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#401703 - 08/11/08 10:40 PM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: MattJ]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Lesnar is a tool. Garbage like that ruins the sport for me.

Thanks but no thanks Dana.

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#401704 - 08/11/08 11:40 PM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: JKogas]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
I much prefer sportsmanship to 'attitude', but I cant help feeling that Herring brought Lesnar's showboating on himself. You cant talk consistent sh1t about someone, accuse them of being a joke, and then expect them to be all 'no hard feelings' at the end of it, win or lose.
Add to this that Brock freely admitted that this was his 'make of break' fight, that would decide his future regarding if he stayed in MMA, and what you have Brock giving a beatdown to a guy who deserved it, whilst simultaneously validating his continuation in a world he clearly loves.
I might have showboated too.

At least he didnt 'dig a grave' in the octagon while not knowing if his oponent was OK a la 'Huntingdon Beach bloated baby' Ortiz.

He is big and strong- instantly alienating the general Martial art community, who despise the thought of technique not conquering all.
He is an ex 'entertainment' wrestler, so instantly alienates MMA fans who see him as a poser, or fake or wannabe.

Unlike Kurt Angle, he has walked the walk, and clearly is not afraid of a fight, so I say good luck to him, and to the naysayers, if you want some respect beaten in to him, then go ahead and try- I am in no hurry to join that queue
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#401705 - 08/12/08 07:21 AM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: Cord]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Good points Cord. I didn't realize there had been that much pre-existing smack talk. If that's the case, you deserve to have your mouth shut when you get spanked.

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#401706 - 08/12/08 09:18 AM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: JKogas]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
I don't agree. GSP, Silva, Couture, etc. if suffered "smack talk" would have done it with their fists and then would have left it at that. The difference between these guys and Lesnar ... they have class.
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#401707 - 08/12/08 11:12 PM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: Cord]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Herring probably did deserve it, but it made Lesnar look like just as much an ass as Herring.

As in any sport if somone is that much bigger or stronger, you BETTER be that much better. Your technical ability better 'outweigh' their brute strength.
I know guys like John and Matt know what I'm talking about. I've had 'students' that I could out strike, out wrestle, and roll around in the beginning even they were much bigger and stronger than me, but they had not a clue. When they improved..pfffft...not so much,lol. It sucks.
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#401708 - 08/13/08 01:28 AM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: BrianS]
TheCrab Offline
Scum
Member

Registered: 03/14/08
Posts: 467
Loc: QLD Australia
Agreed with cord, everyone is saying lesnar is an ass for showboating, but herring was giving him [censored] before the fight, so he had it coming.

Quote:

As in any sport if somone is that much bigger or stronger, you BETTER be that much better.



I would consider strength as an advantage, not the decider. Same with technique, and speed, and size. etc. everyones hung up on technique, but being "better" than your opponent doesnt always mean S**t towards who will win

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#401709 - 08/13/08 05:33 AM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: BrianS]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Quote:

Herring probably did deserve it, but it made Lesnar look like just as much an ass as Herring.





Yeah, regardless of what the circumstances leading up to it were, Lesnar is still a tool in my eyes for not taking the higher road.


Quote:


As in any sport if somone is that much bigger or stronger, you BETTER be that much better. Your technical ability better 'outweigh' their brute strength.





And in this case, Lesnar looks so much bigger than everyone else (except for perhaps Kongo) that they almost need another division. I realize the UFC doesn't have a Super Heavyweight division, but perhaps they should? I'd bet that Lesnar has to cut a lot of weight to get in at 265.

Its one thing to be good (which I'm sure Lesnar is a great wrestler). It's another thing to be like a man fighting a boy. Here is a quote from Lesnar himself:

"I wasn't the best technician in amateur wrestling. But I was strong, had great conditioning, and a hard head


.

I think that about sums it up.

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#401710 - 08/13/08 11:50 AM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: TheCrab]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Quote:

Agreed with cord, everyone is saying lesnar is an ass for showboating, but herring was giving him [censored] before the fight, so he had it coming.




Sorry, don't buy it; not one bit.

I don't care if during the pre-fight that $HIT goes on; that is the build up and that stuff happens ALL OF THE TIME. Do you think for once that Lesnar was the only one in this position? Give me a break! Lesnar was a certifiable A$$ and that is the bottom line. One thing to talk down to a fighter afterwards, though is frowned upon, however for antics like he did; that is above and beyond and with only 1 frickin' win in the UFC ... he pretty much label himself. People used to get on Tito for doing his grave digger routine however Tito at that time was continually winning and improving himself and was become a staple in the industry as one of the leading fighters. Lesnar isn't even close to this and should show some more class instead of being an A$$.

"duh ... me big muscle head ... duh ... I don't know any better ... duh"

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"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#401711 - 08/13/08 05:09 PM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: Dereck]
Tom2199 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 834
Loc: England
Brock has a big lame personality just admit it people, Heath deserves a lot of respect guess Brock is just lacking class after all you don't see a spec of it in WWE.
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#401712 - 08/13/08 05:16 PM Re: Heath Herring vs Brock Lesnar *spoiler* [Re: Dereck]
TeK9 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/22/05
Posts: 2257
Loc: Northern California, USA
It was a very boring one sided fight. Heath hearing pretty much survived. He put up no challenge for Lesnar. He was out from the moment he caught that over hand right. I know Hearing is more of a stand up guy, but I would imagine that by now he has some submissions. If I were him I would have gone for a ankle or knee bar lock. Lesnar is new to jui-jitsu and those guys always worry about chokes, armbars and triangles they completely forget about the leg locks. Usually because hardly anyone other than Ken Shamrock uses them.

But a beginner like Lesnar wouldn't have known which way to roll to escape one....I just know it. Reason why i say this is because I myself am also a beginner and I still don't have enough confidence to roll in order to escape a lock.

Brocks does have skill though, he is big, strong, fast, good boxing, heavy punches, great wrestling in my opinion, he is able to control his man. His take downs did not impress me, he often bull dogs his man down. As if he were doing a 4 point football stance. But I guess whatever works, works.

I feel a pure jui-jitsu guy will defeat him.

I was not impressed with Congo's match. I felt he would have been a better opponent for Lesnar.
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