FightingArts Estore
Pressure Points
From a medical professional, straight facts on where and how to hit that can save your life.
Stretching
Limber or not, anyone can add height and speed to their kicks with this method.
Calligraphy
For yourself or as a gift, calligraphy is special, unique and lasting.
Karate Uniforms
Look your best. Max snap. low cost & superior crafted: “Peak Performance Gold” 16 oz uniforms.

MOTOBU
Classic book translation. Hard to find. Not in stores.
Who's Online
0 registered (), 20 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
SenseiGregT, sagat, JFawkes, pluckysaga39, sgtdemeo
22911 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
AndyLA 5
Dobbersky 5
Ed_Morris 4
futsaowingchun 3
ergees 3
September
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12 13
14 15 16 17 18 19 20
21 22 23 24 25 26 27
28 29 30
New Topics
2014 World Championships Chelyabinsk: The Gallery
by ergees
Yesterday at 03:51 AM
Biu Tzu- Snake hand strike
by futsaowingchun
08/27/14 09:02 PM
Chum Kiu 2nd section applications
by futsaowingchun
08/20/14 09:54 PM
2013 World Championship Rio: The Gallery (HD)
by ergees
08/19/14 05:22 AM
Chi Sao demonstration
by futsaowingchun
08/14/14 10:57 PM
Decent Fight channel
by FrankyFruits
08/07/14 09:19 PM
2014 European Championships Cadets Athens: Videos
by ergees
08/07/14 10:00 AM
Life goes on....
by Dobbersky
08/07/14 05:59 AM
An open letter to bunkai researchers...
by Bartfast
08/05/14 04:18 PM
ITF TaeKwonDo or Shotokan Karate????
by Dobbersky
07/10/14 07:14 AM
Recent Posts
2014 World Championships Chelyabinsk: The Gallery
by ergees
Yesterday at 03:51 AM
** Introduce Yourself! **
by Zombie Zero
08/29/14 10:50 PM
mindfullness meditation
by log1call
08/28/14 02:39 AM
Biu Tzu- Snake hand strike
by futsaowingchun
08/27/14 09:02 PM
An open letter to bunkai researchers...
by Ed_Morris
08/26/14 09:58 PM
The Karate punch
by Ed_Morris
08/26/14 09:27 PM
Chum Kiu 2nd section applications
by futsaowingchun
08/20/14 09:54 PM
2013 World Championship Rio: The Gallery (HD)
by ergees
08/19/14 05:22 AM
attacked from behind
by AndyLA
08/16/14 04:59 PM
ITF TaeKwonDo or Shotokan Karate????
by VDJ
08/15/14 05:46 PM
Forum Stats
22911 Members
36 Forums
35573 Topics
432484 Posts

Max Online: 424 @ 09/24/13 10:38 PM
Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6 >
Topic Options
#401348 - 07/04/08 01:46 PM Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT
MAGon Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/22/03
Posts: 1737
Loc: Miami, Fl.
Mexican Cartels and the Fallout From Phoenix

By Fred Burton and Scott Stewart

Late on the night of June 22, a residence in Phoenix was approached by a heavily armed tactical team preparing to serve a warrant. The members of the team were wearing the typical gear for members of their profession: black boots, black BDU pants, Kevlar helmets and Phoenix Police Department (PPD) raid shirts pulled over their body armor. The team members carried AR-15 rifles equipped with Aimpoint sights to help them during the low-light operation and, like most cops on a tactical team, in addition to their long guns, the members of this team carried secondary weapons -pistols strapped to their thighs. But the raid took a strange turn when one element of the team began directing suppressive fire on the residence windows while the second element entered - a tactic not normally employed by the PPD. This breach of departmental protocol did not stem from a mistake on the part of the team's commander. It occurred because the eight men on the assault team were not from the PPD at all. These men were not cops serving a legal search or arrest warrant signed by a judge; they were cartel hit men serving a death warrant signed by a Mexican drug lord. The tactical team struck hard and fast. They quickly killed a man in the house and then fled the scene in two vehicles, a red Chevy Tahoe and a gray Honda sedan. Their aggressive tactics did have consequences, however. The fury the attackers unleashed on the home - firing over 100 rounds during the operation - drew the attention of a nearby Special Assignments Unit (SAU) team, the PPD's real tactical team, which responded to the scene with other officers. A SAU officer noticed the Tahoe fleeing the scene and followed it until it entered an alley. Sensing a potential ambush, the SAU officer chose to establish a perimeter and wait for reinforcements rather than charge down the alley after the suspects. This was fortunate, because after three of the suspects from the Tahoe were arrested, they confessed that they had indeed planned to ambush the police officers chasing them. The assailants who fled in the Honda have not yet been found, but police did recover the vehicle in a church parking lot. They reportedly found four sets of body armor in the vehicle and also recovered an assault rifle abandoned in a field adjacent to the church. This Phoenix home invasion and murder is a vivid reminder of the threat to U.S. law enforcement officers that stems from the cartel wars in Mexico.

Violence Crosses the Border

The fact that the Mexican men involved in the Phoenix case were heavily armed and dressed as police comes as no surprise to anyone who has followed security events in Mexico. Teams of cartel enforcers frequently impersonate police or military personnel, often wearing matching tactical gear and carrying standardized weapons. In fact, it is rare to see a shootout or cartel-related arms seizure in Mexico where tactical gear and clothing bearing police or military insignia is not found. One reason for the prevalent use of this type of equipment is that many cartel enforcers come from military or police backgrounds. By training and habit, they prefer to operate as a team composed of members equipped with standardized gear so that items such as ammunition and magazines can be interchanged during a firefight. This also gives a team member the ability to pick up the familiar weapon of a fallen comrade and immediately bring it into action. This is of course the same reason military units and police forces use standardized equipment in most places. Police clothing, such as hats, patches and raid jackets, is surprisingly easy to come by. Authentic articles can be stolen or purchased through uniform vendors or cop shops. Knockoff uniform items can easily be manufactured in silk screen or embroidery shops by duplicating authentic designs. Even badges are easy to obtain if one knows where to look. While it now appears that the three men arrested in Phoenix were not former or active members of the Mexican military or police, it is not surprising that they employed military- and police-style tactics. Enforcers of various cartel groups such as Los Zetas, La Gente Nueva or the Kaibiles who have received advanced tactical training often pass on that training to younger enforcers (many of whom are former street thugs) at makeshift training camps located on ranches in northern Mexico. There are also reports of Israeli mercenaries visiting these camps to provide tactical training. In this way, the cartel enforcers are transforming ordinary street thugs into highly-trained cartel tactical teams. Though cartel enforcers have almost always had ready access to guns,including military weapons such as assault rifles and grenade launchers,groups such as Los Zetas, the Kaibiles and their young disciples bring an added level of threat to the equation. They are highly trained men with soldiers' mindsets who operate as a unit capable of using their weapons with deadly effectiveness. Assault rifles in the hands of untrained thugs are dangerous, but when those same weapons are placed in the hands of men who can shoot accurately and operate tactically as a fire team, they can be overwhelmingly powerful - not only when used against enemies and other intended targets, but also when used against law enforcement officers who attempt to interfere with the team's operations.

