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#408570 - 09/26/08 10:05 AM Death Magnetic
Ayub Offline
heartbreaker, lifetaker

Registered: 11/26/04
Posts: 825
Loc: London, UK
Five years in waiting. An album that could (re)make or break mighty Metallica for good.

Well what did you guys think?! or , or , or , or ( I could do this all day but Ill stop here )

Ill put in my two cents after I hear what you guys think.
_________________________
Cut me Mick!

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#408571 - 09/26/08 02:47 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: Ayub]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
I have conflicting feelings about the album.
For me, it is their best work since 'Justice', I loved the Black Album at the time of its release, but over the years I have come to see it as the most damaging thing that could have happened to the band, combine this with the huge amount of mainstream overplay it recieved, and I cant listen to it anymore. The 90's were just an embarrassment for Metallica, all self indulgence and feather boa's as they struggled to stay relevant in age of nu-matal and the faux-goth revival.
St.Anger was the sound of old men hitting a metal pan and shouting over the top of it.

And so we come to Death Magnetic. Given the last 20 years, it was not going to be difficult for the old formula to sound like a superb return to form, and it does, but put up against 'Ride' 'Master' and 'Justice' and it falls short by a long way.
I also think that most of the songs are old discarded riffs from the late 80's- probably stuff that was toyed with in the studio around the Justice and black albums, but cast aside as 'seconds', only revisited now in the absence of new ideas.
Why do I think this? Because Trujillo is a massively talented Bass player, with a truly distinctive style (just check out 'lights Camera' and 'Art of rebellion' by Suicidal Tendencies), and it is clear that he has had no creative input in this record whatsoever, he is just playing dusted off, re-hashed riffs as he is told to do.

Rubin was too busy counting his cash to get too involved in producing the record, so he kind of set the mix to where he thought Flemming Rasmussen may have put it in the 80's and let them get on with it.

So, the overall effect is like Justice for all, only not as good, but sounding awesome because they have set their bar so low for so many years.
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Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
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#408572 - 09/26/08 04:18 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: Cord]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
It's funny you should mention that Cord. I haven't listened to the album, but I watched a BBC programme recently where Metallica were interviewd. I think it was James Hetfield who was talking about Rick Rubin. Whether he meant to or not, he inferred Rubin left Metallica to their own devices, offering only occasional input e.g. "That song is good, that one is bad, do another song like the first one..."
It doesn't sound like Rubin did much on the producing side.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#408573 - 09/26/08 05:58 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: Prizewriter]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Cord nailed it. And I like it for the reasons you mentioned....everything else they've done recently sucked.

Still, I'll take it. Perhaps Trujillo will be allowed input next time around, though I doubt it.

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#408574 - 09/26/08 06:25 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: JKogas]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
From the one and only song I heard on the radio I am not impressed and haven't been for years. The portion where only the music plays and nobody sings at the end; too long. From just this song I wouldn't buy it nor download it ... even to pi$$ these guys off since they hate people that download music freely.

I have a CD that I've made of the best songs and those are what to me their music is about. The song I heard has a "hint" of it which gave me expectations but were soon deflated.
_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#408575 - 09/26/08 06:48 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: Prizewriter]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

It's funny you should mention that Cord. I haven't listened to the album, but I watched a BBC programme recently where Metallica were interviewd. I think it was James Hetfield who was talking about Rick Rubin. Whether he meant to or not, he inferred Rubin left Metallica to their own devices, offering only occasional input e.g. "That song is good, that one is bad, do another song like the first one..."
It doesn't sound like Rubin did much on the producing side.




interestingly enough, Rubin has never been a 'technical' producer- ever. He cannot work anything over a 16 track mixing desk, and refuses to use email. He is technologicaly ignorant on a practical level. What he has is engineers who can respond to his direction, he is like a conductor of sound, so he sits in with the band he is working with, and will say, 'yeah thats good', or 'you should have a solo there', and then, when it comes to recording, turns to his engineer, and says 'that solo, the guitar should kind of sound rough, but warm' and then the engineer plays around with it till Rubin goes 'thats it'.
He is a fascinating character, and uses a 'fanboy's' ear to dictate final product for the band he is helping.

Back to the album, it does get better with repeat listening, but it sounds forced.

Iron Maiden are currently at the very top of their game, as are Motorhead- this is because they have been settled in their style, and confident in their identities for so long, that they can relax and make music for themselves, safe in the knowledge that fans like what they do. Metallica went in search of the big bucks in the 90's and lost site of who they were, and are now desperate to 'tick boxes' and make 'a metallica album', and it shows.
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#408576 - 09/26/08 07:23 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: Cord]
clmibb Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/31/06
Posts: 1035
Loc: South Texas, US
I haven't really cared for Metallica since they sobered up. Although I aplaude them in their efforts, I think their music was better when they had some "ouside interference".

Casey
_________________________
"It has been said that politics is the second oldest profession. I have learned that it bears a striking resemblance to the first."- Ronald Reagan


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#408577 - 09/26/08 07:39 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: clmibb]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

I haven't really cared for Metallica since they sobered up. Although I aplaude them in their efforts, I think their music was better when they had some "ouside interference".

