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#431428 - 01/31/11 05:32 AM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: Landus]
alexander10 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 01/22/11
Posts: 6
I am fitness trainer.so this is right that Some bodybuilders feel they need a gram of protein per pound of body weight, depending on the intensity of the training. If you do use a supplement, then it is best during or just after a workout so that the damaged muscles can use that protein for repair.I kam completely agree with this.

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#431526 - 02/14/11 07:08 AM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: bryce14]
Matakiant Offline
Member

Registered: 02/08/11
Posts: 121
Yay for advertisements!

I stand firm by the belief that you DO NOT need protein supplements for your training.

The body can get all of your necessary nutrients from normal plain food, the argument of ''time'' and etc I can get to an extent but most people I know, even those who say they take the supplements, powders, shakes w/e due to time constraints are overdoing it.

1 gram per lb of bodyweight is enough, going over that is feasible in some days with more intense training etc.

More more is not good for your body. Too much protein shakes&powders will do damage to your kidneys, by too much I mean too much daily in grams.

The body can only take about 30-50 grams of protein per meal (dependant on your musclemass and metabolism)

Though studies do show that if you eat only 1-2 large meals per day the amount is increased.

Ehh to stop my ramble you can do protein supplements if you do them right but eating naturally is always better for you.

Personally for me cooking is a nice ''mental oooldown''

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#431529 - 02/14/11 12:43 PM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: Matakiant]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Originally Posted By: Matakiant
I stand firm by the belief that you DO NOT need protein supplements for your training.
The body can get all of your necessary nutrients from normal plain food


Couldnt agree more

Quote:
the argument of ''time'' and etc I can get to an extent but most people I know, even those who say they take the supplements, powders, shakes w/e due to time constraints are overdoing it.


That doesnt really make sense. Are you saying they are overdoing it because they should make time to prep natural food, or are you saying they already get enough natural food without the supplemental protein?

The reason I ask is because a lot of shift workers have ever changing daily life structures in which convenience food plays a part - yes I know, they should be spending their days off prepping and freezing down tupperware containers of meals to take with them to work, but seeing as how we are dealing with reality, not ideals, given the choice between an MRP or a whey shake, and a 3 cheese and bean burrito out of the vending machine, as a long term strategy born of necessity, the supplement is a better option for health and meeting nutritional needs.

Quote:
1 gram per lb of bodyweight is enough, going over that is feasible in some days with more intense training etc.


Protein assimilation is not noticeably affected by intensity of exercise, and current thinking puts 1g per lb bw as excessive. Its 1.5g per kilo lean BW ie, your protein intake is based on living tissue, not total weight including inert stored bodyfat.

Quote:
More more is not good for your body. Too much protein shakes&powders will do damage to your kidneys, by too much I mean too much daily in grams.


Possibly, but not always, and you would have to be having a consistently extreme amount of protein over a long period of time. Its unlikely to happen in reality.

Quote:
Ehh to stop my ramble you can do protein supplements if you do them right but eating naturally is always better for you.

Personally for me cooking is a nice ''mental oooldown''


Again, you are not wrong, but what you have time for in your circumstances, others may not. Sometimes you have to work with what you can, not what is best.
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#431530 - 02/14/11 02:55 PM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: Cord]
Matakiant Offline
Member

Registered: 02/08/11
Posts: 121
What I mean by overdoing is still in terms of grams. And lets be fair here once people start getting into the whole supplement thing they, usually, get in more and more, first with protein then with vitamins then with oils, acids etc... All fine and dandy if done properly but with protein I mostly know people who just consume too much

And a ''long'' time for your kidneys could just be a few years or more dependant on how much someone overconsumes..

And that 1 gram was just a generalisation I made based upon my own body and physical activities.. 1 gram is still a safe border even if you over-think your physical activity, bodybuilders and such go even up to 2.5 or even more, but that is just ridiculous and bad for your health.

And hey now I cook fast! You can eat natural etc with organisation in your life, I'm not saying it's some great goal to go after but I do think it is a lot better than drinking shakes, powders and eating vitamins for your nutrition..

I could go on the subject of numerous studies discrediting both sides of the argument but that's irrelevant really in this day and age it's about your own preference and in the case of wanting natural foods how much you are willing to bother with it.



