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#423969 - 12/09/09 05:49 AM How do i learn basic self defense by my self?
Angel Saini Offline
Stranger

Registered: 12/09/09
Posts: 2
Hi,

can any one tell me a site or some exercises which i can learn so i can learn to defend my self. i dont want to learn some fancy moves but basic stuff that can really strengthen and speed up my body ( btw i do go to the gym every day). Could u show something that will help me defend against multiple opponents ( like a group of muggers).
-------------------------------


Edited by MattJ (12/09/09 09:59 AM)

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#423975 - 12/09/09 03:57 PM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: Angel Saini]
JMWcorwin Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/13/07
Posts: 731
Loc: SoCal, USA
Simple answer? You can't. Not possible to learn how to interact with another person or persons without having another person to interact with. You might be able to grab a few ideas and memorize them. But without actual practice w/another person simulating attacks, it will probably be just the perfect amount to give you enough info to get yourself killed, or at least hurt very badly.
Sorry. Seek the advice of a qualified intructor.
_________________________
There are no PERFECT techniques, only perfect execution for the situation at hand. ~Corwin

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#423977 - 12/09/09 05:45 PM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: Angel Saini]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Okkkkk (PW takes deep breath before embarking on the road already well travelled):

Welcome to the forums for a start.

Based on your thread, what you want to learn isn't self defence. It's fighting. You want to learn how to fight.

Self defence isn't fighting.

If you are in a bad situation (as you described, and it is pretty unlikely to happen in a 1st world country), you seem intent already on fighting. So you are imagining a scenario, getting scared by that make believe scenario ("getting mugged") and deciding that you are going to fight.

If this isn't the case, and you don't want to fight, well heres an idea... don't waste your time learning how to fight! If you are going to become a slave to your own fear, at least imagine yourself running away from the "muggers" rather than breaking their necks.

Aside from the whole issue of letting your imagination getting the best of you, you are unlikely to have much success learning to fight by yourself.

On a slightly more serious note, if you honestly want to learn about self-defence you have to educate yourself, not learn to fight. Below is a great place to start, it has some fantastic information on SD (and it has nothing to do with fighting):

www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/

Also read about this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Why_Zebras_Don't_Get_Ulcers

It is a biologists observation of the "fight or flight" reaction to wild animals. Basically, and animal only switches the FOF reaction on when it is in ACTUAL danger. A lot of the animals other systems shut down. This only lasts as long as the animal is in danger, or it dies. Either way, it only lasts a few minutes.

The jist of the book is Zebras don't get ulcers or other stress related diseases because they only use the FOF when they are in ACTUAL danger. They don't switch that stress reaction on when they are late for work, or when they get carried away by something they saw on the news or in the movies.

Like Prof Spolsky says, a Zebra wouldn't understand why an animal gets worked up because it is running late for work, or because it imagines things that aren't real.

So in conclusion, don't worry about fighting if you are serious about Self Defence. You can form a great and effective SD strategy without knowing how to fight. And don't worry about getting attacked. Its highly unlikely to ever happen (unless you are a Prison Guard or such like!) and if you educate yourself on actual Self Defence, you are reducing the odds a lot lot more.

Good luck.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#423987 - 12/10/09 10:28 AM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: Prizewriter]
hope Offline
Member

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 149
Loc: Vancouver, B.C.
Hey Prizewriter, great self-defense site and general advice. However, maybe YOU don't have to worry about getting attacked (you live in a gated community, maybe? Never go out? Weigh 300 pounds and everyone crosses the street when they see you?) But not everyone is in this situation. I live in a "safe" city but have had to defend myself more than once (one time defending another person). It's one reason why I train. Hopefully it won't happen again, but my theory is I'll be able to startle someone enough to give me time to get lost. Paranoia isn't necessary but preparation is. And no, I don't go around looking for fights, I'm not a police officer or prison guard, and I don't wander around alone in the middle of the night.
_________________________
God grant me a good sword and no use for it. -- Polish proverb

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#423993 - 12/10/09 03:58 PM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: hope]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Hope

I appreciate where you are coming from. I am not saying that knowing how to fight is 100% useless re SD, but it is important for people to realize it is (IMHO) at best a very small part of an effective SD strategy.

The problem is the poster, like a lot of people, seems to think fighting is the best and only means of SD. It isn't.

