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#411727 - 11/22/08 05:56 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: Kimo2007]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Ed -

Quote:

Here's what we should do: go back to the Kyoto meetings that we haven't been to in 8 years, and push for international environmental standards. If a country doesn't meet the standards, or are not moving toward them, then they cannot participate in the global economy in the same capacity as countries that do adhere to the standard. Simple as that. make everyone's playing field even by having the same evironmental standards for all. sortof a Geneva convention agreement or pact, except with oversight.




Exactly. Create progressive standards for all countries to meet. Give incentives to those that do. Create penalties for those that don't. This isn't that difficult.

Why on earth would anyone want to lower the standards? In the race to the bottom, everyone loses. People have got to stop thinking in short-term, me-only, right-now policies.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#411728 - 11/22/08 06:20 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: Christy]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
Quote:

I didn't know there was a "2nd" world.

I always thought it was:

the old world -- Europe & the Middle East
the new world -- North & South America, Australia
the third world -- Africa & Asia




here you go, "rocket scientist" :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_World

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#411729 - 11/22/08 06:43 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: Ed_Morris]
Christy Offline
Member

Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 61
Loc: The D
So I stand corrected.

"rocket scientist" ?

Huh, did you and MattJ get laughed at in the shower after gym class or something?
_________________________
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#411730 - 11/22/08 09:44 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: Kimo2007]
bcihak Offline
Member

Registered: 08/12/07
Posts: 298
Loc: Illinois
My response Ed is that you are not taking in enough information to answer that question. The planet is large and we are not generating enough man made pollution to effect the climate on a global scale. Look to the sun and the oceans to have more of an impact on any cooling or heating of the planet. You know there use to be glaciers all across the northern part of this planet and they melted long before man ever had a chance to effect the climate. That was massive climate change on a level we cannot even imagine. And yet, because of bad science we have to surrender freedom and prosperity to the belief that we are the cause of miniscule changes in temperature that do not even stay consistent year after year. Believe me, you do not want the people in congress regulating anything. They helped crash our economy with their anti-drilling policies, and then they forced private sector banks to give bad home loans to people they would never have given loans to in the first place and now we are in a real mess. As I have heard before from Ronald Reagan, government is the problem. Yeah, kyoto, we are doing better at meeting those standards than the countries pushing us to sign on. I heard that from my right wing sources. Oh, now that the Dems are in charge they are the ones going to bail out the greedy auto industry because one)they want to take it over and two) they want to bail out the auto workers unions. So which side is bailing out the rich fat cats now. let private industry fund their own research. I am tired of tax dollars being poured down rat holes. If the environmentalists are eager to change technology let them pay for it and then make the profit from it. Enlightened self interest will make the changes necassary for the future, not government incompetence. Everyone always complains how corrupt politicians are and yet they always want to give them more and more power over their lives and their freedom. I do not get it. Government only does one thing consistently well. They know how to use force. They don't really do that very well but of all the things they do that is what government does the best.
Bill
( Have a nice Thanksgiving, I am done posting till at least after the holidays. I need a break from you lefties.)

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#411731 - 11/22/08 10:16 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: bcihak]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
yup, the war, the economy, education, mortgage and environment messes all happened as a result of the liberals while republicans were in power for 8 years.
Keep studying your neo-con handbook, memorizing their talking points and parroting their agenda. meanwhile, the 'evil' liberals will be trying to untangle the republican mess left behind.

Expect there will be alot of pardons of his administration on Bush's way out the door....not including the thanksgiving day pardon of just THAT turkey. Have a good one.

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#411732 - 11/22/08 11:42 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: Ed_Morris]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

Huh, did you and MattJ get laughed at in the shower after gym class or something?




This has got to be the most random insult(?) ever.

Bill -

Quote:

The planet is large and we are not generating enough man made pollution to effect the climate on a global scale.




The IPCC report says otherwise.

Quote:

Look to the sun and the oceans to have more of an impact on any cooling or heating of the planet.




The sun and ocean currents do have a significant impact on global warming - but we can't do anything about them. We CAN modify the man-made part. And to not do so is simply lazy and selfish.

Quote:

And yet, because of bad science we have to surrender freedom and prosperity to the belief that we are the cause of miniscule changes in temperature that do not even stay consistent year after year.




The guy that listens to Fred Seitz and co. is telling me about bad science. THIS IS A LEVEL 4 IRONY ALERT! EVACUATE THE THREAD IMMEDIATELY!

Quote:

Believe me, you do not want the people in congress regulating anything.




Ah....belief. I could believe that, or I could research and find out if that was actually true. Turns out that there have been quite a few good regulations that have come about over the years. Civil rights, child labor laws, freedom of information, etc........

