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#429932 - 09/13/10 01:55 PM Pulse Rates
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
I was curious about Pulse Rates. I had looked at this years ago but had not looked at for a while. As I keep track of my pulse rate in conjunction with my Blood Pressure regularly, I was curious to know where I fall under.



I will be 42 on this Thursday the 16th. My Pulse Rates are as follows:

High: 64
Low: 40
Average: 51

These are for the last 2 weeks and includes 16 readings so a very good basis. In respect to the chart my average would be rated as an athletic person; it is nice to know that the cardio and the weight lifting I'm doing has allowed me some benefits.

I have noticed since introducing cardio my pulse rates have come down. Prior my average pulse rate was around 58 which is still pretty decent.

If wondering. I keep track of my BP/Pulse Rate in an App on my iPod Touch called iBP; best $0.99 I've ever spent. I have a monitor at home that I use and then record them here which tracks it. The App has some good features such as graphs and the ability to e-mail your results to your doctor. May be something worth looking at if you are interested.

So how do you rate?
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#429933 - 09/13/10 03:06 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Dereck]
MattJ Offline
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Registered: 11/25/04
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I used to keep track of my pulse rate once a week or so at a store kiosk, and it was typically 55-65. I am 41 now.
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#429965 - 09/15/10 10:48 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: MattJ]
duanew Offline
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Registered: 06/28/08
Posts: 326
Loc: MN
I run in the high 40's to low 50's in my 50's.I attribute it to teaching myself to "belly" breath all the time.

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#429967 - 09/15/10 12:21 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: duanew]
Cord Offline
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Loc: Cambridge UK.
It has nothing to do with belly breathing.

The more developed and powerful the heart, the greater the volume of oxygenated blood it moves per beat, and therefore the less often it has to do it.

The tour cyclist Miguel Indurain had a recorded resting heart rate of 32 beats per minute.

I myself used to run at 48-55 pbm resting heart rate, but after the long sedentary period enforced by injury last year, it went to 70.

I now run at around 60, and will bring it down further.
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#429969 - 09/15/10 02:51 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
My BP/Pulse Rate this morning were; 129/75/45. The other day it was 126/68/42. Still trying to get my Systolic rate down. Will be back at the doctor tomorrow to check on my blood tests to see if I have an over active thyroid; will discuss at that time.
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#429970 - 09/15/10 03:08 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Dereck]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
er...why are you worried about your systolic based on those readings Dereck?

Anything from 110-140 is normal, 140-160 is borderline, and 160+ is clinical hypertension.

Also, the systolic reading is a constant state of flux anyway, and from a medical perspective, the diastolic reading is of much greater value. Here, 70-85 is normal, and anything higher than 90 is clinicaly hypertensive.

Considering than the baseline readings increase with age, your BP is absolutely superb at the moment Dereck. If this is being controlled with medication, then its working, and if its just you naturaly, then you are displaying zero sign of cardiovascular issues in regard to these readings.
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#429971 - 09/15/10 05:26 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
It's weird Cord. I have been on meds for almost 2 weeks. Prior to that I could maintain these rates and actually have a lower Systolic but a slightly higher Diastolic (70-83). Now in the morning both are sort of flipped (not sure that makes sense or not).

i.e.

4/20/2010 111/70
5/5/2010 117/76
6/1/2010 118/76
6/14/2010 113/72

These are some of my readings without meds but I also seen some slightly higher readings as well however I recently hit some high morning readings in the 130-145 range for the Systolic but still good on the Diastolic end. And the Diastolic end is the more important so not horribly but still a reason to be weary especially with my family history.

I normally take my readings in the morning as that is when I'm at rest. If at rest your readings are high that that is a red flag; but for the most part I have been really good with the exception of the last month. It is during the day that I get much higher and since that is the better part of the day, I needed to get this in order before I wound up like my Father or Grandfather. After work I could be anywhere from 130-163 and 70 to 93. It was way too inconsistent and usually on the higher end. Definitely red flags.

I just want to get everything in order and have smooth sailing. I have a lot of plans for the future and don't want to miss a beat. I'm otherwise healthy, I'm very active and I want to stay that way.

Thanks Cord.
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#429973 - 09/15/10 05:53 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Dereck]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
It sounds like your elevated readings were/are environmental, not physiological ie. work/life stress related, not due to arteriosclerosis.