Targets

Although the victim in the Phoenix killing, Andrew Williams, was reportedly a Jamaican drug dealer who crossed a Mexican cartel, there are many other targets in the United States that the cartels would like to eliminate.These targets include Mexican cartel members who have fled to the United States due to several different factors. The first factor is the violent cartel war that has raged in Mexico for the past few years over control of important smuggling routes and strategic locations along those routes. The second factor is the Calderon administration's crackdown, first on the Gulf cartel and now on the Sinaloa cartel. Pressure from rival cartels and the government has forced many cartel leaders into hiding, and some of them have left Mexico for Central America or the United States. Traditionally, when violence has spiked in Mexico, cartel figures have used U.S. cities such as Laredo, El Paso and San Diego as rest and recreation spots, reasoning that the general umbrella of safety provided by U.S. law enforcement to those residing in the United States would protect them from assassination by their enemies. As bolder Mexican cartel hit men have begun to carry out assassinations on the U.S. side of the border in places such as Laredo, Rio Bravo, and even Dallas, the cartel figures have begun to seek sanctuary deeper in the United States, thereby bringing the threat with them. While many cartel leaders are wanted in the United States, many have family members not being sought by U.S. law enforcement. (Many of them even have relatives who are U.S. citizens.) Some family members have also settled comfortably inside the United States, using the country as a haven from violence in Mexico. These families might become targets, however, as the cartels look for creative ways to hurt their rivals. Other cartel targets in the United States include Drug Enforcement Administration and other law enforcement officers responsible for operations against the cartels, and informants who have cooperated with U.S. or Mexican authorities and been relocated stateside for safety. There are also many police officers who have quit their jobs in Mexico and fled to the United States to escape threats from the cartels, as well as Mexican businessmen who are targeted by cartels and have moved to the United States for safety. To date, the cartels for the most part have refrained from targeting innocent civilians. In the type of environment they operate under inside Mexico, cartels cannot afford to have the local population, a group they use as camouflage, turn against them. It is not uncommon for cartel leaders to undertake public relations events (they have even held carnivals for children) in order to build goodwill with the general population. As seen with al Qaeda in Iraq, losing the support of the local population is deadly for a militant group attempting to hide within that population. Cartels have also attempted to minimize civilian casualties in their operations inside the United States, though for a different operational consideration. The cartels believe that if a U.S. drug dealer or a member of a rival Mexican cartel is killed in a place like Dallas or Phoenix, nobody really cares. Many people see such a killing as a public service,and there will not be much public outcry about it, nor much real effort on the part of law enforcement agencies to identify and catch the killers. The death of a civilian, on the other hand, brings far more public condemnation and law enforcement attention. However, the aggressiveness of cartel enforcers and their brutal lack of regard for human life means that while they do not intentionally target civilians, they are bound to create collateral casualties along the way. This is especially true as they continue to conduct operations like the Phoenix killing, where they fired over 100 rounds of 5.56 mm ball ammunition at a home in a residential neighborhood.

Tactical Implications

Judging from the operations of the cartel enforcers in Mexico, they have absolutely no hesitation about firing at police officers who interfere with their operations or who dare to chase them. Indeed, the Phoenix case nearly ended in an ambush of the police. It must be noted, however, that this ambush was not really intentional, but rather the natural reaction of these Mexican cartel enforcers to police pursuit. They were accustomed to shooting at police and military south of the border and have very little regard for them. In many instances, this aggression convinces the poorly armed and trained police to leave the cartel gunmen alone. The problem such teams pose for the average U.S. cop on patrol is that the average cop is neither trained nor armed to confront a heavily armed fireteam. In fact, a PPD source advised Stratfor that, had the SAU officer notbeen the first to arrive on the scene, it could have been a disaster for the department. This is not a criticism of the Phoenix cops. The vast majority of police officers and federal agents in the United States simply are not prepared or equipped to deal with a highly trained fire team using insurgent tactics. That is a task suited more for the U.S. military forces currently deployed in Iraq and Afghanistan. These cartel gunmen also have the advantage of being camouflaged as cops. This might not only cause considerable confusion during a firefight (Who do backup officers shoot at if both parties in the fight are dressed like cops?) but also means that responding officers might hesitate to fire on the criminals dressed as cops. Such hesitation could provide the criminals with an important tactical advantage - an advantage that could prove fatal for the officers. Mexican cartel enforcers have also demonstrated a history of using sophisticated scanners to listen to police radio traffic, and in some cases they have even employed police radios to confuse and misdirect the police responding to an armed confrontation with cartel enforcers. We anticipate that as the Mexican cartels begin to go after more targets inside the United States, the spread of cartel violence and these dangerous tactics beyond the border region will catch some law enforcement officers by surprise. A patrol officer conducting a traffic stop on a group of cartel members who are preparing to conduct an assassination in, say, Los Angeles, Chicago or northern Virginia could quickly find himself heavily outgunned and under fire. With that said, cops in the United States are far more capable than their Mexican counterparts of dealing with this threat. In addition to being far better trained, U.S. law enforcement officers also have access to far better command, control and communication networks than their Mexican counterparts. Like we saw in the Phoenix example, this communication network provides cops with the ability to quickly summon reinforcements, air support and tactical teams to deal with heavily armed criminals - but this communication system only helps if it can be used. That means cops need to recognize the danger before they are attacked and prevented from calling for help. As with many other threats, the key to protecting oneself against this threat is situational awareness, and cops far from the border need to become aware of this trend.
_________________________
Just when you think something is foolproof, they come out with a new and improved type of fool.

Top
#401349 - 07/07/08 12:08 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MAGon]
butterfly Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 3012
Loc: Torrance, CA
Youza!!!!!! Wow.

Top
#401350 - 07/12/08 10:00 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MAGon]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
From the police reports, the mission was to assassinate the drug dealer, and then ambush the police. Only problem... they shot up all their ammo at the assassination, so they couldn't do anything but run from the police when they were in pursuit.

While the cops lucked out this time, it's only a matter of time until they are ambushed and killed while the drug cartels push their influence further into the U.S. A citizen that isn't carrying a concealed weapon these days is checking in as collateral damage when one of these bruhahas erupts in their neighborhood.

Late last year, the Border Patrol intercepted a shipment of automatic weapons that was headed for Los Angeles to arm the Latino gangs there. Anybody that thinks life is still "pre-911" is living with their heads in the sand. While many of the illegals in America didn't come here with weapons, they are arming themselves in large numbers... forming and spreading gang activity, and bringing the drug cartels a foothold in the U.S. The cartels do NOT fear the police, and they don't fear armed citizens... so all the bluster about "empty handed" skills goes right down the pipe when you confront this kind of situation.

A list of the offenses charted on our local law enforcement site in my neighborhood shows that since the first of the year, we've had purse snatching, larceny, drug offenses, assaults, auto thefts, auto burglary, burglary, armed robbery, and murders... "other than that, we're crime free" (famous Marion Barry, mayor of DC quote).

If the hit squads are showing up in Phoenix, they'll be getting around to other places. They've already proved they can... so they'll repeat the exercsie and improve with analyzing what went wrong on this one. It's a dangerous time to be in law enforcement.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401351 - 07/13/08 10:42 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MAGon]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
is it really a surprize, Grady? between the steady domestic funding cuts and lack of border security?

2005
http://www.talkleft.com/story/2005/02/19/638/29554

2006
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/06/14/bush-crime/
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines06/0822-06.htm

2007
http://dpc.senate.gov/dpc-new.cfm?doc_name=fs-109-2-98

2008
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/251/story/38672.html


http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2003/0309.wallace-wells.html

etc. it's not about post 9/11. it's about post Bush/rep.

hey, maybe they are trying to privatize the domestic police force and border security as well. Lot's of money to be made there. How about Haliburton and Blackwater run our war on drugs too?

Top
#401352 - 07/13/08 08:56 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Ed_Morris]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Interesting reply, Ed. When I discuss border security, you label me a xenophobe and racist, but when you cite it as a law enforcement problem everything's cool... I understand.

I'm sure you can Google up something to prove that Bush was responsible for sinking the Titanic as well... but after spending 8 years working on changes in border security politically, and having my neighborhood overrrun with illegals... I'm just not in the mood for your skeptical society meeting today... back to the lurking mode for me.

Hope you're doing well.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401353 - 07/14/08 01:11 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
it's annoying to hear people who voted in the current admin...twice, no less - then complain about the windfall.

keep putting people of political parties that notoriosly under-fund and cut domestic spending to fund special interest wars and base policy-making on highest bidder's wishes.

keep doing that and see what happens. you'll eventually get privitized police forces that firstly, serve and protect the wealthy and their interests.

not to mention, you'll get under-maintained border security, since the wealthy labor bosses and self-serving CEO's pay to make sure enough cheap labor flow thru the border. why? to compete with low-cost China products in a race to the bottom. oops, already have that situation, don't we...which is how the bad guys in this thread's story got across to execute the hit in the first place.

p.s. "I'm sure you can Google up something to prove that Bush was responsible for sinking the Titanic as well" -yes, they say the unexpected iceberg was there due to Bush's refusal to acknowledge global warming.


hope you are doing well also.

