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#413440 - 12/30/08 01:49 PM Bassai
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
Looking for info on the ending to Bassai. Are there variations to the end? I am seeing shuto strikes on Shotokan sources but I thought there was a different version.

Specifically I am looking for the Shudo-Kan version (Toyama) if anyone is familiar.

Thanks
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#413441 - 12/30/08 05:10 PM Re: Bassai [Re: Kimo2007]
shoshinkan Offline
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Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
_________________________
Jim Neeter

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#413442 - 12/30/08 05:58 PM Re: Bassai [Re: shoshinkan]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
That is very close, it's a Cat stance with a double shuto strike. I have seen other endings as well, mostly minor changes in stance and angle of the strike.

Thanks for the link though, best one I have seen (in terms of matching what I was looking for)
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#413443 - 12/31/08 03:42 PM Re: Bassai [Re: Kimo2007]
shoshinkan Offline
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Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
no problem, glad it was of use.

Passai/Bassai seems fairly consistant with the ending in relation to general principles across the shorin based systems.
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#413444 - 01/02/09 08:13 AM Re: Bassai [Re: shoshinkan]
Dobbersky Offline
Peace Works!!!!
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Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 913
Loc: Manchester United Kingdom
The book advertised on the right hand side of the screen (usually) about The Meanings of Forms & Kata for Adults Level, depicts some really good insight into the Bassai Kata, it explains that within the kata there are no less than 14 neck wrench techniques within the kata

I've not seen them myself but then again I don't actually practice Bassai yet

Thanks Guys

Happy new year!!!!
_________________________
A man is but the product of his thoughts what he thinks, he becomes.

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#413445 - 01/02/09 08:38 AM Re: Bassai [Re: Dobbersky]
Barad Offline
Member

Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 427
Not to be contrary for the sake of it but who really needs 14 neck wrenches, even if they are there in the kata? I think a similar comment was made recently about learning 200 wrist locks. I find a couple of neck grabs are sufficient and enough to practice (varying dependent on where you grab the head and say whether you dig into the eyes or not and which way you want to twist the head also to control or to break).

I know it is tough up in Manchester (lived there until 17) but there must be a limit to how many necks you want to wrench in a week!

Ben

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#413446 - 01/02/09 01:54 PM Re: Bassai [Re: Barad]
student_of_life Offline
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Registered: 10/12/05
Posts: 1032
Loc: Newfoundland, Canada
application on kata can be tricky. just because some one says there are at least 14 neck wrenches dosen't mean there are. it all depends on how you view your application. you could, for example, take the idea that as long as each hand is moving in an opposite direction (past eachother) then you can potentially apply this movement as a neck wrench, or an arm bar ect.

so, take heian shodan, every downward, rising and shuto block could be applied as a neck wrench. infact, even the punches could be neck wrenches. one hand grabs the top of the hair while the other grabs the chin, pull with one hand push with the other and bingo bango, neck wrench city.

or you could be a real inovator and grab some one's hand at the wrist and again at the elbow, then "punch" with the "striking" hand holding the elbow and there you have a quick arm bar. not enough to "break" it, but you get control of their structure.

the same movement can be used for so much.
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#413447 - 01/05/09 09:02 AM Re: Bassai [Re: student_of_life]
Dobbersky Offline
Peace Works!!!!
Enthusiast

Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 913
Loc: Manchester United Kingdom
I agree with you Student

Yeah Barad things are getting tough in Manchester, in the area I'm from even the Rotwiellers walk around in pairs

I perceive this is why there are so many styles of Karate, each having its ethos on how kata bunkai each Karateka having a different view on what techniques mean what

Thanks guys
_________________________
A man is but the product of his thoughts what he thinks, he becomes.

Ken

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#425460 - 02/22/10 11:58 PM Re: Bassai [Re: Dobbersky]
karateka75 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 02/22/10
Posts: 22
check out www.karatecoaching.com i just joined that website and they have a lot of very great and unique ideas about kata, bunkai and much more stuff... i have never seen something like it, really a great thing those guys did put together

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#425484 - 02/23/10 06:13 AM Re: Bassai [Re: Kimo2007]
Ives Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 691
Loc: the Netherlands
Kimo2007,

In our Genseiryu-no-Bassai(-Dai) the last strikes are performed as "Yoko-Nukite-gamae", so they are basically Nukite-uchi.Our 'Sho'-version also has Shuto-uke/uchi. The exact meaning/applications behind it, I don't know, I haven't had a go at these kata.

As for Shudo-kan/Toyama: we study a Wangshu-no-kata (Enpi in Shotokan) form a Toyama lineage in our system.
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Ives

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