With the readings you have shown on here, I doubt that a doctor in the UK would have put you on medication, even with your family history.

I appreciate its of personal concern to you, but I do recall that you tend to welcome and function on stress - I remember you saying you sleep as little as 4 hours a night and still feel energised, and that you embrace the pressure in your job. I would suggest that, as someone who has also stated a dislike of reliance on medication, that holistic environmental measures could be as effective for you as the meds - massage, aromatherapy, meditation etc could all help reduce stress levels.

Also, tight chest and breathlessness can also be attributed to anxiety/panic attacks, which are often associated with prolonged high stress levels.
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#429987 - 09/16/10 05:50 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
ThomsonsPier Offline
Member

Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 475
Loc: Reading, UK
From my pulse rate, I thought I was athletic for a second there. Then I realised I was looking at the women's chart. Still, excellent is, erm, excellent. Thanks for posting this.

I don't really have any way of tracking my blood pressure. Is it worth starting if I feel reasonably healthy anyway?
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#429991 - 09/16/10 08:20 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: ThomsonsPier]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Originally Posted By: ThomsonsPier
I don't really have any way of tracking my blood pressure. Is it worth starting if I feel reasonably healthy anyway?


Yep, always good to keep an eye on it - they dont call it the 'silent killer' for nothing. Very few if any truly defined symptoms involved.

It is not wise to obsess, or over-monitor BP though, as you can end up getting false readings due to being stressed about your readings!! wink

Best thing to do is book in with your doctor every 6 months for a 'wellness' check up - blood pressure, blood sugar, pee test and maybe prostate depending on your age. Bit like a regular service for your car, it just means you can have a bit of peace of mind.
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#429992 - 09/16/10 09:02 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
ya know it is so cool that some of us guys can talk about this. I mean, a bud of mine at work were actually discussing colonoscopy's (sp). Not many dudes can do that but I think it is important. If you nip it early it could mean a lot. Just like in my case, i have always managed a great BP reading, and all my blood work has been great. Even being over weight. However, by a chance of fate my wife made me a Dr appt with a new doctor and they did blood work on the spot. That is when I learned I have a pre cursor to diabetes. That was a wake up call and luckily it was a routine check up that found it. smile
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#429999 - 09/16/10 02:32 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: JasonM]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Thanks again for the info Cord. I agree, can get false readings if obsess about it and I've done that before. And yes, all that you listed about me is correct for how I function and little sleep.

I have no problem discussing health Jason, I think we are grown ups and things like this I think need to be discussed. And if one of us can share an experience and somebody else who reads it realizes they are not going through it alone, that just means that much more for ways of positivity.
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#430085 - 09/22/10 11:22 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
duanew Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/08
Posts: 326
Loc: MN
Well actually the more air you bring in the slower the heart will beat...combat breathing studies show this. When you sleep you switch to belly breathing and the heart and respiration rates also drop.
Duane

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#430100 - 09/23/10 10:05 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: duanew]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Your body is sedentary when asleep, and brain function and biochemistry change- that is what makes the heart rate drop.

'Battle breathing' as you call it, is a relaxation technique designed to minimise stress hormones like adrenaline that amp your system for fight or flight. Again, dealing with this has nothing to do with the amount of oxygen you take in.

There is no such thing as 'belly breathing'. Breathing is the intake of air in to the lungs, where gaseous exchage occurs via the alveoli. The lungs are actually massively over specified for our requirements, given that even under the exertion of physical stress, we do not use 1/3rd of their intake capacity.

Believe what you want, but belly breathing does not give you a significantly higher volume of oxygenated blood.
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#430103 - 09/23/10 11:08 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
duanew Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/08
Posts: 326
Loc: MN
Combat breathing increases oxygen thus lower the heart rate reducing the likelihood of the onset of those physiological changes brought on by a stress induced increase in heart rate.See Bruce Siddle or Lt. Col. Dave Grossmans work on the subject.

Duane

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#430106 - 09/23/10 12:02 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: duanew]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
I dont need to. The relaxation inherent in deep breathing has nothing to do with increased oxygen levels, which if anything, would make you euphoric and impar judgement further.

Regulated breathing tells the autonomic emergency systems that it is ok to shutdown- it is the domino you push that sends all other fight or flight responses toppling.

Like I said, you are free to believe what you wish.
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#430119 - 09/24/10 07:19 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
duanew Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/08
Posts: 326
Loc: MN
And you are too. The scientific research doesn't agree with you. I'll stick with science.