Top
#401354 - 07/14/08 02:19 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:

Interesting reply, Ed. When I discuss border security, you label me a xenophobe and racist, but when you cite it as a law enforcement problem everything's cool... I understand.





Heh, well if he labels you a racist i'd understand that completely, since a large amount of what you post is racist drivel about the great unwashed hordes invading from south of the border, and how they're all criminals.

Top
#401355 - 07/14/08 02:13 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Zach_Zinn]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Here's some information from those lying people at the U.S. Justice Department...
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/reportingethnicity.htm

They're probably zenophobes too...

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401356 - 07/15/08 12:17 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
are we to believe the graph? To me it appears it is equal between races?

I am just trying to sort this all out. But I am guessing the graphs aren't totally accurate because not everything gets reported.
_________________________
90 percent of good abs is your nutrition

Top
#401357 - 07/15/08 07:26 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: JasonM]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Jason,
I can only go by what's going on around me and statistical data. I personally have no animosity toward anyone who wants to become a citizen of the U.S. and does so in a legal manner. My circle of friends is very diverse, and despite the characterizations from the skeptics here, there is more evidence to support my characterization of illegals than to support their characterization that they are only "poor people coming to the United States to have a better life".

I spent some time today putting together some statistical data for you, and added some links to other material that you should read. It's not just a "Hispanic" problem, it's a violence problem, and the report I've included on Latin American violence should be a real eye opener if you think about what is written there. Its a study done to recognize the potential for investment in the area, and to recognize the potential problems that could be expected... for instance, the murder rate in Latin America is the 2nd highest in the world... topped only by the African peninsula, where such vacation spots as Darfur and Somalia are located.

Anyway, here's the data... make your own decisions about it.

Per the U.S Census Bureau, the population of the U.S. is 301,139,947 (est.7/07) with a Hispanic population of 44,252,278, or roughly 14.8 percent. The white population is 73.9% and blacks comprise 12.4 %. An estimated 12 to 20 million of Hispanics are illegally in the U.S., so 27% to 45% of the Hispanics are illegals, and already in violation of U.S. law without commiting any other crime.
From crime statistics of the U.S. Justice Department:
More than 6 in 10 persons in local jails in 2002 were racial or ethnic minorities, unchanged from 1996. An estimated 40% (of those 6) were black; 19%, Hispanic, 1% American Indian; 1% Asian; and 3% of more than one race/ethnicity. At midyear 2007 there were 4,618 black male sentenced prisoners per 100,000 black males in the United States, compared to 1,747 Hispanic male sentenced prisoners per 100,000 Hispanic males and 773 white male sentenced prisoners per 100,000 white males.

In 2004 there were an estimated 633,700 State prisoners serving time for a violent offense. State prisons also held an estimated 265,600 property offenders and 249,400 drug offenders.
Half of jail inmates in 2002 were held for a violent or drug offense, almost unchanged from 1996. Drug offenders, up 37%, represented the largest source of jail population growth between 1996 and 2002.
Fifty-three percent of jail inmates were on probation, parole or pretrial release at the time of arrest.
In 1997, Federal inmates were more likely than State inmates to be women (7% vs. 6%) -- Hispanic (27% vs. 17%) -- age 45 or older (24% vs. 13%) -- noncitizens (18% vs. 5%)
(Note: States are prohibited from enforcing immigration law, so Hispanics were released after arrest unless held on felony charges requiring incarceration. Had the immigration laws been enforced, it would have placed 5 times as many prisoners in our prison system as is now currently incarcerated.)
Violent offenders accounted for 53% of the growth in State prisons between 1990 to 2000, drug offenders accounted for 59% of the growth in Federal prisons.
The number of defendants prosecuted for an immigration offense rose from 6,605 in 1996 to 15,613 in 2000. (Nearly tripled in 4 years, and the statistical data is 8 years old) ( In 2000, the estimated illegal Hispanic population was 12 million. At 20 million, the courts would be dealing with over 26000 cases if prosecuted at the same rate.)
According to the National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS),victims perceived perpetrators to be gang members in about 6% of violent victimizations between 1998 and 2003. On average for each year, gang members committed about 373,000 of the 6.6 million violent victimizations, or roughly 6 percent of those crimes.. mostly against other Hispanics. As Latino gangs become established, they spread the crimes out into other ethnic areas and groups.

Hispanic victims of violence identified offenders as gang members at a higher rate than non-Hispanic victims, and blacks at a higher rate than whites, for the period between 1993 and 2003.




According to the FBI's Supplementary Homicide Reports, each year between 1993 and 2003, from 5% to 7% of all homicides and from 8% to 10% of homicides committed with a firearm were gang related. While focused on the Hispanic community for the most part, those homicides were statistically done without naming the race of the victims.

In more recent data, the Police Executive Research Forum issued the following report: Violent Crime in America: 24 Months of Alarming Trends
The PERF statistics are similar to those in the FBI’s Uniform
Crime Reporting (UCR) program in that they are based on law enforcement agencies’ reports of crimes actually reported to the police (as opposed to surveys or other methods of measuring crime).

PERF Warned of a “Gathering Storm” of Violent Crime
The 24-month trend toward increasing violence is disturbing news, because the United States enjoyed astonishing declines in crime during the mid- to late-1990s, followed by a leveling off in the early 2000s. Monitoring the recent crime trends has been a top priority for PERF since the first indications of a surge in violence came to light in 2005.

In August 2006 PERF held a conference to determine whether the reports of increasing crime were merely anecdotal or reflected a nationwide trend, and received overwhelming indications of a nationwide problem. More than 170 officials, including police chiefs and mayors from 50 cities, came to Washington, D.C. to attend PERF’s Violent Crime Summit, and those leaders concluded that there was a “gathering storm” of increasing violence in America.

http://www.city-journal.org/html/14_3_immigrant_gang.html
http://www.emergency.com/gangturf.htm http://teachers.sheboygan.k12.wi.us/tgentine/documents/GangCrisis.pdf
http://www.iadb.org/sds/doc/1073eng.pdf (Be sure to read this)
http://www.policeforum.org/upload/VC%20Summit%2007_full_148192123_1272007111812.pdf The last chart on this report shows that Atlanta (the closest "big city" to Greenville, where I live) had a 47% increase in the murder rate during the scoped time period... which is my cause for alarm. It's driving force is gang activity, and the Latino gangs are thriving in the area.


My apologies for the formatting problems. There must be some hidden formatting in the copy that doesn't come out.
_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401358 - 07/16/08 01:45 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
Great dicussion and statistics and a warning that we have to do something soon or we will continue to suffer this inflex of Crime against our borders, Health care medcial system, Prison system and financail Infrastructure.

I have no problem with law abidng citizen of the USA or future citizens but Immigrants that are impersonating Federal Officers and killing people. Whether its the Russian Mafia or Mexican cartel we have to defend our borders better in order to defend American. Or Beans and Bullets my friends and eventually Chaotic.
_________________________
DBAckerson

Top
#401359 - 07/16/08 02:32 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
thanks for that.

Granted I am not much of a numbers man, and looking at statistics just make my head hurt. But I think I got it and our future doesn't look good.

I don't care who comes here. It is america and they should have a chance just like our parents and our parents - parents. And I know or have heard the system sucks, but unfortunately that is the way they need to go. Come here ther right wawy or don't come at all.

It is horrifying to me to read that SWAT was impersonated by the mexican cartel.
_________________________
90 percent of good abs is your nutrition

Top
#401360 - 07/16/08 10:03 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: JasonM]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
First of all, the problem isn't that poor people are coming here to become citizens and have jobs... it's that they are coming here simply to take jobs and send money back to their country... i.e., sapping the wealth of this country and refusing to assimilate or become legal citizens.

