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#431636 - 02/25/11 05:02 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Stormdragon]
VDJ Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1674
This is beatiful! Everyone telling me to deal with the free speech issue (or lack thereof) on the board! Until their speech will be impeded, here or someplace else! First off, My FIRST REFERENCE to the constitution was in regards to the goings on in Wisconsin, NOT this board (which, btw, has been removed)!, My second reference to it was that Mr. Calie, the owner of the site, is an American citizen and as such, he and this board which originated in the USA is protected by it! So before anyone else wants to jump on me about my REFERENCES to such things, READ THE POST THOROUGHLY AND KEEP IT IN CONTEXT! Which can be hard to do as a portion of my post has been "Edited"! Funny thing that I notice now is how alive THIS thread is! Hmmmmm!

VDJ

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#431637 - 02/25/11 05:39 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: VDJ]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Hi Vince. I know that it's hard to imagine that this American-owned site wouldn't be protected under the constitution, but I'm pretty sure that is the case. It looks like it should be, since you and I live in America. But I assure you that if we lived in say, Iran or China, or any other number of more oppressive states, this site - and any other that government felt like - could and would be blocked instantly. The internet is not protected by the constitution.

And in any case, as Cord noted, Mr. Caile has set the rules on free speech here for the mods to follow. Technically, there isn't supposed to be *any* political or religious stuff at all, unless it strictly had to do with martial arts (like the case of shorinji-ryu kempo, say), so we were granting quite a bit of freedom in allowing any at all, by the rules. Sometimes it was walking a tightrope in deciding to allow or not allow things in the general forum. Even the mods did not always agree!
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#431638 - 02/25/11 06:16 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: VDJ]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Originally Posted By: VDJ
My FIRST REFERENCE to the constitution was in regards to the goings on in Wisconsin, NOT this board (which, btw, has been removed)


Yes, by me. The topic had already been locked down. Derailing your own thread to continue offering opinion on a locked topic isnt going to wash. You are the one who has asked for proper and consistent moderation remember, I am just obliging.

Originally Posted By: VDJ
My second reference to it was that Mr. Calie, the owner of the site, is an American citizen and as such, he and this board which originated in the USA is protected by it!


And yet he has used his individual right and free choice to put restrictions on subject matter on his website. Restrictions that you agreed to under the terms and conditions of conduct upon joining the site. So you exercised your free choice to agree to abide by these rules. You were not forced to join the site, so yoy civil liberties have not been compromised against your will.

Originally Posted By: VDJ
So before anyone else wants to jump on me about my REFERENCES to such things, READ THE POST THOROUGHLY AND KEEP IT IN CONTEXT! Which can be hard to do as a portion of my post has been "Edited"!


The portion edited was an addendum that dealt purely with a response to Iaibear's thread that was locked. The main body of your post remains in tact and unabridged, so if you didnt mean it, you should have worded it better- nothing I removed changed the nature of your argument with the moderation of the site.

And before you go rattling on about democracy equating freedom, I would like you to go outside, drive your car at 70 through the centre of your town, run every red light, park up in the disabled zone at the mall, go smoke a cigarrette inside your nearest restaurant, and then strip off and walk around the shops naked.

Then you can come back after you have been bailed and tell me how 'free' we are to do whatever we like in our society wink

Life has rules. The site has rules. Simple truth.
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#431639 - 02/25/11 06:51 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Cord]
VDJ Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1674
Nice try Cord. Yes, Life has rules and laws, but discussing a political or religous view does not pose a threat or endanger a life like doing 70 miles an hr in the middle of town and running red lights or yelling "FIRE" in a crowded room for that matter! And yes as I stated earlier, 5 YEARS ago I signed up on this sight agreeing to abide by the rules set.

But as the years went on and I saw how some threads were allowed to go on and others nipped immediately I began to question why the rules applied to some threads and not others. When these threads come up, do you and the other mods confer with Mr. Calie, or do you just say "WHOA! Thats against the rules"! And if its the latter, why some go on and others do not?

And finally, there have been several comments of my references to the constitution taking completely out of context and will continue as by removing that portion of my post, people cannot refer back to it!

VDJ

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#431640 - 02/25/11 06:56 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: MattJ]
VDJ Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1674
Originally Posted By: MattJ
Hi Vince. I know that it's hard to imagine that this American-owned site wouldn't be protected under the constitution, but I'm pretty sure that is the case. It looks like it should be, since you and I live in America. But I assure you that if we lived in say, Iran or China, or any other number of more oppressive states, this site - and any other that government felt like - could and would be blocked instantly. The internet is not protected by the constitution.

