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#428835 - 08/04/10 10:03 AM Single Whip - Application ????
Dobbersky Offline
Peace Works!!!!
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Registered: 03/13/06
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Loc: Manchester United Kingdom
Quote from Wikipedia for discription

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_whip

"Single Whip" is a common posture found in most forms of tai chi chuan. Typically at the end of the posture the left hand is in a palm outward push and the right hand held most commonly in the form of a hook or closed fist. Notable exceptions are the Single Whip in Sun style and Wu/Hao style tai chi chuan which finish with both hands open, palms outward.

Single Whip is one of the movements/postures most repeated in the solo training forms. Its first appearance in most forms follows the Grasp Sparrow's Tail sequence (peng, lu, ji, an) and is seen later as a variant renamed Snake Creeps Down. There is also a posture in the Wu style sword form called Single Whip Fusing Throat.

The martial applications of Single Whip are many. There are various strikes, throws, changeups (using one hand to create an opening so that the other can strike) and kicks derived from this posture trained by different schools."

What would you say is a realistic application of this technique as Karateka I can not see an effective "way" I await to be enlightened.

Thanks

_________________________
A man is but the product of his thoughts what he thinks, he becomes.

Ken

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#428836 - 08/04/10 10:44 AM Re: Single Whip - Application ???? [Re: Dobbersky]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2572
There are a lot of apps online. Some good, a lot pretty poor. Here is a favourite (think this is Chen family):



Now, if you are asking if you can find someone who can teach you good applications for Single Whip (or anything in Taiji form for that matter) then best of luck to you. Very hard to find a good teacher in the West who can show the full martial side of Taiji.
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"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#428837 - 08/04/10 10:54 AM Re: Single Whip - Application ???? [Re: Prizewriter]
ninpopo Offline
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Registered: 07/01/10
Posts: 72
Loc: Africa *drums starts playing i...
I cant remember where i read it, but apparently one who has done tai chi for 10 years can only use it in a real combat situation. IDK if it true or not since i personally have never done this style.
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#428839 - 08/04/10 11:30 AM Re: Single Whip - Application ???? [Re: ninpopo]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2572
I think that's BS to be honest (the 10 year thing that is!) but there is a very steep learning curve in Taiji, no doubt about it. In it's own way it's probably one of the toughest MA to learn.


Edited by Prizewriter (08/04/10 02:14 PM)
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#428852 - 08/05/10 02:55 AM Re: Single Whip - Application ???? [Re: Prizewriter]
Gavin Offline
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Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
"10 years to 'get good'!" - that one always make me laugh! :O)

I cannot find any applications on youtube that I feel remotely do the sequence any justice whatsoever.

Just some general ideas from the posture, firstly if you break away from the form (if you've got a good instructor showing you the correct mechanics) you'll loose all of the subtle but funky power from the form. The arms should not divert a millimeter from the way the are used in form, and in the form they are powered from the feet through the waist.

A couple of ideas though. Firstly a lovely chin na idea with the 'crane beak' hand which has a lovely version of the 'nikkio' wrist lock. Have a partner grab your wrist as if you were practicing nikkio but instead of grabbing with thumb make sure that your entire hooking hand ends up in the inside of their wrist - you'll get a lovely roll of their entire arm. Now you can either clamp their hand down using your free one and turn this into a lock/break or you can capitalize on them loosing their grip and freeing your hand up to drive the fist straight into the throat or perhaps follow through on this into a neck tie... and a throw by latching onto their arm with the other hand... which makes sense when you think it starts in peng (could be latching on) and finishes in aun. Powered from the body this is lovely! In the Yang Long Boxing there is an open handed variation instead of the crane beak and this turns the striking possibilities to the fingers into the eyes and throat or using the tigers mouth. Again all without deviating from the form once.

The step in the form has some fantastic skills hidden in it too. There are leg trapping skills and it is a wonderful early lesson for the student in using stepping to generate power. The striking applications and locking applications mentioned above can be turbo charged by using this step properly.

Then there's what's going on with the other hand and there are some wonderful push hands drills that can be found here. The subtle methods of opening up the centre line there are awesome. From a karate point of view, if you've worked any kakie drills from the outer block you'll see how this can be used to open the body up and strike through. This concept is taken to a different level in the snake creeps down/squatted single whip variation - and in the yang cheng fu long form the applications when snake creeps down flows into 'punch up to seven stars' and 'golden cockerel stands on one leg' again brings a warm glow to my cockles! wink

You may have noticed I rather like single whip! Thing to remember is that there are no fixed applications in tai chi, unlike much karate bunkai, only possibilities based upon a core set of principles. The application depends on the circumstances and must always fit the 'environment' and will never be the same twice. What the opponent does dictates everything, where their weight is, the angle of the attack, which arm, how aware you are, etc, etc. Just remember tai chi form applications are only possibilities that appear!


Edited by Gavin (08/05/10 03:03 AM)
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#428894 - 08/06/10 06:15 AM Re: Single Whip - Application ???? [Re: Gavin]
Dobbersky Offline
Peace Works!!!!
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Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 892
Loc: Manchester United Kingdom
Thank you guys

Excellent Description Gavin

Are there any more thoughts as to its use?
_________________________
A man is but the product of his thoughts what he thinks, he becomes.

Ken

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#428907 - 08/06/10 12:07 PM Re: Single Whip - Application ???? [Re: Dobbersky]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
If you're ever down my way mate let me know... we could spend days on single whip!
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Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
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