Second, they are exporting their culture of violence here and setting up gangs and drug networks at a rate never seen before by law enforcement. The insistence by businesses to keep the border open is only playing into their hands, and while this is happening, the cost of maintaining these people is rising exponentially. As in my own neighborhood, they simply overrun an area and turn it into a barrio... displacing the existing businesses, overcrowding existing park and entertainment facilities, and setting up their gang activities right out in plain sight.

Last year, there were 23 murders in Greenville County, where I live... 17 of them took place in my zip code. A number of them were "hispanic on hispanic" murders, others were drug related, and still others were "drive bys"... so the accelerated rate of violence isn't hard to find.

When I go out, I carry a gun... high capacity, and usually three clips with either 11 or 17 in it, depending on which gun I carry... and I've already been "bum rushed" at an ATM by a van load of illegals. I didn't shoot any of them, but the sight of the gun being racked told them I wasn't going to be a victim, and they bailed back in the van and sped off.

These gangs are not afraid of police, and neither are the drug cartels. They know that they can outgun most police departments, and since they have almost limitless money, they buy their way into almost anywhere. Most swat teams now are specifically training to handle MS-13 gang members and their tactics.

That report by the Inter-American Development Bank is a real eye-opener, especially when you add the tendency of the drug cartels to simply hire the gangs to do their bidding as they expand. On the gun boards, we say "when seconds count, the police are only minutes away"... which is their way of saying "you're on your own".

I don't really want to get off on a rant over this, because I stay pi$$ed off at the lack of enforcement of ALL laws regarding these people where my neighborhood's been displaced, but make no mistake... it's headed your way. The police intelligence reports are rift with information about how the gangs are "leap frogging" across the country, and there are something like 750 different gangs that have been identified. It's just a matter of time wherever you live.

Oh yes, and I read in the newspaper online today that the illegals weren't leaving when the ICE agents raided and deported their cohorts... they simply moved to another neighborhood... which means the jobs that they're supposed to be here for isn't what's keeping them here. Draw your own conclusions from that.



Edited by wristtwister (07/16/08 10:06 PM)
_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401361 - 07/17/08 02:05 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:


I don't really want to get off on a rant over this, because I stay pi$$ed off at the lack of enforcement of ALL laws regarding these people where my neighborhood's been displaced, but make no mistake... it's headed your way. The police intelligence reports are rift with information about how the gangs are "leap frogging" across the country, and there are something like 750 different gangs that have been identified. It's just a matter of time wherever you live.




To be clear...are you actually of the opinion that most illegals are here as some part of an organized gang movement? Do you actually have statistics that back this concept up? It seems to be what you're driving at.

I grew up in a state where the majority is hispanic in many areas, as with any impoverished group virtually anywhere in this country, there was alot of crime. Not hard to figure out the correlation.

The idea that good whitey white law abidin' merkin' folks like you are having their lives disrupted and diminished by the great Brown Menace is nothing short of ridiculous, and it does nothing but show your true colors when you post like this.

Top
#401362 - 07/17/08 12:58 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

I read in the newspaper online today that the illegals weren't leaving when the ICE agents raided and deported their cohorts... they simply moved to another neighborhood... which means the jobs that they're supposed to be here for isn't what's keeping them here. Draw your own conclusions from that.






How are you drawing that conclusion? Maybe they are simply finding other jobs in other neighborhoods. The vast majority of illegals are here just for that. Wasn't aware the illegals were taking many high-paying jobs, so work for them is not hard to find. Not saying that it's OK, but they are not all gang-bangers and drug dealers. I still think that targeting the employers would stop the whole shebang - no jobs, no reason to come here. But the Bush people like their cheap labor and not having to pay taxes, social security, health benefits, etc.

But what do I know.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401363 - 07/17/08 05:37 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
From talking to the law enforcement people around here, the street gangs are also entrepeneurs. They create businesses and jobs for the illegals using their drug money and then launder the money through them. No, all the illegals aren't "gang members", but they're working for them... whether selling drugs or selling groceries at the Tienda or cars at "Carlo's Used Cars". They're converting money to property and making money off it as well. Businesses give them a perfect place to hide their drug money... and since it's "all Hispanic", it's kept in their community... where they are gaining a deeper and deeper foothold.

It's not necessary for you to believe anything I say... the statistics will speak for themsleves... and my conversations with law enforcement have been very informative about their movements. The gangs are setting up in smaller towns surrounding metropolitan areas where the illegals are flocking to for jobs... like Atlanta, Charlotte, NC, etc. and then they're setting up legitimate businesses in those metro areas with their drug money, where they "service" the whole Hispanic population.

If you bother to read the Inter-American Development Bank report that I linked, you'll understand what's coming with this flood of people. If you don't like their report, go to the one done by the World Bank... it's got the same conclusions. The only thing changing from what's going on in the other countries mentioned in the studies, is that the army isn't doing battle with them as law enforcement.

... back to "lurking mode"...

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401364 - 07/17/08 06:40 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Oy.......Grady, you are not the only one who has contacts with law enforcement. So many of your "conclusions" are just wrong. Most of the illegals around here work under the table for legit businesses - many of them white-owned, I might add. They do landscaping, work in food service, housekeeping, etc. Generally not super-high paying jobs.

And I notice that you avoided my point entirely. No jobs = no reason to come here. Why aren't the employers being punished for hiring and keeping them?

Why indeed.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401365 - 07/17/08 08:00 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Quote:

Grady, you are not the only one who has contacts with law enforcement.


Never said I was... the people I've been talking to are on the police intelligence unit... and by the way, different parts of the country are having different experiences with illegals. This is what is happening in this area per their information... no "conclusions" to it... it's simply what they're working with at the present time.

Here's a clip from the "Tale of two cities" which means the cities have two personalities of violence... one when crime is increasing and one when it's decreasing... and they're tracked in regional trends...

From the report...
Thus, the “Tale of Two Cities” can be seen at
the most basic level: Many departments recorded
decreases in violence for the first half of 2007, but
many departments are continuing to experience
increases in violence.
In an effort to discern any regional trends in
violence, PERF analyzed the data from all 168 jurisdictions
that responded to the survey. The following
patterns emerged:
An increase in homicides, and a decrease in
aggravated assaults, in the southern mid-Atlantic
region (Maryland, the District of Columbia, and
Virginia).
A decrease in robberies in Midwest states (Illinois,
Indiana, Michigan, Missouri, Minnesota,
and Ohio).
Increases in robberies and aggravated assaults
with firearms in a large number of Florida
jurisdictions.
Increases in aggravated assaults in Southern
states (Arkansas, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana,
North Carolina, South Carolina, and Tennessee).
8 — PERF’s Second Violent Crime Summit: “A Tale of Two Cities”
Florida
Increase in robberies
Increase in aggravated assaults
with firearms
South
Increase in
aggravated assaults
Southern Mid-Atlantic
Increase in homicides
Decrease in aggravated assaults
Midwest
Decrease in
robberies
Colorado
Decrease in aggravated
assaults with firearms

From my discussions with the LEO's, the "seed money" for a lot of those "legitimate" businesses you're talking about are actually fronted by the gangs to create a vehicle for laundering money, expecially in businesses owned by people in the Latino community, so don't think that just because the business owner is "legitimate" that he's not using gang money to set up and operate the business.

Another one of the conclusions of the Crime in America report was:

from the report...
Factors Contributing to Violent Crime
PERF’s survey asked participants to assign a ranking
to a list of factors that are often cited as contributing
to violent crime; participants were instructed to
rank the factors (or name any factors not included
in the list) in terms of the impact they have had on
violent crime in their own jurisdictions, especially
any recent increases in violent crime.
As seen in Figure 6, the most highly ranked
contributing factor to violent crime, cited by
more than three-fourths of all responding agencies,
was gangs, followed by juvenile crime. Nearly
two-thirds of all respondents cited impulsive
violence and “disrespect” issues, as well as unemployment
and poverty, and “reentry” issues (the
release of nearly 650,000 offenders from federal and
state prisons every year, and an even greater number
from local jails).


