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#429070 - 08/13/10 11:12 AM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Dobbersky]
hope Offline
Member

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 149
Loc: Vancouver, B.C.
Hello Ken --

So, the students aren't showing these virtues (or are displaying the opposite), and you're waiting for them to mature? Do they know what they need to do in order to become truly black-belt material? (I have talked to some instructors who don't ever tell students what they need to improve mentally on the assumption that if they need to be told, they definitely don't get it and their subsequent behavior won't show their "real" character but only an act).

However, sometimes students need a hint. I'm of the opinion that if a person acts as they wish to be, they will become as they wish to be.

Is this relevant to your particular students?
_________________________
God grant me a good sword and no use for it. -- Polish proverb

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#429074 - 08/13/10 01:27 PM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Dobbersky]
Kathryn Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 262
Loc: Washington, DC
Originally Posted By: Dobbersky
All

Thank you for your comments.

I think I'll expand as to what I need to see before I put them forward for Shodan (1st Dan). I'm looking for mental attitude as the physical is only part of it.

Seven virtues of Bushido

The Bushido code is typified by seven virtues:
<snip>
You can teach a monkey to perform karate (you can find this on You tube), does that mean it is worthy of a black belt. To me and many Yudansha (blackbelts) the above Virtues are what makes a Yudansha not the physical side.


Bushido is one of my favorite subjects! However:

(1) If a dojo or a sensei is going to require students to adhere to a code, the students usually agree to do so from the outset (i.e. prior to training). Some require blood oaths, and some ask for a general promise. Has your school or class done so? It's not clear from your original posting.

(2) I understand that the higher dan levels require some spiritual development, but I thought that the shodan level was strictly technical, and used as a gateway to the higher levels. Why hold them back from further training that may develop them spiritually if they are ready for the first technical level?

I ask these questions from the perspective of a student, because it would worry me greatly if I entered into a training arrangement and it was suddenly changed when I wanted to test for shodan.

Kathryn
_________________________
Be nice, until it's time to not be nice.

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#429075 - 08/13/10 01:46 PM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Kathryn]
jonwade Offline
Member

Registered: 09/21/06
Posts: 34
Loc: Essex, UK
I think that the most important question you have to ask yourself is, do you still enjoy teaching? If the answer is yes, then enjoy it, and let the students progress at their pace.

You are an instructor. That alone means that you trained harder and still train harder than the average student, so do not get upset that some are not capable of making the higher grades. For many it is a hobby, fitness workout, social time. Their aspirations may not be to be the next instructor, but just be the best they can be within the time that they can afford to set aside for that activity.

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#429091 - 08/14/10 09:57 AM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: jonwade]
cxt Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/11/03
Posts: 5823
Loc: USA
Dobb

Everyone that teaches feels that way at times. Does not make it any easier to go thu but your not alone.

Jonwade above put it very well.

"Their asperations may not be to be the enxt instructor, but to be just the best they can be within the time that they can afford to set aside for the activity."

Then again, your the guy on the ground and you would know better than we if they were slackers who want the rank without the work.
_________________________
I did battle with ignorance today.......and ignorance won. Huey.

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#429540 - 08/31/10 12:14 AM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Dobbersky]
Jeff_G Offline
Member

Registered: 04/15/06
Posts: 222
Loc: Midwest
I used to get the yucks of teaching about every seven years. I noticed the pattern after the third round.

Martial Arts is a strange endeavor. We lead and hope that they will follow. The problem is that every practitioner travels his own path. We can't ask for them to be us any more than they can hope to be us. The hard part is letting go and watching them create tiny branches of the tree you started.

I used to take my students to my instructor for black belt testing. The first thing they heard from him was that they would not be there if they were not ready. Then he proceeded to put them through the most grueling ordeal they have ever had.

Each of my black belts were so different from each other and, of course, me but they all deserved their belts.

I agree that it might be useful to step back and let someone else evaluate them. An occasional field trip could be useful from time to time. I suspect that you will be pleasantly surprised.

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#429544 - 08/31/10 08:20 AM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Jeff_G]
Dobbersky Offline
Peace Works!!!!
Enthusiast

Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 913
Loc: Manchester United Kingdom
All

It is much appreciated. I think I'm just going through a low point at present. I wonder why, last night, I had a Senior 5th Kyu showing a Junior 1st Kyu Kata that he'd not practiced for a while. I hoped this would 'humble' him to show that the higher the grade, the better the example to be set.

I have 3 students at present who I consider to have the mental state to be a blackbelt although they are still lower Kyu Grades and I need to develop them more before their time.

I have a family of 4 joining me soon so that will be a good lease of life for the club too.

I think I'll put the Idea of "Closing Down" to rest for a while now.

OSU!!!!
_________________________
A man is but the product of his thoughts what he thinks, he becomes.

Ken

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#435335 - 06/26/12 12:05 PM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Dobbersky]
Dobbersky Offline
Peace Works!!!!
Enthusiast

Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 913
Loc: Manchester United Kingdom
Wow, I'm still going and I've had students come and go, I've changed the name and the way I teach, The Syllabus and the Kata have changed too. I have lowered the level of contact from Full to in-between Semi and Full Contact and Got 2/3 grading for Black Belts this year!

I'm looking at how to Market the school, all the other martial arts schools tend to do the non-contact or Ippon Kumite WKA stuff so I think I will Market it as a Full Contact Karate School, Only thing is getting students to compete in interclubs and competitions, I'm doing the Scottish open "hopefully" Feb 2013

Its good to read through old posts

OSU
_________________________
A man is but the product of his thoughts what he thinks, he becomes.

Ken

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#435339 - 06/27/12 12:55 AM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Dobbersky]
hope Offline
Member

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 149
Loc: Vancouver, B.C.
Great to hear about it!!

Out of interest, what did you decide about those students whose technical skills were good enough, but who didn't have the mental qualities to test for shodan, in your view?
_________________________
God grant me a good sword and no use for it. -- Polish proverb

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#435342 - 06/27/12 05:18 AM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: hope]
Dobbersky Offline
Peace Works!!!!
Enthusiast

Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 913
Loc: Manchester United Kingdom
Originally Posted By: hope
Great to hear about it!!

Out of interest, what did you decide about those students whose technical skills were good enough, but who didn't have the mental qualities to test for shodan, in your view?


I'm grading them this year, this Autumn/Winter, I suppose I have to look at it like a driving test, one doesn't start learning how to drive until one is sat in the driving seat with no one to fall back on for guidance

OSU
_________________________
A man is but the product of his thoughts what he thinks, he becomes.

Ken

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#435347 - 06/29/12 08:56 PM Re: Closing Down!!!! [Re: Dobbersky]
Jeff_G Offline
Member

Registered: 04/15/06
Posts: 222
Loc: Midwest
Good to see you are still going strong. Keep up the good work.

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