warming up before doing those exercises ? I usually do 1 set of 10 reps at 50% of the load that I will lift as a warm-up, should I keep doing that or do you suggest a different approach ? Also since I already deadlift/squat, when i'll resume my workout in a week, should I resume with the same amount of weight or drop a few pounds ?

One thing I liked to do from time to time in my warm up and cooling down was 1 or 2 rounds of skipping rope, is it okay if I keep doing that ?

Also i've noticed that the exercises i'll be doing will really concentrate on my core/back/legs, why is that you don't recommend doing anything like bench press/shoulder press/bent over rows ? I'll guess it has to do with overtraining, but i'd like to understand why you didn't include them.


Edited by JKDGuy_1985 (03/20/11 06:46 PM)
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Thats what she said...

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