Casey




Couldnt agree more. Better to listen to thrash created by boozed up, care free hellraisers, than thrash created by yoga trained, 12 stepping soopah starz pretending to be boozed up hellraisers

If you read the 'thankyou' credits on the inlay of master of puppets, they thank 'Carlsberg', 'Absolut' and 'The teenage mutant ninja turtles'

Now I suppose they thank God, the AA and the judge who killed Napster
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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#408578 - 09/26/08 11:56 PM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: Cord]
Ayub Offline
heartbreaker, lifetaker

Registered: 11/26/04
Posts: 825
Loc: London, UK
I think a lot of the criticism towards the album is directed at the band not being as good as they used to be pre-selling out. Now I have made peace with that fact, and if you do that and just listen to the album as an album then you realise it really is quite good. They used to make the highest quality music around IMO, then they flirted with another money making formula that took away from the substance of the music, it seems that they were trying to get away from that and find their roots again with this album. And its great!! But as Cord mentioned it could be because...

Quote:


Given the last 20 years, it was not going to be difficult for the old formula to sound like a superb return to form, and it does, but put up against 'Ride' 'Master' and 'Justice' and it falls short by a long way.




we just havent heard them play their winning style for a while. I think its unfair to compare the album with 'Ride', 'Master' or 'Justice' since those were all master pieces. Many people have taken them going back to older stuff as a negative which is also unfair, its good music so I have no problem with it, 'if it ain't broke dont try and fix it'. To tell the truth, Im actually grateful that theyve made this good album that is reminiscent of older days.

Quote:

I also think that most of the songs are old discarded riffs from the late 80's- probably stuff that was toyed with in the studio around the Justice and black albums, but cast aside as 'seconds', only revisited now in the absence of new ideas.




Not necessarily a bad thing IMO.

Quote:

Because Trujillo is a massively talented Bass player, with a truly distinctive style (just check out 'lights Camera' and 'Art of rebellion' by Suicidal Tendencies), and it is clear that he has had no creative input in this record whatsoever, he is just playing dusted off, re-hashed riffs as he is told to do.




I wasnt aware of this. I havent much of his older stuff. I have just heard Metallica members in interviews going on and on about how much of a positive influence he's had on the band. They constantly mentioned how much better he is than Newstead.

Quote:

I haven't really cared for Metallica since they sobered up. Although I aplaude them in their efforts, I think their music was better when they had some "ouside interference".

Casey




I heard an interview with Kirk Hammett and he mentioned that he has a 'shoe fetish' and that he goes over to Lars' every sunday to 'make him pancakes'. I was like........ this is the guy who wrote the 'One' solo?

Quote:

So, the overall effect is like Justice for all, only not as good, but sounding awesome because they have set their bar so low for so many years.




Probably yes, but I still like it a lot. The vocals on 'That was just your life' are so badass.
_________________________
Cut me Mick!

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#408579 - 09/27/08 04:53 AM Re: Death Magnetic [Re: Ayub]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

we just havent heard them play their winning style for a while. I think its unfair to compare the album with 'Ride', 'Master' or 'Justice' since those were all master pieces. Many people have taken them going back to older stuff as a negative which is also unfair, its good music so I have no problem with it, 'if it ain't broke dont try and fix it'. To tell the truth, Im actually grateful that theyve made this good album that is reminiscent of older days.




That is rather my point though, it is a good sound, but because they have ignored it for so long, it has not progressed, or evolved. Instead, they have just tried to make it 1988 all over again. Its a new album that evokes a sense of nostalgia, and thats not a good thing for them artisticaly.

The reason I used Iron Maiden and Motorhead specificaly as comparison, is because they are bands that pre-date, and influenced Metallica as kids, and are both turning out the best music of their careers now, drawing on their experience, solidifying their sound, and finding they still have the drive and passion for what they do, fuelled by armies of loyal happy fans and critical recognition.

Metallica have had to throw out 20 years of experience, and return to a sound they had all but forgotten in the hope of not being cast as a 'has been' band, and losing their audience completely, along with trying to appease a press that chewed up St. Anger and spat it in a bin.

play this game, as I have- listen to the following, back to back.

Motorhead: Overkill, then Motorizer
Iron Maiden: Power Slave, then A Matter of Life and Death
Metallica: Justice for all, then Death Magnetic

The youngest band of them all sound the oldest.

I would not be suprised if Death Magnetic turned into Metallica's final album. I think they will take the love it generates, send the message 'we can still thrash', and then bow out, because I dont hear anywhere for them to go on this record.

Quote:

Quote:

Because Trujillo is a massively talented Bass player, with a truly distinctive style (just check out 'lights Camera' and 'Art of rebellion' by Suicidal Tendencies), and it is clear that he has had no creative input in this record whatsoever, he is just playing dusted off, re-hashed riffs as he is told to do.




I wasnt aware of this. I havent much of his older stuff.




You should own 'lights Camera Revolution'. Its one of the greatest heavy albums of all time.

Quote:

I have just heard Metallica members in interviews going on and on about how much of a positive influence he's had on the band. They constantly mentioned how much better he is than Newstead.




Well, they aren't going to say 'we treat him like an overpaid session musician, and we just re-hashed riffs from peoples favourite old Metallica tracks' are they?

Quote:

I heard an interview with Kirk Hammett and he mentioned that he has a 'shoe fetish' and that he goes over to Lars' every sunday to 'make him pancakes'. I was like........ this is the guy who wrote the 'One' solo?




Metallica made Spinal Tap become a perverse reality in 'some kind of monster', and whilst they are trying to convince everyone that they are back to being the Bay Area kids they were, it is evident that Ulrich and Hetfield are deeply damaged people, with ego's the size of their bank accounts.
_________________________
Don't let the door hit ya' where the good lord split ya'
http://cord.mybrute.com

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