Duane

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#430122 - 09/24/10 01:29 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: duanew]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Care to explain why fight or flight primes the body to take in more oxygen by increasing breathing rate, yet this increase in gaseous exchange fuels, not quells adrenal dump?

Deep breathing is a relaxation technique, and no matter how you engage the diaphragm, the act of respiration comes from the lungs, not the 'belly'.

Elevated breathing rate is the one aspect of stress physiology that you can control. By doing so, you send conscious signals to the unconscious physiology that it can relax. The adrnaline dissipates, and that is why pulse rate drops. It has nothing to do with oxygen saturation levels.
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#430124 - 09/24/10 02:45 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
duanew Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/08
Posts: 326
Loc: MN
The answer lies in Siddles and Grossmans writings-but you "don't need to" read those.
"Belly" breathing-note the quotes-is one name given to a breathing technique-also called-autogenic, combat, tactical, meditative, etc.By drawing the belly downand out you engage the diagphram more and increase the amount of oxygen brought into the lungs by utilizing more than the upper third-as most "chest" breathers do.
The technique has been taught to thousand of police and military personnel around the world...and it works. No euphoria or lapses in judgement have been noted.
But what do they know.

Duane

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#430125 - 09/24/10 03:08 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: duanew]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
And the increase in oxygen intake, (as minimal as it is, being more down to surface area of alveoli than amount of air inhaled), is not what lowers the heart rate in stressed environments.

You think this kind of breathing was invented by these guys? Its a technique used by people as diverse as yogi's and opera singers. Certainly over time, the lungs can be conditioned to recieve and utilise more oxygen, but even with such people conditioned to do so, in a fight or flight situation, it is not the oxygen levels aquired from deep breathing that lower the pulse rate, it is the triggers sent tot he autonomic nervous system to shut down its emergency physiological processes.

Also, at this point, can I ask you if this is a subject so dear to your heart that you feel it right to take a tone with me? Is this the pi$$ing contest you desire?

The reason I said i dont need to read those books is because I have a whole stack of literature on the respiratory system that I had to learn as part of my academic studies in sports science. If this came off as dissmissive, then sorry, its just I already have a solid grasp of how and why the body works the way it does.

At the end of the day, deep breathing exercises can lower pulse rate. On that we agree. You believe it is down to oxygen content in the blood, I disagree, as I know the effect it has on other aspects of the physiology. If thats an impasse you want to butt heads over, then you have less planned for your weekend than I do wink
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#430130 - 09/24/10 07:23 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
Kathryn Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 262
Loc: Washington, DC
Dereck == you may want to ask about having your vitamin D status checked if it hasn't already.
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#430137 - 09/25/10 06:13 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
Shi Ronglang Offline
石榮狼
Member

Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 91
Loc: Samarobriva, Gallia
Originally Posted By: Cord
Breathing is the intake of air in to the lungs, where gaseous exchage occurs via the alveoli. [...] Believe what you want, but [sucking in more air by consciously using the muscles of your] belly [when] breathing does not give you a significantly higher volume of oxygenated blood.

But wouldn't sucking in more air (through conscious use of the belly or otherwise) dilatate the alveoli further, thus increasing the exchange surface and/or facilitating the said exchange by stretching the alveoli walls thinner?

What you say makes sense and you definitely know your stuff, but still I find it hard to believe that deeper breathing (breathing rates being equal) doesn't lead to a higher supply of oxygen...
A hidden child playing hide-and-seek will see his breathing rate increase as the seeker passes him by (strictly 'mental' stress condition, ready for a 'fight-or-flight' situation but not quite there yet), while someone whose body actually has a clear, physiological, immediate need for more oxygen, like an olympic sprinter for instance (actual physical stress conditions) will not only see his breathing rate but also his breathing 'depth' increase. The first one's breathing is fast but shallow and silent, while the second's is fast, powerful and noisy.
What would be the point of that, physiologically speaking, if increased breathing-depth doesn't provide the body with more oxygen?
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#430138 - 09/25/10 08:46 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Shi Ronglang]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Originally Posted By: Shi Ronglang
Originally Posted By: Cord
Breathing is the intake of air in to the lungs, where gaseous exchage occurs via the alveoli. [...] Believe what you want, but [sucking in more air by consciously using the muscles of your] belly [when] breathing does not give you a significantly higher volume of oxygenated blood.

