FightingArts Estore
Pressure Points
From a medical professional, straight facts on where and how to hit that can save your life.
Stretching
Limber or not, anyone can add height and speed to their kicks with this method.
Calligraphy
For yourself or as a gift, calligraphy is special, unique and lasting.
Karate Uniforms
Look your best. Max snap. low cost & superior crafted: “Peak Performance Gold” 16 oz uniforms.

MOTOBU
Classic book translation. Hard to find. Not in stores.
Who's Online
0 registered (), 22 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
TomRosenberg, jessylin, play, Keith_G, LeroyCFischer
22937 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
jwwmantis 2
futsaowingchun 1
Zombie Zero 1
Beefcake 1
LeroyCFischer 1
December
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12 13
14 15 16 17 18 19 20
21 22 23 24 25 26 27
28 29 30 31
New Topics
Freeing Hand-Wing Chun's last movements
by futsaowingchun
12/17/14 09:40 PM
2015 Master Yang Jwing-Ming Seminar
by jwwmantis
12/05/14 10:36 PM
The Beginners Guide To Stretching
by
12/27/06 11:43 AM
Your true goal
by
03/03/06 07:16 AM
Recent Posts
Freeing Hand-Wing Chun's last movements
by futsaowingchun
12/17/14 09:40 PM
Your true goal
by Beefcake
12/11/14 02:44 AM
The Beginners Guide To Stretching
by LeroyCFischer
12/04/14 02:07 AM
Forum Stats
22937 Members
36 Forums
35591 Topics
432526 Posts

Max Online: 424 @ 09/24/13 10:38 PM
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#424559 - 01/25/10 02:16 AM What's so good about legendary Japanese swords?
TaekwonDoFan Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 271
TKD is the only martial arts I've ever practiced - though Hapkido self-defence techniques have been included in my training, I remain primarily a kicker.

So I've been wondering about the idea that one sword is really better than the other, because I keep seeing this in films and books. I just saw Kill Bill Vols I and II, and the heroine was asking for a hattori sword, which is supposed to be better than other swords.

I presume a hattori sword is a fictitious type of sword, but is a really good sword made by a master better than an average sword made by an average swordsmith? IOW, can a hattori sword break a normal sword in two?

Top
#424562 - 01/25/10 01:20 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: TaekwonDoFan]
Kathryn Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 262
Loc: Washington, DC
The short answer is, yes.

If you are ever offered the opportunity to even just hold a katana made by a reputable forger, I hope that you will take advantage of it. The best way to learn how to recognize a good sword is to get near them.

Having said that, katanas are generally customized to the user, and a good swordsmith understands how to match the blade to the user's physique and style. Length and balancing points are common points of customization.

I would let go of the whole Hattori thing, because it is fictional. The ones you see being sold are replicas and for fun only.
_________________________
Be nice, until it's time to not be nice.

Top
#424563 - 01/25/10 02:19 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: Kathryn]
TaekwonDoFan Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 271
I'm learning something new, thanks. smile

Can a good sword break the blade of a not-so-good sword?

I'm asking because I'm thinking of trying kendo, just for fun. And collecting good swords may not be a bad hobby either.


Edited by TaekwonDoFan (01/25/10 02:20 PM)

Top
#424569 - 01/27/10 08:29 AM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: TaekwonDoFan]
Kathryn Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 262
Loc: Washington, DC
If you have an interest in Kendo, I strongly recommend checking out the website of the international kendo federation, and seek out a group that is affiliated.

But the first rule is to know your weaponry, and the art of kendo does not use live steel. You would spar with a special bamboo sword that allows for whacking without injury to others.

Some kendo groups also train in the art of iaido, and that would involve using a live steel training sword called an iaito.

As for breaking swords, any sword can be damaged or broken in ordinary training or in a battle situation. Fittings can come loose, and striking can crack the steel. Again, it is a fiction that you can purchase a sword that will be unbreakable. As a fan of Japanese cinema, I can tell you that samurai movies do not have plotlines about magical swords or unbreakable swords. The focus is usually on the skill of the warrior.

Good luck to you!
_________________________
Be nice, until it's time to not be nice.

Top
#424574 - 01/27/10 11:55 AM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: Kathryn]
TaekwonDoFan Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 271
Good point, and thanks.

So what's the difference between a good sword and a not-so-good one?

Top
#424661 - 02/01/10 09:08 AM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: TaekwonDoFan]
Kathryn Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 262
Loc: Washington, DC
I don't want you to think that I am ignoring your question, it's just that I don't know what you mean by a 'good sword'.

