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#429696 - 09/05/10 06:14 PM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: Kimo2007]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Chill out, you guys are acting like the state of our country is on the line with the discussion. It's a friggin martial arts forum. You're not accomplishing anything with this it's just friendly discussion.
In any case there are some racists on the left and a lot o nthe right (only difference is the leftist racists are racist agaisnt whites whereas the right is racist towards everyone else but both sides have racists either way).
The problem with the left in this regard is that they promote an overly apologetic and politically correct approach that denies certain truths that may be generalizations but very much true anyway. The right clings to their generalizations so hard that they won't see exceptions when they come (like Muslims that aren't terrorists, what a crazy thought!).
The whole party system is pointless anyway. All it serves is to create these kinds of divisions and conflicts.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#429697 - 09/05/10 06:34 PM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: Stormdragon]
bcihak Offline
Member

Registered: 08/12/07
Posts: 298
Loc: Illinois
With all due respect Stormdragon the racists are on the left, not the right. We are the only ones who actually see that not all muslims are terrorists but you cannot ignore the fear in the muslim community because of the radicals.

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#429699 - 09/05/10 08:51 PM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: bcihak]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Right on, Kimo. But don't get too bent with bcihak. He has swallowed every bit of the koolaide from the wacko far-right. You can't have a sensible debate with someone that far in denial.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#429700 - 09/05/10 10:30 PM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: Kimo2007]
bcihak Offline
Member

Registered: 08/12/07
Posts: 298
Loc: Illinois
It's funny, all of the guys swinging nightsticks at the peaceful, african american civil rights marchers were democrats. When you see people standing in the school house door in front of the little,african american girl, you realize they were democrats don't you? The people who are preventing inner city minorities from getting a good education so that they can escape the life destroying poverty in the inner cities are the democrats, you know that right? It always amazes me when the left complains about how bad the government is, how they are actively seeking to deny us civil rights, and yet, they want these same corrupt politicians to control their access to healthcare, they want them to control their social security, and they don't mind giving up large portions of their hard earned money to these same corrupt politicians, which the politicians use to reward their friends, buy votes and line their own pockets.
What you are saying when you support "government stimulus packages" is that you want to give your hard earned money to corrupt politicians, and then expect these same corrupt politicians to "spread the wealth around" to help the economy. Why don't you see that if you kept your own money, and spent it on the things you want and need, you would stimulate the economy on your own and you would be cutting out the corrupt middle man.
If I gave 20 dollars to someone to go to the store and buy me a loaf of bread, and he came back with no bread, eating a pound of candy, and then told me that I still owe the store 10 dollars because he opened a tab in my name, well, I have to think I would not give him any more money to buy my groceries for me. In fact, I wouldn't let him anywhere near my money again. You guys keep wanting to give the guy even more money. Why is that?
Check the states in the U.S. that are bankrupt, and are unable to fix the problem. What Party is in control of those states? The democrats. Tax and spend does not work. It didn't work in Europe, and it is not working here.


Edited by bcihak (09/05/10 10:35 PM)

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#429701 - 09/06/10 12:16 AM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: MattJ]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
Quote:
Right on, Kimo. But don't get too bent with bcihak.


I'm not getting bent at all, I think he is angry and for good reason, just at the wrong people.

Here is the thing. I am one of those that will say, and have said many times before "beware of the man who reads you his resume". The reason being, you should be able to make your point or your case without the "I know better than you" clause in your argument.

We are once again at a point in our country where the common man has a voice and a right to be angry. And, once again those with power and influence choose too exploit that opportunity and these rights to get a rise out of people like our friend bcihak.

That may sound condescending, but really it's not. I think once we get through the mud slinging we probably want the same things, at least for the most part. The big difference is in my honest opinion, my resume actually matters. I've been very poor, raised in the inner inner city. Attended public schools, been on welfare the whole deal.

Today I run a business that is highly successful and employees several hundred people. I'm not Bill Gates but I'm not slouch either, so I would ask Mr bcihak to present his resume, or some reason why I should bother to take him seriously?
_________________________
Undefeated in all of Asia!

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#429702 - 09/06/10 12:44 AM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: bcihak]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Originally Posted By: bcihak
With all due respect Stormdragon the racists are on the left, not the right. We are the only ones who actually see that not all muslims are terrorists but you cannot ignore the fear in the muslim community because of the radicals.


