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#417658 - 03/28/09 03:41 PM Teaching problems
kingofallbaxters Offline
Newbie

Registered: 08/29/06
Posts: 6
Occasionally my sensei will ask me to demonstrate and coach a group of youngsters in his karate class, something I am happy to do. However, I have noticed a pattern of behaviour with the students which I find very annoying to say the least and I wondered if any experienced teachers had any tips or hints. I seem to spend the lesson continually shushing my students and trying to maintain discipline, it makes me feel like a substitute teacher at an inner city high school and its beginning to get me down. I don't notice any of the other senior students having similar problems. I don't want to just give up (I never gave up on a challenge in my life). I talked to my sensei and he isn't really helping, he just seems to think I will get the hang of it.
Any advice?
Thanks.

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#417659 - 03/28/09 04:06 PM Re: Teaching problems [Re: kingofallbaxters]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:

Occasionally my sensei will ask me to demonstrate and coach a group of youngsters in his karate class, something I am happy to do. However, I have noticed a pattern of behaviour with the students which I find very annoying to say the least and I wondered if any experienced teachers had any tips or hints. I seem to spend the lesson continually shushing my students and trying to maintain discipline, it makes me feel like a substitute teacher at an inner city high school and its beginning to get me down. I don't notice any of the other senior students having similar problems. I don't want to just give up (I never gave up on a challenge in my life). I talked to my sensei and he isn't really helping, he just seems to think I will get the hang of it.
Any advice?
Thanks.






It seems to be that kids either sense you have authority or not, so anything you can do the reinforce that point will help.

My one piece of advice is that if they are misbehaving do not let them continue the behavior, seperate them from the group if they are causing disruption to other students.

It's funny my teacher does one of the best kid's classes i've ever seen, they are spellbound the whole time. It's very much a personality thing and not something I ever got the hang of, so good luck!

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#417660 - 03/28/09 05:15 PM Re: Teaching problems [Re: kingofallbaxters]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3113
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello:

You have made several HUGE assumptions that must be corrected immediately. Children are NOT adults! Expecting adult discipline or silence of them is idealistic foolishness. Unfortunately neither is a little pill to be taken and achieve instant results...

Does not work that way. Children frankly I expect to be kids, not little robots, not little automatons, not "adults" in tiny child bodies. Tell them your expectations, but you have 30 seconds tops... after that you'll begin to loose them. Explain the consequences of correct behavior, and incorrect behavior.

How old are the kids? How many of them? Both will have a huge impact on how things must be presented.


Jeff

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#417661 - 03/29/09 04:26 AM Re: Teaching problems [Re: Ronin1966]
kingofallbaxters Offline
Newbie

Registered: 08/29/06
Posts: 6
Thanks guys, I guess the kids are about 10 years old and there is usually about 6 of them (depending). I have 3 of my own so I am not naive about behaviour / attention span.
I was reflecting on this question after I wrote it and I think I got the emphasis COMPLETELY wrong. I am really more concerned about my lack of authority rather than their behaviour, as I stated no other seniors seem to have this problem so what are they doing that I am not? Is it an experience thing? Tone of voice? Body language? Whenever I ask my sensei he says it's something I will get the hang of over time, but frankly its getting me down.

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#426359 - 04/06/10 01:38 AM Re: Teaching problems [Re: kingofallbaxters]
ScottBolinger Offline
Newbie

Registered: 05/23/07
Posts: 13
just gotta have a little patience with kids. But if they don't want to pay attention and learn martial arts, then go into circut training and minute drills.
_________________________
WarriorRage KickBoxing Federation www.wrkf.us

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#426376 - 04/07/10 12:59 PM Re: Teaching problems [Re: ScottBolinger]
Kathryn Offline
Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 262
Loc: Washington, DC
I occasionally deal with a group of kids at my job, and believe me, once you have their attention, it's overwhelming! If they want to know about something, you can't answer their questions fast enough. I usually start with a big smile and a big hello, and they all say hello back.

It doesn't fit the model of silent teaching, unfortunately. You may have to adjust the teaching method to let them interact with you a little more.
_________________________
Be nice, until it's time to not be nice.

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#426400 - 04/08/10 11:54 AM Re: Teaching problems [Re: kingofallbaxters]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3113
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello kingofallbaxters:

Skill in anything requires time. Being a parent of three crazy was decent preperation in some respects.

Behavior and authority are the same issue. Misbehavior SEEMS like lack of authority, but it is not. If that were so, the best teachers in the universe would never have this pesky "misbehavior". So that belief is fundamentally mistaken.

Misbehavior it is not a reflection on your abilitys or skills. It is children being children. You are the newest, and they did the same thing to your teacher, your peers/seniors as they do with all of us.