And no, the illegals aren't the only problem, but they are an ever increasing part of it, and the gangs are spreading and getting stronger in all these areas where the gangs are operating.

You said...
Quote:

They do landscaping, work in food service, housekeeping, etc. Generally not super-high paying jobs.




Absolutely right, and if you'll read the IADB report, you'll find that's one of the major contributory factors for the violence being shipped up here from Latin America. Just because it hasn't hit your area yet doesn't mean it isn't on its way. Be patient... it'll show up there, just like it has here.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401366 - 07/18/08 09:47 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Jesus Grady. It's like talking to a friggin wall. Like I said, most of the businesses that hire illegals here are white owned, and not even new. Not "gang seeded".

Still nothing about the business owners? Aren't they the "draw" for most illegals? Stop the jobs, stop the immigration. Not rocket science. Too bad your rich Bush friends are more interested in keeping their cheap labor than "protecting our borders".

Bunch of hypocritical BS.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401367 - 07/18/08 09:23 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Okay Matt, I understand that... it's not the same here and where the gangs are setting up. Here's an article of what's going on here...
http://www.greenvilleonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080718/NEWS/80718025

This is just one example, and there are many others. If you don't have the gang problem yet, feel lucky. I have no doubt it's on its way to where you live if you have a large Latino community. Ignoring it won't make it go away.

You seem to want to act like none of the things going on are happening because they aren't going on where you are. We had a drive-by shooting night before last within half a mile of my house, and these illegals have turned my neighborhood into a war zone... all gang related.

Hey, I'd love for them to bury business owners that hire illegals, and I'd help shovel them in. A high school kid or college kid can't find a part time job because these business owners can use illegals and work them full time for the same money under the table... and this didn't start with George Bush. It was going on when your savior Bill Clinton was getting his wax job in the White House. I was fighting this problem in 1990 and before, and GWB was still running for president.

You seem to think that all the "rich people" are Republicans, and that's not even close. They just tend to use their own money, rather than using government money to get rich... and while we're at it, let me ask you how many poor people ever offered you a job? It's stupid to be jealous of rich people... they are who start and run businesses... and they do it to make money. It's not just George Bush's friends... it's your new Messiah Osama Obama's "friends" too. Look at how much money they've given to Obama vs what has been contributed to John McCain... it's about 3 to 1, plus he's got all three networks doing his PR work for him.

Clearly, you have your mind made up that I'm wrong, so you just don't bother to read the information or apply the facts. I wouldn't try to tell you what's going on in your neighborhood, but I'm sure you know exactly what's going on in mine, despite my description of events to the contrary... so it's not much use discussing it.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401368 - 07/19/08 12:52 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
ever hear of UHaul?


If I'm profiling you correctly:

let me see, you vote people in who open the borders for cheap labor to companies that outsource the higher paying jobs, don't mind those CEO's to get tax-breaks since they'll have more money to influence politicians to keep those borders and outsourcing loops open - yet claim they are creating jobs. you don't want government-funded social programs and infrastructure, on top of that you are a gun ownership and carry advocate....

and you want people to feel sorry that you live in an area with drive-by shootings?

you got exactly what you voted for, ya dope....and you are STILL drumming to their tune. sorry, the only sympathy I have is anyone trying to vote sensably in a red state - they are obviously the unfortunate minority.

Then again, most people voting red in red states just vote for the person who's religion aligns best with theirs - so they will always fall for the wolves in sheep's clothing.

Top
#401369 - 07/19/08 08:28 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Grady -

Quote:

It was going on when your savior Bill Clinton was getting his wax job in the White House. I was fighting this problem in 1990 and before, and GWB was still running for president.




Strawman. I never said Bush started the problem. But his and his party's hypocritical policies are exacerbating it.

Quote:

You seem to think that all the "rich people" are Republicans, and that's not even close. They just tend to use their own money, rather than using government money to get rich




They use their own money to avoid paying taxes, social security and health benefits like they are supposed to, while simultaneously making hypocritical rants about illegal immigration and then begging for the government to pay for stopping the problem? Ok............

Quote:

and while we're at it, let me ask you how many poor people ever offered you a job? It's stupid to be jealous of rich people...




I am not jealous of rich folk that do the right thing.

Quote:

Osama Obama's




Ok, "Shady Grady". WTF man, are you 7 years old or what?

Quote:

Look at how much money they've given to Obama vs what has been contributed to John McCain... it's about 3 to 1, plus he's got all three networks doing his PR work for him.




Or maybe people just think he will do a better job.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401370 - 07/19/08 11:14 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Ed_Morris]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Quote:

and you want people to feel sorry that you live in an area with drive-by shootings?




Never said that as I remember. Yes, I carry a gun to protect myself against the increasing gang violence here... and if history serves us correctly, it was your hero Clinton that let border security go to hell... not GWB... but of course, he's responsible for not closing the hole. We agree on that.

Like most liberals, you want more government everything... but just can't find it in the Constitution... like the social programs you seem so fond of. As for tax breaks for CEO's, rich people create jobs... and unlike you and Matt, who hate rich people, I can't remember the name of a single poor person who's ever offered me a job. If you reflect that attitude wherever you work, I'll be they can't wait to promote you to a higher position... but, of course, then you'd have to hate yourself for making too much money.

Quote:

on top of that you are a gun ownership and carry advocate....




"Punish the evil man; there are no evil tools." ...Thomas Jefferson

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."- Thomas Jefferson

Please circle the one that applies to you... armed ... victim

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."
- Sigmund Freud

"The world is a dangerous place to live, not because of the people who are evil but, because of the people who do nothing about them."
- Albert Einstein

... just a few quotes from some other dummies that didn't follow your socialist gun-control thoughts and policies...

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401371 - 07/20/08 12:17 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

and if history serves us correctly, it was your hero Clinton that let border security go to hell...




Wrong, Grady. Bush Sr. signed the deal with Canada and Mexico in 1992 that led to NAFTA. Clinton simply later ratified it in our country.

Quote:

Like most liberals, you want more government everything




Sorry, who wants the government to fix the "immigration problem"? Smells like hypocrisy!

Quote:

and unlike you and Matt, who hate rich people, I can't remember the name of a single poor person who's ever offered me a job.




Pathetic strawman argument. I hate hypocrites and irresponsibility. Rampant in the current administration.

But doesn't it strike you as odd that some rich people aren't offering jobs to "real Americans"? Why is that? Possibly because they're cheap and greedy? This is why your logic doesn't make sense. You want to protect a$$hole rich people so they can give jobs to.......... *dunh dunh DUNNNNH!* illegal immigrants. But I thought you didn't like the illegals. So which is it?

Punish the business owners, and the illegals will go away.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401372 - 07/20/08 02:16 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:


"The world is a dangerous place to live, not because of the people who are evil but, because of the people who do nothing about them."
- Albert Einstein

... just a few quotes from some other dummies that didn't follow your socialist gun-control thoughts and policies...






Hi, I thought i'd point out that Albert Einstein was known as a bit of a socialist in his time, ironic given your use of his quote here.

Anyway, i'll let you get back to your stereotypical quoting and bad arguments now.


Edited by Zach_Zinn (07/20/08 02:19 AM)

Top
#401373 - 07/21/08 09:57 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Zach_Zinn]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Thanks Zach... even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while... even a socialist squirrel.

Ignoring the facts don't change them, and refusing to acknowledge the data doesn't make it go away. While all you pro-Democrat liberals have the world figured out in your minds (wherever they are), the rest of us are left dealing with reality.

While the money is being spent in the wrong wars, the deaths by illegal aliens is a growing problem in this country. Three people were murdered by one of them in San Francisco (sanctuary city) just this week, but I don't hear any of you guys raising as much hell about that as you do my particular law enforcement bent.

Try reading this article and actually thinking for a change... not just spouting your liberal blather back at me. If you don't see a problem, have your city turn into a sanctuary city... maybe one of the illegals will solve the problem.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53103

You and Matt and Ed need to snuggle up to these guys... they need you defending them.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401374 - 07/22/08 08:13 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
I'm not defending criminals. But I'm also not in favor of creating another "solution" to a problem that wasn't a big deal to begin with. You know, like say.........Iraq?