Edited by Matakiant (02/14/11 02:56 PM)

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#431534 - 02/15/11 09:00 AM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: Matakiant]
underdog Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1270
Loc: Mansfield, MA U.S.A.
What about for females? I've been on and off protein supplement drinks over the course of a lifetime. When I've discussed it with my doctors, the consensus has been to not do them. Kidney damage has been their concern. Then I typically get into the belief system that there is this secret body of knowledge in the gym that the people who research diets and needs just don't know about. That just seems silly to me.

I'm not using any supplements right now. I'm just sticking to the recommendations from the U.S.D.A. for my age gender and gradual weight loss adding 1 oz of meat/beans and writing EVERYTHING down on my weight watchers program. This seems to be working for me in that I feel good, have good work outs and I'm losing weight and getting stronger.
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#431551 - 02/16/11 09:16 AM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: underdog]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
You know, eating well is not that difficult. You need each meal to provide you with sustained release energy, material to maintain/repair muscle tissue, and a broad spectrum of vitamins, minerals and healthy fats, to promote proper hormone production and organ function.
By and large, in broad strokes, thats it.

What complicates things is not new nutritional requirements or secret knowledge, rather it is lifestyles and learned eating habits that no other animal on earth has to deal with. Odd/long working hours, technology increasing sedentary time, a society that promotes eating as a pastime, not a necessity.

THESE are the things that upset our nutritional balance. Obesity and food-related health issues are behavioural, not nutritional.

Metaikant is not wrong in what he/she says regarding the pitfalls of supplements- the key is in the name supplement- if your basic diet is good and balanced, then you have no need of them.

Schemes like weight watchers dont tell you anything you dont already know, what they do is give you a structure, and a reason/motivation to look through the distortions and distractions of the world we live in, and eat in accordance with what your body needs, not what your mind wants.

And you should NEVER listen to food/exercise advice issued by your general practitioner - in a 6 year medical course, a doctor spends less than a month learning about the role of exercise and nutrition. If you ever have any real concerns, then your GP can refer you to a clinical dietician (not a 'nutritionist'), who has devoted years to the role of food on a medical level.
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#431558 - 02/16/11 04:27 PM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: Cord]
Matakiant Offline
Member

Registered: 02/08/11
Posts: 121
Yeah Cord is more eloquent than me laugh

For me it is ''easy'' since I've grown up with food being a necessity and a pleasure at the same time.

Learning to cook early, getting a feel of the now so very mystical to some younger kids and even adults country life and so on all helped to create the natural attitude I have towards food and later the nutritional knowledge I gained through reading.

And I've managed to eat healthy & natural even when I've worked 12-16 hourt night shifts.

I've managed to do it with even more knightmarish work arrangements and through 2 months fo never ending renovations now I still eat healthy, though I have no room to work out any more or practice any kicks frown

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#431560 - 02/17/11 02:06 AM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: Matakiant]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Originally Posted By: Matakiant
though I have no room to work out any more or practice any kicks frown


ah, but there is no real excuse not to ....... wink
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#431651 - 02/28/11 03:07 AM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: underdog]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Originally Posted By: underdog
What about for females? I've been on and off protein supplement drinks over the course of a lifetime. When I've discussed it with my doctors, the consensus has been to not do them. Kidney damage has been their concern. Then I typically get into the belief system that there is this secret body of knowledge in the gym that the people who research diets and needs just don't know about. That just seems silly to me.

I'm not using any supplements right now. I'm just sticking to the recommendations from the U.S.D.A. for my age gender and gradual weight loss adding 1 oz of meat/beans and writing EVERYTHING down on my weight watchers program. This seems to be working for me in that I feel good, have good work outs and I'm losing weight and getting stronger.


Kidney damage from protein supplements is really very rare. And it happens when you have an ungodly amount. I used to take 2 or 3 50 gram protein drinks a day and 2 or 3 high protein meals. Didn't hurt me a bit. Doctors tend to lean to the side of being over protective so you can't sue them for giving you advice and then you having problem. That said if what you're doing works for you great. My grandma has done very well on weight watchers.
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#431654 - 03/02/11 01:39 AM Re: Need Protein Supplements? No. [Re: Stormdragon]
Mark Jordan Offline
Member

Registered: 06/09/10
Posts: 138
Loc: Burbank, California
Daily protein intake is important because it helps maintain a healthy metabolic rate among others. And we need approx 0.75 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight.

I don't worry about kidney problems when taking protein supplements as long as there is proper water intake in order to properly expel uric acid from the body. There is more kidney problems caused by taking paracetamol than taking protein supplements.

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