To a weapons user, any weapon that serves its purpose would be 'good'.

If you mean what kind of sword do collectors seek, there are many good websites on the subject, and I encourage you to learn more about them there.
_________________________
Be nice, until it's time to not be nice.

Top
#424698 - 02/02/10 06:23 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: TaekwonDoFan]
JMWcorwin Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/13/07
Posts: 731
Loc: SoCal, USA
cheap sword
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o-DCk2qhDM

good sword
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJZ5J7h_L1w&feature=related

But, as previously posted, if you really look online and even if you search the sword arts forums here, there's lots of knowledge to be had beyond what you see in a flea market replica sword catalog. It just requires a little bit of reading. This is something that can't be explained in a one sentence reply.
_________________________
There are no PERFECT techniques, only perfect execution for the situation at hand. ~Corwin

Top
#424963 - 02/13/10 03:30 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: Kathryn]
seibukanUK Offline
Member

Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 43
Hi
It is interesting that you state that Kendoka just whack each other. So, I take it that they do not try to replicate cutting each other and therfore Kendo has no relation to the sword arts. I must add that I don't do Kendo but do Iai and Ken and was always under the impression that Kendo was a bit more than the art of whacking and had some relationship with the sword arts. If Kendo is the art of whacking, better off doing Ken or Iai they are real sword arts. You can whack any where
_________________________
There is no more seibukanUK

Top
#424965 - 02/13/10 04:35 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: seibukanUK]
TaekwonDoFan Offline
Member

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 271
Whacks on, whacks off, whacks on, whacks off. Very good, Daniel-san. smile

Top
#433084 - 07/05/11 01:26 AM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: TaekwonDoFan]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
Apart from what some others have posted, a good sword would not necessarily be an old-ancient--collectible.

The methods and understanding of metallurgy have far advanced in modern era and process than any old-world manufactured

Simply, a good sword is going to cost more

This is a great site and place to start;

http://www.sword-buyers-guide.com/buy-swords-online.html#battle-ready


Edited by 47MartialMan (07/05/11 01:33 AM)

Top
#433088 - 07/05/11 07:46 AM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: 47MartialMan]
duanew Offline
Member

Registered: 06/28/08
Posts: 326
Loc: MN
Yeah, but a new sword has never been checked to see how many dead convicts it can slash thru-now that's mystique!

Duane

Top
#433115 - 07/06/11 02:00 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: 47MartialMan]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York

The "best" Japanese blade I was ever honored to handle was a six hundred year old forgery. Very light and short. Very well balanced. Very "tired". That means one more polishing (the only way to sharpen a quality blade) and the remains of the hamon would be gone. It was worth at least a thousand dollars.

Top
#433127 - 07/06/11 11:16 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: iaibear]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
Originally Posted By: iaibear

The "best" Japanese blade I was ever honored to handle was a six hundred year old forgery. Very light and short. Very well balanced. Very "tired". That means one more polishing (the only way to sharpen a quality blade) and the remains of the hamon would be gone. It was worth at least a thousand dollars.


Yeah, there are some that fetch more than that.

Careful though, even if it is "old" it can be almost worthless, as there were "cheap" made ones back in those eras as well.

Top
#433128 - 07/06/11 11:17 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: duanew]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
Originally Posted By: duanew
Yeah, but a new sword has never been checked to see how many dead convicts it can slash thru-now that's mystique!

Duane


Actually, they weren't dead until they were sliced-slashed. smile

Top
#433132 - 07/07/11 10:17 AM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: 47MartialMan]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
"How good is it?"

A practitioner (not me) was doing the kata called "batto", slipped and ran the tip through his upper arm (not just into but through).

His doctor examined the wound and any damage the vintage sword might have done to the surrounding tissue. The cut was so scalpel neat, he just pressed the edges together and wrapped on a bandage to hold them steady. It healed smooth.

Top
#433147 - 07/08/11 07:46 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: iaibear]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
Originally Posted By: iaibear
"How good is it?"

A practitioner (not me) was doing the kata called "batto", slipped and ran the tip through his upper arm (not just into but through).

His doctor examined the wound and any damage the vintage sword might have done to the surrounding tissue. The cut was so scalpel neat, he just pressed the edges together and wrapped on a bandage to hold them steady. It healed smooth.


What comes to mind;

"Why do a kata with a razor-sharp sword?"