Quote:

They helped crash our economy with their anti-drilling policies,




Bill......you do realize that the REPUBLICANS have been in charge lo these past 8 years, right? They? Who do you think you are talking about? And did Congress force GM to build gigantic stupid SUVS, and sell them to the public? And who wanted to deregulate everything?

Quote:

and then they forced private sector banks to give bad home loans to people they would never have given loans to in the first place and now we are in a real mess.




Again, "they". Republicans, you mean.

Quote:

Oh, now that the Dems are in charge they are the ones going to bail out the greedy auto industry because one)they want to take it over and two) they want to bail out the auto workers unions. So which side is bailing out the rich fat cats now.




They want to bail it out for the same reason that the Republicans wanted to bail out the Financial sector - because MILLIONS of jobs (direct and indirect) would be lost if the Big 3 fail. That said, I am against bailing them out, as I was against bailing out the banks. Build stupid cars or make stupid loans, and you deserve to go the way of the dodo.

Quote:

let private industry fund their own research. I am tired of tax dollars being poured down rat holes.




What is your definition of a rat-hole? Do you know how much valuable science has come about from tax-payer funded research? Your a$$ would be dying at 50 in a damp, dark cave without much of that research, junior. Grow up.

Quote:

If the environmentalists are eager to change technology let them pay for it and then make the profit from it. Enlightened self interest will make the changes necassary for the future, not government incompetence.




That you think environmentalists are doing it for profit shows how deeply your right-wing stripe goes. Maybe there is another reason they care............
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#411733 - 11/23/08 12:56 AM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: MattJ]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
It is really amazing to me that after holding the congress for 12 years, and the Oval office for 8 and both for 6. The neo-con right still finds a way to convince themselves, it's the liberals fault for all out woes, even more they refuse to accept any blame at all.

The whole "the government is the problem" is such a crock. We need government, it's the relaxing of controls and deregulation that was at the bottom of the depression and is at the bottom of our issues today.

I am all for free markets, trade and business being free to operate as they need too. But nothing is absolute, you must have order, you must have rules. Business will always operate in it's own best interest, we as Americans cannot afford to allow business to operate against our interests.

That's why we have busniess law, that's why we have regulation. I am all for people getting rich, but history has shown if too much money winds up in the hands of two few people, the society collapes. If you love America, why would you want to see it collapse.

Global warming may be a theory, but the evidence pointing to it being correct is so overwhelming, that no person who is intellectually honest would chose to say it's false...besides isn't it a basic value to say leave the place better or at least no worse then you found it?

Neo cons are people who claim to Love America, but clearly hate Americans. I have respect for conservatives, and agree with many of the ideas on their platform. Neo Cons on the other hand think Barry Goldwater was a liberal, they operate contrary to their own rhetoric.

They are really good at coming up with one liners like "drill baby drill", but are devoid of really long term solutions to the issues we face.

It's time for serious people to drive the boat for awhile, it's time to be Americans, not red or blue, just Americans. The tactics of Rush, Hannity, Coulter, simply have no relevance to the population as a whole. They are not serious people, they are not thoughtful people.

They had their chance, and they blew it big time. Now we have to control the damage and get the country moving in the right direction again.
_________________________
Undefeated in all of Asia!

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#411734 - 11/23/08 02:28 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: Kimo2007]
bcihak Offline
Member

Registered: 08/12/07
Posts: 298
Loc: Illinois
Try Walter Williams at townhall.com for the answers to the economic crisis.

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#411735 - 11/23/08 07:34 PM Re: UN warns of brown cloud threat [Re: bcihak]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
Quote:

Try Walter Williams at townhall.com




Maybe you should try Al Frankin, problem is he is not left enough to balance 8 Walter Williams.

Walter Williams argues on the side of Jefferson Davis in the Civil War (if you can call it that...his words not mine).

Bill you claim you want a civil conversation, but that is not possible when you site the people you chose to site.

Saying we are not civil, has no bearing on the quality of your arguments or beliefs. The people you chose to believe deny math, they deny science. Not because they have evidence but because they have an emotional reaction to anything that does not fit their concept of the world.

The world is round, but I can drop a marble on the ground and it will not roll...that is not proof the word is flat, no matter how much you want it to be.
_________________________
Undefeated in all of Asia!

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#411736 - 11/24/08 03:16 AM Political discussions are now allowed? [Re: Kimo2007]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Clearly and sadly this is a liberal,bias, and leftist leaning group.

This thread is a good indicator of why political discussions are against forum policy.

Yet, the admin and mods allow it no matter how many times I push the buttons,lol.

Yep, I'm the Gun-toting, God fearing Christian all your hippy friends warned you about!!
_________________________
The2nd ammendment, it makes all the others possible. <///<




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