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#431646 - 02/25/11 11:35 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: VDJ]
JoelM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/26/04
Posts: 6355
Loc: Georgia, USA
Originally Posted By: VDJ
Yes, Life has rules and laws, but discussing a political or religous view does not pose a threat or endanger a life like doing 70 miles an hr in the middle of town and running red lights or yelling "FIRE" in a crowded room for that matter!


But the thing you forget is THAT DOESN'T MATTER. Simple rules of the board, no political discussion.

Originally Posted By: VDJ
I signed up on this sight agreeing to abide by the rules set.


Good, so do that.

Originally Posted By: VDJ
And finally, there have been several comments of my references to the constitution taking completely out of context and will continue as by removing that portion of my post, people cannot refer back to it!


Quote from your original post:
Originally Posted By: VDJ
discussion and debate of BOTH politics AND religion is exactly how the USA began its birthing process, it took awhile, but the founders came to a conclusion and went on from there.


That is why I brought up the Constitution, you referred to the founding fathers and the start of the United States.


All that being said, I agreed with you from the beginning that there was sometimes inconsistant enforcement of the no politics rule. But where we disagree is that you think it should be allowed. I won't try to change your mind, but you have to understand that just because you think one way, it doesn't mean that all rules will be like that and everyone will agree with you. Also to say, I don't know of any other way to at least broach the subject of a rule change other than here on the board or in a personal message to the moderators.
Good Luck.
_________________________
We should all take ourselves seriously...and then crumple that image up and toss it out the window.

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#431647 - 02/26/11 07:41 AM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: VDJ]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Originally Posted By: VDJ
Nice try Cord. Yes, Life has rules and laws, but discussing a political or religous view does not pose a threat or endanger a life


Want to compare global death rate caused by difference of political and religious ideology with that of road traffic fatalities? frown

Originally Posted By: VDJ
5 YEARS ago I signed up on this sight agreeing to abide by the rules set.


Yes you did. So please do so.

Originally Posted By: VDJ
But as the years went on and I saw how some threads were allowed to go on and others nipped immediately I began to question why the rules applied to some threads and not others. When these threads come up, do you and the other mods confer with Mr. Calie, or do you just say "WHOA! Thats against the rules"! And if its the latter, why some go on and others do not?


Already adressed in an earlier response:
Originally Posted By: Cord
Early on in the life of the 'general talk' forum the mods decided to give greater leeway to the life of non martialart topics, so that should they tread political paths, they would be given room to right themselves.

In that spirit, some political topics have been let loose, dependant on the judgement call of the mod who happens to see them.


Again, I acknoweldge the inconsistency of human judgement. I have tried to address these inconsistencies by locking the most recent threads that you have found against site rules, and also editing out the content in you post that contravened site rules too. This is what you want yes? across the board ruling on political discussion. Unless this thread is supposed to make us allow all political discussion, in which case that is simply not going to happen - nobody here has the authority to re-write site rules, ITS NOT OUR SITE!. If this is what you are after, then contact Mr Caille directly and make you case. Maybe get him to drop the bad language rule too, then this will become as vitriolic, retarded and troll infested as the rest of the net. Yay freedom smirk
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#431648 - 02/26/11 10:28 AM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Cord]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
<< ITS NOT OUR SITE! >>

Absolutely true. Think of the various newspapers and magazines offered at our local corner stores. They can print blatantly slanted versions of anything at the editor's pleasure. That leaves it to the informed reader to decide to purchase and read it, if they otherwise enjoy that publication.

That's why I read the forums daily, whether I understand all the articles or not. I might just learn something. And often do.

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#431659 - 03/03/11 03:48 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: iaibear]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
In light of Westboros winning of the supreme court case, I'm even more convicned free speech has limits.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#431915 - 04/04/11 03:10 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: VDJ]
fileboy2002 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 999
Loc: Chicago, IL
Unfortunately, many people--and I think this is particularly true of people from the US--are extremely averse to conflict. They loath it. They run from it. They don't see that the heat of conflict can often generate light; instead, they see conflict as having no value whatsoever. If given the chance, they will often censor people as a means of avoiding conflict. They'd rather stifle people altogether than risk having anyone say anything upsetting to anyone else. It is utterly undemocratic, but there it is.

Having said that, there are times when moderators need to shut discussion down. Too many boards end up being hijacked by a handful of loudmouthed cranks with endless time on their hands. A few years back, I saw grandemesa.com, a board created by an immigrant right supporter, completely overwhelmed and and destroyed by a handful of militant xenophobes. Their non-stop, Mexican-baiting, racist diatribes drove everyone else away. In the end, the haters were the only ones left. The creator had to shut it down.

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#431918 - 04/04/11 03:51 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: fileboy2002]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
Wouldn't doubt it for a minute.
Arthur Godfrey (remember him?) thought Political Correctness was (I can't say it here).

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#431960 - 04/06/11 09:51 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: fileboy2002]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Originally Posted By: fileboy2002
Unfortunately, many people--and I think this is particularly true of people from the US--are extremely averse to conflict. They loath it. They run from it. They don't see that the heat of conflict can often generate light; instead, they see conflict as having no value whatsoever. If given the chance, they will often censor people as a means of avoiding conflict. They'd rather stifle people altogether than risk having anyone say anything upsetting to anyone else. It is utterly undemocratic, but there it is.

Having said that, there are times when moderators need to shut discussion down. Too many boards end up being hijacked by a handful of loudmouthed cranks with endless time on their hands. A few years back, I saw grandemesa.com, a board created by an immigrant right supporter, completely overwhelmed and and destroyed by a handful of militant xenophobes. Their non-stop, Mexican-baiting, racist diatribes drove everyone else away. In the end, the haters were the only ones left. The creator had to shut it down.


So suddenly, being against illegal immigration (supporting AMERICAN LAW) means you're a loudmouthed crank and a racist? Thanks bro real nice. I bet they weren't racist, I bet people jumped to that because nearly all illegals happen to be from Mexico but that's not really the issue, it's just something overly liberal people like to say to divert attention from the real issue.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#431966 - 04/07/11 12:01 AM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Stormdragon]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
Quote:
So suddenly, being against illegal immigration (supporting AMERICAN LAW) means you're a loudmouthed crank and a racist? Thanks bro real nice. I bet they weren't racist, I bet people jumped to that because nearly all illegals happen to be from Mexico but that's not really the issue, it's just something overly liberal people like to say to divert attention from the real issue.


I think this is a really weak argument. He didn't say they were loudmouthed cranks because they were against illegal immigration, he said the people who were against illegal immigration were loudmouthed cranks.

It's a critical distinction. WHAT the opinion was is not important, HOW they went about expressing it was.

Besides that, just because something is AMERICAN LAW doesn't make it right or moral. I could fill this board with American Laws that were immoral and or just plain stupid.

Illegal Immigration is a complex problem...one that we cannot discuss here though.
_________________________
Undefeated in all of Asia!

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#431967 - 04/07/11 12:41 AM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Kimo2007]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Ok well, if I misunderstood then I withdraw my statement but I was going by what it sounded like to me. And that's usually what is meant. Point about American law taken. But, no one should be blasted for supporting it, even if you think it's completely idiotic. Arguing the law is one thing but general judgements on people for their views is where my problem is. That said, I'm not trying to discuss that issue itself.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#431970 - 04/07/11 09:42 AM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Stormdragon]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
Hasn't this forum developed a "Political Nature"?

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