*Most* illegals are just here for jobs, and they're here because rich a$$holes would rather give jobs to illegals than Americans, to avoid paying taxes, social security, etc.

So go snuggle with yourself.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401375 - 07/22/08 08:48 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
ya know. Isn't it Ironci. How the mexicans are "taking over". really they are just coming back home because of the white man taking their land. But at that time they were Indians.
_________________________
90 percent of good abs is your nutrition

Top
#401376 - 07/23/08 08:00 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: JasonM]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
In a time where there were few if any formal governments, everybody got shoved off their land. Today is a different situation. Having had a prior claim to a piece of property in eons gone by doesn't give anybody the right to invade an established country and set up shop. Otherwise, us "pilgrims" could go back to England and just overrun a neighborhood like the Latinos think they can do here... and by the way, the border country where Mexico and the U.S. settled the border issues years ago don't involve countries like Salvador, Costa Rica, Venezuela, etc. that is supplying a significant number of the hoodlums moving in on this horde. What part of Ohio and New York belonged to Mexico?.. absolutly none... so the argument's specious.

The problem is the culture of violence that is arriving with the Latinos, and their draw on the resources of America. If you can't understand that, it wouldn't matter how much information you get... and that's not rant, just fact.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401377 - 07/23/08 09:25 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
I can't say in Northern VA I have seen much violence first hand. The occasional MS13 painted here and there. But what I do see is the mexicans coming here and doing what they want. Not all but most. The biggest thing that urks my nuggets is them driving here illegally and thinking they are on a dirt road. Oh wait, that might just be most of DC drivers anyway.

In any event, I don't care if they come, just come into the country the right way and legally.
_________________________
90 percent of good abs is your nutrition

Top
#401378 - 08/11/08 12:54 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: JasonM]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
I've been sitting on this for a few days to wait for the actual results to be announced, but our Law Enforcement Center has just reviewed the cases of all incarcerated illegals, and is dispatching them for deportation to ICE. The report is that there are "dozens" of them being sent for deportation and the crimes list was as follows:
Facts On Illegal Immigrant Inmates At Greenville Detention Center:


The illegal immigrants in the Greenville County Detention Center came from:

Mexico
Guatemala
Uruguay
Costa Rica
United Kingdom

The charges against them include:

Felonies:

Stalking
Criminal sexual conduct with a minor
Murder
Accessory After The Fact Of A Felony
Trafficking Cocaine
Carjacking
Trafficking in force labor
Trafficking/distribution drugs
Armed robbery
Burglary 1st & 2nd Degree
Felony DUI
Financial ID card fraud
Escape From Custody
Autobreaking
Lewd act on a minor
Child neglect
Resisting arrest

Misdemeanors:

No drivers license
DUI
Open container
Public drunkeness
Disorderly conduct
Assault and battery
Shoplifting


Again, just hard working illegal immigrant criminals trying to make a better life for themselves... yeah, right...

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401379 - 08/11/08 01:38 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
What is your point, Grady? We have been over this umpteen million times before. *MOST* illegals are here for jobs, not to commit serious crimes. Why aren't you writing your government officials to get laws passed to punish business owners that hire illegals? No jobs, no more problem.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401380 - 08/15/08 08:45 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
Mattj-Yeah MAttj, and usually that means breaking the law in any way they need to to get as easy a break as possible. You saying we should turn a blind eye to all the scams they pull and crimes they commit because "they just want to make a better life for themselves?" In my town, it is extremely difficult to get a job if you don't speak spanish and aren't latino/a or just a pretty white girl for them to gawk at all day and make passes at. And do you have any idea how often they cheat the system to get extra stuff?
I worked in a grocery store for awhile, and watched people who didnt speak a word of english come through and get enough groceries for 3 families and drive away in brand new cars. They come here illegally, crap out a bunch of kids, cheat the system to live and then spend what they make actually working on brand new stuff. It drove my supervisor nuts. Why can't you guys see this in an objective light (and look at the statisics even though numbers are certain a scary thing, especially when they prove a point contrary to yours).
_________________________
Member of DaJoGen MMA school under Dave Hagen and Team Chaos fight team under Denver Mangiyatan and Chris Toquero, ran out of Zanshin Martial Arts in Salem Oregon: http://www.zanshinarts.org/Home.aspx,

Top
#401381 - 08/15/08 09:57 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Stormdragon]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

You saying we should turn a blind eye to all the scams they pull and crimes they commit because "they just want to make a better life for themselves?"




Where did I even come close to saying anything about turning a blind eye? Are you reading anything or just making knee-jerk reactions? Don't put words in my mouth.

Quote:

In my town, it is extremely difficult to get a job if you don't speak spanish and aren't latino/a or just a pretty white girl for them to gawk at all day and make passes at. And do you have any idea how often they cheat the system to get extra stuff?




Now you're just being racist. White people never cheat the system? Don't be naive.

Quote:

I worked in a grocery store for awhile, and watched people who didnt speak a word of english come through and get enough groceries for 3 families and drive away in brand new cars. They come here illegally, crap out a bunch of kids, cheat the system to live and then spend what they make actually working on brand new stuff. It drove my supervisor nuts. Why can't you guys see this in an objective light (and look at the statisics even though numbers are certain a scary thing, especially when they prove a point contrary to yours).




Stormy - You probably don't want to lecture me about objectivity. If they're so bad, why do so many Americans HIRE THEM? What you and WT aren't getting, is that there are two types of illegals here. Both types are here illegally, but one is here for the purpose of supporting themselves or their family in an otherwise legal way. The other type are pure criminals (gangsters, drug sellers, etc). They are not all the same, because AMERICANS wouldn't be hiring them if they were all dangerous criminals. I have never disputed that SOME illegals are dangerous criminals - just like some whites are. And I don't support illegal immigration, either. But punishing otherwise well-intentioned illegals without punishing the business owners that hire them (thus drawing them here) is incredibly hypocritical. Isn't HIRING illegals illegal, too?

If you guys were REALLY interested in stopping illegal immigration, then you would want to stop what is drawing them. But that would admit that your conservative buddies in the current administration are really a bunch of pro-rich, pro-illegal immigration hypocrites who prey on people's fears to get votes while stabbing them in the back at the same time. Why is it "extremely difficult to get a job if you don't speak spanish and aren't latino"?

Why indeed. Are business owners being forced at gunpoint to hire illegals? Are they hiring drug lords and gangsters?

Open YOUR eyes, dude. The answer is staring you right in the face, and it's wearing an American flag.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401382 - 08/16/08 07:06 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Sorry Matt, you don't get off that easy. There aren't "two different types of illegals here"... they're illegals... period. Some of them have jobs, some of them are career criminals, and some of them are just as described... here to suck on the public teat while pumping out "anchor babies".

While you're busy standing up for them, we have people here being killed by drunk drivers that are illegals, crimes being committed by illegals, and illegals that are doing nothing more than trafficking in people. The people who hire them are no less criminal than the illegals, and should be prosecuted, and in fact we just did have a major "white slave" case prosecuted here. You want to justify bad behavior by comparing it to other bad behavior, and creating some kind of moral relativism to justify your position.

These people are NOT here to become citizens... they want to bring the same corrupt culture that is pervading Mexico, and Central America and skirt our laws in the process. Where the problems come in is when they displace entire neighborhoods like they have mine, start their Latino gangs up, and think that American citizens are supposed to sit still and put up with it.

When one of them kidnaps and rapes your child, and the Mexican consulate shows up to explain to the court that "its just a cultural thing", you might acquire a different attitude. That happened about 50 miles from here last week.

As for this being driven by
Quote:

your conservative buddies in the current administration are really a bunch of pro-rich, pro-illegal immigration hypocrites who prey on people's fears to get votes while stabbing them in the back at the same time


. You might need to look around a bit more.

This is not only happening here, it's happening all over the world... USA, England, Europe... and it's being driven by international corporations, not conservatives, liberals, or anything except iternational conglomerates. It's only a local problem when its your neighborhood.