Top
#433151 - 07/08/11 10:55 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: 47MartialMan]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
<< "Why do a kata with a razor-sharp sword?" >>

Because it is yours.
Kata can be done with a shinken. Higher belts who own one or more practice with them regularly.

Top
#433168 - 07/09/11 03:13 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: iaibear]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
Another notion just occurred to me.

What is the point of owning a Porsche if you don't drive it?

Top
#433171 - 07/09/11 08:15 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: iaibear]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
A Porsche is designed to go fast.

In many places there are speed limits.

Therefore, owning a Porsche is a issue of prestige because one can never supercede the speed limit.

Like a sharp sword, do something wrong and there WILL be consequences

Top
#433248 - 07/12/11 08:03 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: 47MartialMan]
davidb Offline
Stranger

Registered: 07/12/11
Posts: 3
A good sword to a not so good sword has a lot to do with metallurgy and the skill of the smith NOT to screw it up.A good sword holds an edge and is tough enough to handle impacts and cutting. If a sword wards, twists or bends in the hand of a novice then it 's likely not a good sword. An skilled swordman can "use " a good sword to cut because his technique is trained to cut properly. even a bad sword CAN cut.

A reputable smith can forge a strond blade with no micro cracks in the steel. these micro crack and stress fractors can eventually lead to the demish of the blade during use.

Metallurgy -wise the steel has to be harden enough to hold a good edge but tough enough to withstand impact.

Top
#433249 - 07/12/11 08:16 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: davidb]
davidb Offline
Stranger

Registered: 07/12/11
Posts: 3
opps ... i ignored the original question...what is so special about the legendary japanese sword..... I held a 17th century katana last week valued at $10k....oh my. It's like holding something sacred.... you become very aware of the history and can see the skill that was required to make it. I make swords myself and I am aware of what makes a good sword [there is so much more to it than my quick short reply above]

If you mean are Japanese katana the ulimate sword... no not really but the techinque and skill involved is awe inspiring. The differental temper was a monumental technical feat of engineering for that time period. In the hands of a trained a Samuraiit is a weapon of massive ability.... there are viking blades that are stronger and tougher but a japanese blade it a pure cutter... the physics are incredible

Metallurgy wise modern swords today are better. I am not refering to the mass produced crap you can by. BUT the skill of a Japanese swordsmith if that of a craftsman and an artist. The skill [ to me ] makes the difference

A good high end modern custom made sword can run $3000 to $15000 depending on the smith

Top
#433251 - 07/12/11 08:35 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: davidb]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
Originally Posted By: davidb
A good sword to a not so good sword has a lot to do with metallurgy and the skill of the smith NOT to screw it up.A good sword holds an edge and is tough enough to handle impacts and cutting. If a sword wards, twists or bends in the hand of a novice then it 's likely not a good sword. An skilled swordman can "use " a good sword to cut because his technique is trained to cut properly. even a bad sword CAN cut.

A reputable smith can forge a strond blade with no micro cracks in the steel. these micro crack and stress fractors can eventually lead to the demish of the blade during use.

Metallurgy -wise the steel has to be harden enough to hold a good edge but tough enough to withstand impact.


Good swords flex

Top
#433253 - 07/12/11 09:15 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: 47MartialMan]
davidb Offline
Stranger

Registered: 07/12/11
Posts: 3
yup... and stay straight after they flex. Flexibility is a part of the toughness factor and at the same time are hard enough to hold a sharp edge.

Top
#433257 - 07/12/11 11:22 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: davidb]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
But even a quality blade deserves to sing and be listened to.

Top
#433271 - 07/13/11 11:34 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: iaibear]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
Originally Posted By: iaibear
But even a quality blade deserves to sing and be listened to.


Depends.

Top
#433272 - 07/13/11 11:35 PM Re: What's so good about legendary Japanese swords? [Re: 47MartialMan]
47MartialMan Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 180
Originally Posted By: 47MartialMan
Originally Posted By: iaibear
But even a quality blade deserves to sing and be listened to.


Depends.



On another note, I think the Japanese blade is made of two parts

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >


Moderator:  Cord, MattJ, Reiki 




Action Ads
1.5 Million Plus Page Views
Monthly
Only $89
Details

Stun Guns
Variety of stun gun devices for your protection

Buy Pepper Spray
Worry about your family when you’re not around? Visit us today to protect everything you value.

Koryu.com
Accurate information on the ancient martial traditions of the Japanese samurai

C2 Taser
Protect yourself and loved ones from CRIME with the latest C2 Taser citizen model. Very effective.

 

 



Unbreakable Unbrella

krav maga