But wouldn't sucking in more air (through conscious use of the belly or otherwise) dilatate the alveoli further, thus increasing the exchange surface and/or facilitating the said exchange by stretching the alveoli walls thinner?


Thats not how it works. The best way to think of alveoli is like tiny clusters of blackberries - thats kind of what they look like, all lumpy. This allows them to have a greater surface area. The lungs, if completely stretched out, have the same surface area as a tennis court, and that is due to the space saving structure of the alveoli. The air passes around the alveoli, which have membranes so thin, that they absorb the properties in the air and these go straight to the blood stream.

lung capacity, lung power, and lung efficiency, are seperate qualities, with seperate measurable tests. Someone with lung damage from smoke can breath as deep as they like, it will not change the damage to the alveoli, nor the resultant limitation in lung efficiency. I have also seen many with very strong peak flow readings fail badly on Vo2 max testing.

Quote:
What you say makes sense and you definitely know your stuff, but still I find it hard to believe that deeper breathing (breathing rates being equal) doesn't lead to a higher supply of oxygen...


'deep' is a relative term - again, a top level free diver, or opera tenor still doesnt use much over 1/3rd of the lungs potential expansion ability. So sure, increased volume of respiration will process more oxygen- its why you get 'out of breath' from exertion, but oxygen debt recovery difference from slower consciously deeper breathing, and more rapid natural breathing is swings and roundabouts situation.

Quote:
A hidden child playing hide-and-seek will see his breathing rate increase as the seeker passes him by (strictly 'mental' stress condition, ready for a 'fight-or-flight' situation but not quite there yet),


But why? This is the crux of the argument. That breathing increase, the pulse increase, the adrenaline 'jolt' as you say are all pre-emptive physiological changes. They prepare for exertion, they are not stimulated by exertion. As such, in this prepared state, deep breathing is not 'paying back' an oxygen debt - the blood is already highly oxygenated, and no exertion has occurred. The deep breathing is a message from one element of the emergency system to all others, that the threat is not real, or is over - ever heard the phrase 'to breath a sigh of relief'? Thats why.

Quote:
while someone whose body actually has a clear, physiological, immediate need for more oxygen, like an olympic sprinter for instance (actual physical stress conditions) will not only see his breathing rate but also his breathing 'depth' increase.


Probably a bad example, as sprinters breath very shallow, as their exertion is anaerobic and brief. Though this is a good time to introduce the impracticalities of 'belly breathing' to situations of gross motor function. A sprinter relies on a stable core through which to ensure that the least amount of power dissipates through yielding body mechanics. To truly 'belly breath' the abdominals must relax beyond a point where they can effectively stabilise dynamic physical movement. This is why traditional meditation takes place in a static position.
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#430175 - 09/27/10 09:41 AM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Cord]
duanew Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/08
Posts: 326
Loc: MN
I thought the discussion was about oxygen not urine. I disagree with you. If you choose to think of that as butting heads I suggest you breath deeply and relax. Hope you had a great weekend.

Duane

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#430190 - 09/27/10 08:58 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: duanew]
Kathryn Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 262
Loc: Washington, DC
At any rate, if you want to breathe more deeply and efficiency, practice exhaling more completely. It kicks in your hypoxic drive to assist in the inhale.
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#433901 - 09/29/11 06:07 PM Re: Pulse Rates [Re: Kathryn]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Just looking back at this thread. Currently finding my job has moved to the most stress I have ever had and is getting worse. Have looked for way to alleviate this even discussing with my place of work that won't do anything even though they agree there are problems. In fact they want me to take on more roles that will increase my stress levels; not sure I am up for this and may be detrimental to my health. And sadly it is not something I can say no to.

I talked earlier about tightness in my chest; can't remember if I ever discussed what was found out. I can't remember the terminology but the valve that I have that releases acid is gone and when stressed it dumps too much and than this gives me the tightness; had nothing to do with my heart; phew. On medication for this that has helped up until this point where my stress levels are off the chart; which means my blood pressure is up there to.

My pulse rate is still very decent with typing right now and checking it is 52 bpm. Suspect when I go home my BP will be 150-160/80. Got to alleviate this stress to get back to normal rates. Life other than work is good; so when at rest there is no stress thankfully.

EDIT: IT is called a Hiatal Hernia and it is the diaphragm that is gone.


Edited by Dereck (09/29/11 06:21 PM)
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