And in any case, as Cord noted, Mr. Caile has set the rules on free speech here for the mods to follow. Technically, there isn't supposed to be *any* political or religious stuff at all, unless it strictly had to do with martial arts (like the case of shorinji-ryu kempo, say), so we were granting quite a bit of freedom in allowing any at all, by the rules. Sometimes it was walking a tightrope in deciding to allow or not allow things in the general forum. Even the mods did not always agree!


Then I'm guessing that you don't remember the ruling by the Supreme Court a few years back that protected some scumbag who had a site that used "Virtual" chidren and made up stories about disgusting acts with them under the premise of free speech!

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#431641 - 02/25/11 07:27 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: VDJ]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Face it, you don't have free speech on here. Start your own site if you don't like. Or once again, if you really think your rights are somehow being infringed take it to the supreme court. It'll be thrown out immediately I bet but go ahead and try.
And the fact is, as strange as it sounds, free speech has limits (which is why you can't yell fire in a building when there isn't one and why the Westboro Baptist nut jobs are banned from protesting in some areas).
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#431642 - 02/25/11 07:41 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Stormdragon]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:
Then I'm guessing that you don't remember the ruling by the Supreme Court a few years back that protected some scumbag who had a site that used "Virtual" chidren and made up stories about disgusting acts with them under the premise of free speech!


Ha, don't get me started on the Supreme Court, LOL (see the GD Supreme Court thread). They have made some massively bad decisions recently, IMHO. The dog-fighting thing INFURIATED me.

But to stay on topic, the Supreme Court does not set the rules here - Mr. Caile does. I'll be the first one to admit I haven't done a perfect job, but there is no political conspiracy, at all.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#431643 - 02/25/11 09:46 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: Stormdragon]
VDJ Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1674
Originally Posted By: Stormdragon
Face it, you don't have free speech on here. Start your own site if you don't like. Or once again, if you really think your rights are somehow being infringed take it to the supreme court. It'll be thrown out immediately I bet but go ahead and try.
And the fact is, as strange as it sounds, free speech has limits (which is why you can't yell fire in a building when there isn't one and why the Westboro Baptist nut jobs are banned from protesting in some areas).


Why would I want to start my own sight? I have made an observation and expressed a view and all I have recieved for the most part is nasty critisism about me not liking how some threads are locked and others are not when they are of the same or similar topics that are "Against" the rules! I won't even bother to address your comment regarding bringing something before the supreme court!

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#431644 - 02/25/11 09:50 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: MattJ]
VDJ Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1674
Originally Posted By: MattJ
Quote:
Then I'm guessing that you don't remember the ruling by the Supreme Court a few years back that protected some scumbag who had a site that used "Virtual" chidren and made up stories about disgusting acts with them under the premise of free speech!


Ha, don't get me started on the Supreme Court, LOL (see the GD Supreme Court thread). They have made some massively bad decisions recently, IMHO. The dog-fighting thing INFURIATED me.

But to stay on topic, the Supreme Court does not set the rules here - Mr. Caile does. I'll be the first one to admit I haven't done a perfect job, but there is no political conspiracy, at all.




Matt,

I was only pointing out that they did in fact rule on an internet site in regards to free speech as you posted above that they did not have the authority. I don't know what their perameters are to do so, but there is definitely a precedent!

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#431645 - 02/25/11 09:56 PM Re: Censorship of the board [Re: VDJ]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Originally Posted By: VDJ
Originally Posted By: Stormdragon
Face it, you don't have free speech on here. Start your own site if you don't like. Or once again, if you really think your rights are somehow being infringed take it to the supreme court. It'll be thrown out immediately I bet but go ahead and try.
And the fact is, as strange as it sounds, free speech has limits (which is why you can't yell fire in a building when there isn't one and why the Westboro Baptist nut jobs are banned from protesting in some areas).


Why would I want to start my own sight? I have made an observation and expressed a view and all I have recieved for the most part is nasty critisism about me not liking how some threads are locked and others are not when they are of the same or similar topics that are "Against" the rules! I won't even bother to address your comment regarding bringing something before the supreme court!


You expressed a view and the moderators told you why it was wrong. You aren't in charge, Caile and the mods are. Yet you don't seem to want to let it go. If you care that much than why wouldn't you start your own site or at least go to another forum? Can't always have your way, rules are rules. I don't have freedom of speech in the Army and I don't complain about it. For the very same reason, that it won't matter one bit because I'm not in charge and things don't always work the way I want, no matter how much I don't like it.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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