What are the SPECIFIC problems you are having... there are lots here who can and will help! There are any number of things/events which make kids insane, nearly impossible to control as a teacher...

If you let yourself get upset by it you get destroyed. Glad to help, and stop beating yourself up its too (#@*@#*@@ easy to do! Knock it off.... grin

Jeff


Edited by Ronin1966 (04/08/10 11:58 AM)
Edit Reason: poor previous editing

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#426401 - 04/08/10 12:07 PM Re: Teaching problems [Re: ScottBolinger]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3113
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello ScottBolinger:

<<just gotta have a little patience with kids.

Nooooooooo, you have obscene amounts of patience teaching children! By comparison make the characture of KING SOLOMEN look like a room full of toddlers in severe melt down mode compaired to us, in the role of teachers.

<<But if they don't want to pay attention and learn martial arts, then go into circut training and minute drills.

Not sure I understand how that works or truthfully what that honestly means in some ways? Can you paint this a little more for us...

Are you proposing wasting training time with meaningless entertainment or filler? Or something else?

Jeff

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#426445 - 04/12/10 10:27 AM Re: Teaching problems [Re: Ronin1966]
tkd_high_green Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/16/05
Posts: 1031
Loc: Vermont
I think he means if they don't want to sit still and pay attention, you make them run until they are too tired to move. etc.

Laura

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#426476 - 04/15/10 10:28 AM Re: Teaching problems [Re: tkd_high_green]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3113
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Laura:

<<I think he means if they don't want to sit still and pay attention, you make them run until they are too tired to move. etc.

Ok, to which I ask the question, why waste time with FILLER activities (eg running) which is totally 100% irrelevent to learning martial arts!

Jeff

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#426478 - 04/15/10 10:52 AM Re: Teaching problems [Re: Ronin1966]
student_of_life Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/12/05
Posts: 1032
Loc: Newfoundland, Canada
running is good for fitness, which has every thing to do with the martial arts. also, i teach kids classes and sometimes the younger ones (4-7 years) just will not focus and if they stand still they talk and play no matter what you say to them. understandable for children, but not what they are there for. i get the kids running, to stop them from standing around idly, and then while they run give them commands like "stop and do 10 sit ups" or push ups or what ever. it gets their minds focused on your voice and your orders again. nothing wrong with it.
_________________________
its not supposed to make sense

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#426487 - 04/15/10 11:06 PM Re: Teaching problems [Re: student_of_life]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3113
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Mark:

Fitness while desirable for "better health" in general again I offer is totally irrelevent to martial arts.

To be effective in martial arts I must be able to move and breath. The ability to do 100 push ups or jog/run a certain distance has zero to do with the ability to protect myself effectively. Self protection does not last that long, nor should it.

Martial sports however are very different creatures...

We appear to have very different philosophies. For me those kinds of activities are emergency measures, a byproduct at best rather than any function of the class itself. But perhaps I have mispercieved your intention using/describing them?

"Militancy", though understandable in some completely articificial respects (IMHO-fwiw) misses the point entirely of martial practices. Worse it is entirely out of context, in that respect is false.

Self-discipline is not found in "group cadences", or the totally artifical "drill instructor" (stereotypical) demeanor. And though a fine pursuit ~strength~ by fitness activities, they are not martial, they are fitness. Fitness is a byproduct of the training never the purpose

Merely my opinion, as always I could surely be mistaken,
Jeff


Edited by Ronin1966 (04/15/10 11:08 PM)
Edit Reason: Grammer correction

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#426850 - 05/02/10 08:34 AM Re: Teaching problems [Re: Ronin1966]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
When I teach I am calm and assertive and I am quick to correct any unwanted behavor from my students. If I see someone folling around I am quick to let them know I am aware of what they are doing. I give them a short gestured look of dissaporval. If the behavor continues I punish them with push ups and continue with the lesson leaving it up to them to catch up. This usually makes them more observant to what other students are doing because they now feel left behind. Believe it or not they are now encouraged to listen and observe for directions.

If a group of kids are causing a distraction I separate them. I remain calm at all times, never let them see you sweat. When ever possible interact with them, pick out students to demonstrate techniques, give positive comments, reroute that excess energy.

In our school the running comes prior to class as part of the warm up prior to stretching.

You cannot allow a student to disrupt a class. You see the bad behavior happening, and you handle it, don't let them break your stride. Keep things moving.

If it comes to the point where the student is just so far gone that he needs to be removed from class for the day. DO IT, remove them. And discuss it with the parents. Don't let the other students suffer, and you keep face in their eyes. Seeing how you handle things immediately they will not act up themselves.

Of course staying calm takes lots of practice, you cannot how anger or disappointment. You want to remain assertive and authoritative. Oozing calm confidence.
_________________________
"Poor is the pupil who
does not surpass his
master" - Leonardo Da
Vinci

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