Glad to see you're so "welcoming" that you don't mind a few drug cartel hit squads coming to town to shoot up a place like Phoenix. Maybe when its in New Jersey, you'll start to worry a bit more... or maybe Pennsylvania. Why don't you go to the border and hold it open for them?


_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401383 - 08/16/08 07:15 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:


Open YOUR eyes, dude. The answer is staring you right in the face, and it's wearing an American flag.





Quoted for truth lol.

I also find it hilarious when people with more recent immigration in their area try to lecture those of us that have lived around illegals for the better part of our lives (I grew up in the southwest!) about how dangerous and scary they all are, you guys aren't living in reality.

Claiming all or a majority or dangerous criminals is pretty much just racism, you can try to justify it however you want, but it's pretty much just textbook bigotry.

witness:

Quote:


they want to bring the same corrupt culture that is pervading Mexico, and Central America




You honestly think that most illegals fit the above definition and that's why they're here? Then you are a straight-up bigot and nothing more.

Where the do you get off categorizing such a large group of people with one stroke?


P.S. All whites from south carolina are stupid rednecks with 5 buick skylarks up in bricks in their front yard existing off of government cheese and moonshine.

Two can play at this game!





Edited by Zach_Zinn (08/16/08 07:30 PM)

Top
#401384 - 08/16/08 08:19 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Zach_Zinn]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
*sound of MattJ headbutting wall 47 times*

Grady -

Quote:

Sorry Matt, you don't get off that easy. There aren't "two different types of illegals here"... they're illegals... period.




I believe I did say they were illegals. I was referring to their intentions. Some are here for jobs, some are here to commit crimes.

Quote:

You want to justify bad behavior by comparing it to other bad behavior, and creating some kind of moral relativism to justify your position.




And you want to punish one kind of criminal based on their race, and not the other.

Quote:

These people are NOT here to become citizens...




That may be true. But many are coming here simply to support themselves or their families back home. Which brings me to......

Quote:

they want to bring the same corrupt culture that is pervading Mexico, and Central America and skirt our laws in the process.




Couldn't be more wrong. If anything, most are trying to ESCAPE that culture, and make a better life for themselves. And they are able to, in many instances, because AMERICANS HIRE THEM. Why do Americans hire them? Not because they are evil criminals. Because they will work as hard or harder, for less money and no benefits. If the opportunities (ie; jobs) weren't here, they wouldn't be here as much.

Quote:

Where the problems come in is when they displace entire neighborhoods like they have mine, start their Latino gangs up, and think that American citizens are supposed to sit still and put up with it.




Why are Americans getting displaced? See my point above.

Quote:

When one of them kidnaps and rapes your child, and the Mexican consulate shows up to explain to the court that "its just a cultural thing", you might acquire a different attitude. That happened about 50 miles from here last week.




Wow. Pay attention, kids. This is pure, old-school racism. Take a good look so you know it when you see it.

Quote:

This is not only happening here, it's happening all over the world... USA, England, Europe... and it's being driven by international corporations, not conservatives, liberals, or anything except iternational conglomerates. It's only a local problem when its your neighborhood.




Ahhh! Now this is old-school conspiracy theory.

Quote:

Glad to see you're so "welcoming" that you don't mind a few drug cartel hit squads coming to town to shoot up a place like Phoenix. Maybe when its in New Jersey, you'll start to worry a bit more... or maybe Pennsylvania. Why don't you go to the border and hold it open for them?




This sh1t is just funny!

Zach -

Quote:

P.S. All whites from south carolina are stupid rednecks with 5 buick skylarks up in bricks in their front yard existing off of government cheese and moonshine.




ROFL. You said what I was thinking, but didn't have the balls to write out!
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401385 - 08/16/08 09:05 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
You guys are hilarious... everybody that disagrees with you is a racist. Try something that actually addresses the problem, not just screaming "racism" and then retreating to your thrones...

... and if you knew anything about the South or South Carolina, you'd know that no self respecting redneck would be caught dead in a Buick Skylark... at least we're not still using the horses and buggies like you "plain" guys in Pa.

BTW, those illegals aren't trying to escape that culture... they're bringing it with them. They've already tried organizing the kidnapping rings down in Florida, just like in Mexico City. Be patient... it'll drift your way.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401386 - 08/16/08 09:23 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:

You guys are hilarious... everybody that disagrees with you is a racist. Try something that actually addresses the problem, not just screaming "racism" and then retreating to your thrones...




I'm calling you a racist because you are saying things that are racist, and acting like a racist. Not everyone who's upset about illegal immigration presents their arguments the way you do.

I personally don't care about the "problem" the way that you do, so I don't need a solution of the type you seem to be seeking.

Like Mattj, I think people like you are first to blame (among other things) economic issues on illegal immigration when it's your buddies who like their cheap labor making things the way they are.

Quote:

... and if you knew anything about the South or South Carolina, you'd know that no self respecting redneck would be caught dead in a Buick Skylark... at least we're not still using the horses and buggies like you "plain" guys in Pa.




Thankfully I don't know much about the south HA! Anyway I live in WA, and NM before that.

Quote:


BTW, those illegals aren't trying to escape that culture... they're bringing it with them. They've already tried organizing the kidnapping rings down in Florida, just like in Mexico City. Be patient... it'll drift your way.






Once again dude, I don't need anything to "drift my way" I grew up in a state (NM) with plenty of illegal immigrants and in fact i've known quite a few, and needless to say like any group they have their share of scumbags, however unlike you I can use my brain well enough to determine that it's a minority of them behaving like that. As a kid I had friends who were likely illegal, neither them or their families were anything like what you're describing.

You write things like the above where you basically are calling all illegal immigrants from south of the border criminals, and you wonder why people might think you're being racist? Dude wake up!

If you don't wanna be called that then stop generalizing about an huge group of people (who happen to be of a similar ethnic group) being criminals.

Top
#401387 - 08/16/08 09:51 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Zach_Zinn]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Quote:

I personally don't care about the "problem" the way that you do, so I don't need a solution of the type you seem to be seeking.




I'm sure of that... but only because they aren't shooting up your neighborhood.

Quote:

You write things like the above where you basically are calling all illegal immigrants from south of the border criminals, and you wonder why people might think you're being racist?




Here's a little light reading for you... as I've said before, you'll get concerned when it drifts your way...
http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/myfox/pages...mp;pageId=3.2.1

http://www.silobreaker.com/DocumentReader.aspx?Item=5_891691796

http://www.articlesbase.com/causes-and-o...ers-467786.html

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/fls/PressReleases/080129-01.html

http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/64138

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,59841,00.html


Think for a change... it might be a new experience.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401388 - 08/16/08 10:16 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Man you just don't listen do you? I grew up around exactly the kind of illegal immigrant communities you are all the time ranting about, including the gang activity, and I have the brain to not paint people with one brush based on ethnicity, which is exactly what you're doing.

I have probably been around more gang activity in the area of Albuquerque I grew up then you will ever see in your life in the good 'ol souf man, don't try to lecture me on it.

Those links do absolutely nothing to prove your point, one was about the bloods and had absolutely nothing to do with illegal immigration...jeez do you even read you own sources?

In the time I lived in NM there was alot of violent crime, there was a guy out in northern NM who had a ton of bodies buried near his trailer, turns out he'd been luring, torturing, and killing women out there for years. He was white. So why is your article on the raping and beheading of the girl anymore a indictment on Mexicans than this guys crimes were on whites? People do evil sh*t all the time, you can't just post an article about one group of people doing something evil and claim it represents them as a whole.

As such an expert on gang activity i'd expect you to at least have more coherence than what's shown here. The time link doesn't work for me btw.

Quote:


Think for a change... it might be a new experience.




Maybe you should try the same, you don't even seem capable of connecting articles like these to your contention that basically all or most illegals are criminals, and certainly these articles don't prove that point, or even try to.