I respect your view and right to say it as I'm sure you have your reasons for it, but I genuinely don't agree that the right is more full of racists or has all the racists. Personal experience and the people I've known tells me that's false. Now it was a lot worse 20 or 30 years ago where the right was almost entirely racist but the right is still full of them too. Now I do differentiate between racists and prejudice or stereotypes (many say I fall under the latter 2) and many people don't get that difference but there still are many racists from the right. We've all known them.
It's one thing to understand that, for instance, the main threats at this point in time come from the Muslim world which is true and reason to watch them closely (just like if a guy is going around dicing people up he's probably white), but to look for trouble with Muslims just because they're Muslim is very wrong. The important thing is to not be afraid to embrace the exceptions or the majority that are good and I know too many people who align with the right and don't follow that, even assuming that being Arab makes you the scourge of humanity in and of itself.
Politicians o nthe right try to avoid being seen that way these days but it's still there.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#429703 - 09/06/10 12:55 AM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: Kimo2007]
bcihak Offline
Member

Registered: 08/12/07
Posts: 298
Loc: Illinois
My resume, I have a degree in history focusing in my later courses on the rise of socialism, nazism, and the fascists. I was originally a democrat and voted for Bill Clinton the first time when he was promising to cut taxes. My family had been democrats, a legacy handed down to us from our Roosevelt Democrat, Irish and German immigrant grand parents. I work in a government job where I see the waste and the poor motivation of the public sector employees. I was originally listening to Rush Limbaugh because like most democrats, I assumed he was a gas bag who lied every time he opened his mouth. A funny thing happened. I listened and then watched the news and the other media and they didn't cover the things he spoke about, and he was incredibly polite and well spoken. I began reading book recomendations, I especially enjoyed the books recommended by Walter Williams. He was the chair of the economics department at George Mason university and he fills in for Rush during the Christmas break. He recommended Friedrich van Hayeks book, "The Road to Serfdom" and Friedrich Batiates little, but incredibly powerful book,"The Law." Wow, those books are enlightning about the dangers of socialism. Another author I enjoy is Dinesh D'souza, and his book, "The End of Racism." Another author I learned about while Walter Williams was guest hosting on Rush was Thomas Sowell. He is an Economist at the Hoover Institute, has written 43 books on economics and the American society, and is a great guest. The books that you should try to read by him are , "the quest for cosmic justice," and the really great book, " Visions of the Anointed." I am really glad you aren't being condescending, that would make my feelings hurt.

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#429704 - 09/06/10 01:01 AM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: bcihak]
bcihak Offline
Member

Registered: 08/12/07
Posts: 298
Loc: Illinois
Stormdragon, I respect you because you have yet to call me names and are trying to address the issues. In that spirit, when you say right wing racism, to what are you actually referring. What groups or individuals do you equate with the right who you think are racist. As Dennis Praeger says, a radio host that I listen to, it is better in some cases to have clarity when you do not agree. I can name several groups and individuals on the left who I think are clearly racist in their actions. Can you give me some on the right so we know the same concepts. There is really no irrational fear of muslims or the thought that all muslims are terrorists. If you listen to that debate, everyone always starts with, "I know that the terrorists are a small minority of muslims..." Even the mosque issue in New York isn't what the left is trying to portray it as. the right is the first to say, they have a first ammendmant right to build their mosque. The question remains why build it there. If you are looking for religous intolerance to all religions, especially Judaism and Christianity, you have to look at the left again. They even travelled to the middle of the desert to remove a constitutionally protected cross commemorating our heroes from world war 2. The left is supporting the muslim extremists because they just see them as another minority group being oppressed by America.
Remember, there are already at least 32 mosques in New York city already, one of them is even closer to the sight than this mosque. There are about 100 mosques in New york State. That is great. I like religion and religous diversity. The people who want to build this mosque are doing it to lay down a marker against this country. They can build a mosque to show cooperation and community outreach anywhere they want. Most people would like them to honor the dead and build this mosque somewhere else.
You may or may not have heard about the Catholic Carmalit nuns who wanted to build a nunnery near one of the death camps in Germany to pray for the dead Jews that were murdered. The outrage from the Jewish community reached the Pope, and out of respect, remember, out of respect, for the Jewish community, he told the nuns to build their place somewhere else. Why shouldn't we expect the same consideration from the muslim community. Are my views on this racist or anti-muslim. Thanks.


Edited by bcihak (09/06/10 01:15 AM)

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#429711 - 09/06/10 05:18 AM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: bcihak]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
What I'm specifically referring to would be the various far-right militias that have sprung up (like the Minnesota militia), The KKK is a radical right wing group still active, including around my old town in Jersey, a few biker groups are still largely racist as well (though not necessairly with that explicitly expressed), and those tend to follow many extreme right ideals (though with an anrchist flavor somehow).
I think that the constitution does not say that a city or state HAS to build something for religion when the peopel of that religion are beyond free to publicly express their beliefs in the general area in question. We don't have to give minorities everything they want. To do so is a terrible attempt to please everyone. Afterall, political correctness is simply "beleiving you can pick up a turd by the clean end".
Big difference between oppression and not letting every small group run things.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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#429712 - 09/06/10 05:19 AM Re: conspiracy-nut [Re: Stormdragon]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Thanks for the show of respect by the way. I think an umber of people here are getting too heated over this to the point of making it personal. It doesn't have to be though it seems like it does at times. I just enjoying these discussions.
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

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