In terms of general socio-economic status (i.e. living in a "good" area where you are less likely to get attacked) you have to ask is it better spend a lot of money on martial arts equipment/classes, or could that money be put to better use? For example, would it be better to go to night school and educate yourself, get a better job, get more money, and be able to afford to move in a few years? Or would that same money be better spent making your person/car/home more secure???

Additionally, lifestyle comes in to it. The most recent British Crime Survey compiled by an independent body for the UK Government found a person is over 50 times LESS likely to be a victim of assault if they don't frequent social drinking establishments (e.g. clubs, pubs). That's a hellvua risk reduction, isn't it? They found that almost 3 out of every 4 violent attacks in the UK involved alchol... you see where I am going with this?

I have met a lot of people who think martial arts are a golden hammer. They can go wherever they like, do whatever they want, get as drunk or as high as like, be as much of a jackass as they want because when it comes down to it, they can "kick ass". If they were more aware of themselves and why they do the things they do and how they treat other people, maybe they wouldn't be so inclined to learn how to "kick ass".


Another factor: The original poster goes to the gym. Who is to say that isn't as good a means of SD in terms of physical training? Here is a great thread about a person who fought off an criminal attack. She is a Crossfit member, not a martial artist (judging by the clip at least). She lifts weights, and does cardio work, including working on a punch bag. With all due respect, her punching technique isn't really clean, but it was enough to get her out of a bad situation:

http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=422690#Post422690

She was able to defend herself by being in good condition, being strong and having a small amount of punching training. She was able to fend off an attacker without formal martial arts study (so it seems).

What about systems like Parkour...aren't they worth considering in terms of their self defense value? Is good parkour "better" as a means of self defense in an urban area than any martial art?

Hope, you indicate in your post that nothing is a guarantee regarding getting attacked. You could be the most cautious person in the world, and it still might happen. Quite right.

However, like I said, nothing is guaranteed. Knowing martial arts may be on no help whatsoever in a situation. On the contrary, it may lead to making a bad situation worse.

A person has to decide what they want to do with life and the best way to go about it. If people want to worry about getting attacked, or spend a lot of time and money learning how to fight while ignoring or barely studying (IMO) effective self defense measures, well, that is their choice.

Back to the main topic, the Crossfit thread showed you can do some traininig from gym. Look to see if a Tae Bo or boxercise class is in the gym. If you want to learn to fight, those may be good places to start.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#423996 - 12/10/09 09:51 PM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: Prizewriter]
hope Offline
Member

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 149
Loc: Vancouver, B.C.
Hey Prizefighter -- 2 thoughts about your reply:

a) It seems you want to keep martial arts for people who want to learn how to fight, not who have other reasons which seem irrelevant to you or better served elsewhere (like self-defence). I disagree with your idea that martial arts aren't a good venue for learning self-defense. Although I'm happy to see that CrossFit thread, it's better to practice in situations that somewhat approximate the conditions where you use a skill, and to practice moves you might actually use. For example, in one situation where I was attacked before having any training, a guy had me in a headlock and was dragging me backward. I was in good shape, but I'm small. I had a good instant reaction -- I clawed my hand and reached backward for his eyes. However, when my hand touched his eyes, I found myself unable to follow through with enough force to cause him pain. Why? I had NEVER intentionally done anything similar to that. Inhibitions against violence prevented me using that split second. Result? I lost that split second and got well and truly beaten up. That WILL NOT happen again, thanks to me having repeatedly practiced using force with other actual people. It took me quite a few months to put any power into moves in martial arts. (And, in an unexpected result, I found that I like fighting, at least in a dojo, where emotions are not involved -- and I was a person who would not have guessed that I enjoyed fighting and would never have tried it otherwise).

b) A lot of your thread seems like blaming the victims of violence. It so happens, despite the statistics, that my own situations have been in middle-class areas, and not connected to pubs etc; however, it serves no purpose to tell a person who has just been beaten up that they should live in a better neighbourhood or should not drink with friends in celebration of something or other. Unfair things DO happen to people -- if you're always looking for ways to explain violence in terms of the victims, it seems like you're protecting yourself psychologically by blaming them (nothing bad can happen to me, because I do all of these magical things, and the world is fair and just, right?). My husband defended himself successfully against an armed gang member by using head games -- and having judo training. He was living in a very dicey area while studying for his doctorate at Johns Hopkins. There are many things people can do to aid their self-defense. Fair enough. If they weren't already doing all of them, it still doesn't make them at fault for being attacked.