And here's some reading for you Chicken little:

http://www.fbi.gov/page2/jan08/ucr_statistics010708.html


Edited by Zach_Zinn (08/16/08 10:24 PM)

Top
#401389 - 08/16/08 10:19 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Grady -

Quote:

You guys are hilarious... everybody that disagrees with you is a racist. Try something that actually addresses the problem, not just screaming "racism" and then retreating to your thrones...




I have repeatedly offered an address to the problem. STOP HIRING ILLEGALS AND THEY WILL GO AWAY. The hardcore drug criminals/gangsters you refer to did not come here for jobs, and will not go away in any case, any more than the white ones will.

If you truly aren't racist, I apologize. But you certainly come across that way.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#401390 - 08/19/08 08:54 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: MattJ]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Clearly we disagree about what's going on, and I'm cool with that. The Mexican in my Aikido class doesn't seem to think I'm racist, but what do I know? Anyway, I'm only answering this post because I thought you might like to know why I find the "culture shift" alarming... posted on Reuter's yesterday...
Quote:

More than 2,000 people have died this year in Mexico's drug war, mostly between rival gangs, in a fight for control of smuggling corridors into the United States.





http://www.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUSN18446913

What is going on, is that the cartels are setting up their "anchor points" or "bases" in the U.S. The incursion into Phoenix was just an example of how brazen these guys are, and it's only going to get worse.

Think of it this way... less people died in Baghdad in a declared war since the first of the year than in Mexico in the drug war. There's a lot going on, and the illegal migration is bringing both the drug cartels and drug gangs, along with terrorists who are filtering into the population pouring over the border.

Law enforcement has been able to keep it under control so far, but it's getting out of hand for them. They're outgunned, outmanned, and the criminals have the element of surprise working for them... they know where they're functioning, and the police have to wait to see where the damage occurs. It's not a pretty picture, and it's coming... ignoring it because you think the illegals are only here to work is really naieve.

The rich Central Americans are coming here to flee the drug wars and corruption there, and the criminals are simply following the money... which they get by kidnapping and selling drugs. Just like the 12 million illegals didn't show up overnight, this problem won't suddenly show up either. It'll take time for them to organize their gangs, buy their businesses, etc. to get set up, but it's coming.

I'm going off the boards now. Take care of yourself and keep training.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#401391 - 08/19/08 10:41 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: wristtwister]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Stormdragon,

Wow dude, never knew you for such a racist. You want Matt to look at it objectively? You are putting everyone that's not white in a barrel and giving them the same label. Learn more about what's really going on rather than just reacting emotinally at what you perceive.

Grady,

No surprise here, still an ignoramous racist. I read back two months in this thread. Dude, you need serious help.

Here in Norhtwest Arkansas Hispanic population has increased over 300% in the last ten years, mostly because of the poultry industry (not the gang related drug dealing poultry business either). Tyson owns most of them, but they can hire hispanics for 10$ an hour or less. You want to work busting your ass for that Grady? I don't. They also do alot of landscaping and have about 40 dozen mexican restaurants,lol. A few of them are pretty darn good!

The school my kids go to is about 75-80% hispanic. They have two teachers per class because of the language issue, this bothers me too,but it doesn't make me hate all hispanics.

Another school only 5 miles away is abot 95% white kids. They are mostly upper class too. Yep, there IS a problem here, it's called FEAR. That's the deep seeded problem for you and storm too, just plain ol' FEAR!!!

BTW, there are no drive-by's and gang shootings every other night here either, strange isn't it?

You guys need to get over your fear, seriously.

Most are here for a better life, not to take yours. They are not here for gang initiation, to take your job, or impregnate white women with their potent hispanic seed.

BTW Grady and Sorm, Are you guys American Indian? Why don't you kick yourself out,you're an immigrant too!!!
_________________________
The2nd ammendment, it makes all the others possible. <///<




Top
#401392 - 08/20/08 12:12 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Zach_Zinn]
Spade Offline
Member

Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Auburn, Al.
I'm curious how many of you guys have actually worked along side these people?


I've worked with ILLEGAL Mexicans, and Indonesians.


Some of the Indonesians I worked with had a bit of an attitude, but only about 20%. They worked to send money home to their families.


The Mexicans I worked with I never had a problem with, we all got along just fine, no one tried to sell me drugs, stab me, or shoot at me, most were very kind to me.

However I do know they ALL cheat the system (the blacks too) and you know what?

White people cheat the system too, give a man an opportunity to gain wealth, he'll most likely take it.

these are from MY very LIMITED experiences.
_________________________
"always paddle your own canoe." - Cord

Top
#401393 - 08/20/08 01:04 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: Spade]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
Quote:


However I do know they ALL cheat the system (the blacks too) and you know what?





The above has to be the most racist comment I heard. Then trying to justify it by saying whites do it too? Are you serious?

And not ALL mexicans and blacks cheat the system. Not everone cheats the system to includes whites.

What an ignorant comment.
_________________________
90 percent of good abs is your nutrition

Top
#401394 - 08/20/08 12:25 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: JasonM]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Jason,

Did you read wrists posts? Those are racist comments. I didn't see Spade's comment as racist. Maybe you read it wrong.

I think Spade is trying to get across the point that all races have people in them that break the law and I agree with that. No one is better than anyone else here regardless of race.
_________________________
The2nd ammendment, it makes all the others possible. <///<




Top
#401395 - 08/21/08 12:17 AM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: BrianS]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
Honestly, I am not to sure if Wrist are. But spades I viewed as because he outlined and made a point to say blacks cheat the system and put ALL in there.

So I wasn't mistaken, I asked my wife, who is balck for her point of view and she felt the same way.
_________________________
90 percent of good abs is your nutrition

Top
#401396 - 08/21/08 01:37 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: JasonM]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Well Jason, think what you want. I'm not going to argue with you. Apparently arguing gets you banned around here for some reason. Let's all hug. Lollipops and rainbows dancing by a teddy bear!!! la la la la,....

_________________________
The2nd ammendment, it makes all the others possible. <///<




Top
#401397 - 08/21/08 02:12 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: BrianS]
JasonM Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 2502
I never reply to this post or any to argue. I know not everying feels/thinks the same. Imagine what a boring place it would be if we did. I am pretty relaxed and usually read and have been reading this one. I didn't feel it was my place to comment. But that statement by spade just stuck out at me.

It might have been different if he said ALL people cheat the system, which all due but to identify one race (black) just didn'it sit well.

Maybe he ain't but I percieved it that way. And I am sure a lot of this is perception anyway.

I don't believe wrist to be racist, I could be wrong. I mean I have a problem with people that are here illeglally too, not just mexicans. Shoot, even if you come here illeglally follow the rules. It is interesting, because my wife and I feel differently becuase her grandfather was run over by an illegal with no license and ran a red light. So, i can understand and see where wrist is coming from. Or why he would feel the way he does.

Just my thought.

and can I have a lollipop now.
_________________________
90 percent of good abs is your nutrition

Top
#401398 - 08/21/08 02:49 PM Re: Mexican cartel hit squad impersonating SWAT [Re: JasonM]
Zombie Zero Offline
Compliance & Liability
Veteran

Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 1991
Loc: Lorton, VA
This thread has become disgustingly nationalist, racist, and political. It should have been locked long ago, and I'm sorry I didn't notice until now.

I have grounds to ban several people in this thread, but for now, I am going to privately issue final warnings.

For now, this thread is done.
_________________________
In my walk in the martial way, my hope is that as long as I live, I will always be a beginner.

Top
Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6 >


Moderator:  Cord, Fletch1, MattJ, Reiki 




Action Ads
1.5 Million Plus Page Views
Monthly
Only $89
Details

Fight Videos
Night club fight footage and street fights captured with the world's first bouncer spy cam

How to Matrix!
Learn ten times faster with new training method. Learn entire arts for as little as $10 per disk.

Self Defense
Stun guns, pepper spray, Mace and self defense products. Alarms for personal and home use.

TASER MC26C
Stop An Urban Gorilla: Get 2 FREE TASER M26C Replacement Air Cartridges With Each New TASER M26C!

 

Unbreakable Unbrella

krav maga