Please don't encourage people who "only" need self-defense to exclude themselves from martial arts. Yes, fighting is a last resort for self-defense. War's a last resort for solving international problems. Sometimes, there's nothing else you can do.


Edited by hope (12/11/09 12:08 AM)
_________________________
God grant me a good sword and no use for it. -- Polish proverb

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#424001 - 12/11/09 05:17 AM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: hope]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Hi Hope

We are on dangerous ground here. Please read what I am saying. You are making assumptions and attributing things to me that I haven't said e.g. "It seems you...." & "...seems like...".

Just to make clear, I am not blaming the victims. I am simply pointing out that there is increased likelihood of violent attack when certain factors are involved. Thats it.

I study MA as a hobby and because what I study provides good exercise and benefits my health. Thats it for me.

Re "That WILL NOT happen again", how do you know? Like I said, nothing is a guarantee. MA may make you feel more secure, but nothing is going to work against 100% of the people, 100% of the time. You may have more skill at fighting now, but can you be 100% sure what you know a) you will be able to do in any situation b) will definitely work? I haven't seen a MA yet that will definitely work 100% in a fight.

Things do happen to people regardless. I know this and have experience of it myself. To quote from the movie Unforgiven "Deserve's got nothing to do with it". A big part of my own SD study is on the triggers of violence (Gavin De Beckers "The gift of fear" as recommended by Oldman is a great read, for instance). These include factors, like alcohol, that can potentially increase the risk of violence.

Once again Hope, I implore you to listen to what I have said. I will make this very clear: IT IS NEVER THE VICTIMS fault. Please stop attributing arguements to me I am not making.

If people understand the common behaviour the we human animals have (including our own), then this is the most effective path to SD IMO.

Violence begits violence Hope. Did you start MA after you got attacked? What happens if you hurt someone in a fight? Will they want to learn how to fight too? What happens if they go and learn how to fight, then they hurt someone too... Being violent, which fighting is, which most martial arts are( no matter how controlled) will always be at the cost to someone, possibly even yourself. Fighting to me does not = Self Defence. Be it in a dojo, a car park, a stairwell, a fight is a fight. I think it is important to say that if a person thinkgs fighting is SD they are going down a dangerous road.

Full cicle here with this last part: It's up to a person what they want to do.

If you want to respond Hope, we could start another thread or continue on via PM, because we have taken this thread slightly off course. I was the one who started this, I am aware so apologies to the author of the thread. I for one won't comment on this thread again unless it relates specifcally to solo martial arts training.

I have taken the time to read your responses and base my response on what you have said. I would very much appreciate that if someone is going to respond to my posts they do the same.

Thanks.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#424011 - 12/12/09 09:14 AM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: Prizewriter]
von1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 260
Prizewriter,

Hope is not asking how to learn how to go out and attack some one; she is asking how to defend against those that may attack her. This is a legit question. There are plenty of times when a person may not be able to employ non violent SD measures, heck just watch the news, it happens all the time. Look at the prison populations in every country on the planet; they are filled to the brim with predatory scum who victimized some poor sole. It is important to remember that the victim is not fighting, they are defending their health or possibly their life, it is the predator that is fighting not the victim. In a true SD situation the victim is not fighting even if they must become the better attacker.


Edited by von1 (12/12/09 09:17 AM)

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#424249 - 01/03/10 08:53 PM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: Angel Saini]
nekogami13 V2.0 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/10/04
Posts: 2643
Loc: Texas, USA
http://www.runnersworld.com/channel/0,,s6-238-0-0-0,00.html

start there.
Only other thing to do is cultivate awareness of surroundings(exits,hazaards, police presence, etc.)

there is no quick fix. Only options are train to run real fast, spend years training in MA's or getting a concealed handgun permit.
_________________________
I'm sorry, I was just imaging what you would look like with duct tape over your mouth

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#424291 - 01/06/10 10:58 AM Re: How do i learn basic self defense by my self? [Re: Angel Saini]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Tae Bo. Billy Blanks. Total Badass.


Ok just kidding. If the gym you go to offers boxing, start there.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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