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#399012 - 06/11/08 11:42 AM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: IExcalibui2]
Semper_Fi Offline
Newbie

Registered: 06/11/08
Posts: 18
Loc: Arlington, VA
For the most part I think I am balanced enough to adapt to what's thrown at me.

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#399013 - 06/11/08 12:51 PM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: Semper_Fi]
matxtx Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/12/05
Posts: 700
Loc: england
I would like that to throw out that drills are as important as sparring.Possibly more so.IMO.
If you spar its random as to what will come at you.So if your bad at something,like being on the bottom grappling with striking allowed also,you might have to wait ages for that situation to come up in a spar.If it does at all..Then it might not happen for long.So you have not learnt what to do or got used to it.
Plus your only as good now as the opponent at that time.

But you can create a drill where your in that situation and do it over and over.And you can go at more intense realistic levels after getting used to it.
Half the story is not panicking and being able to be calm and say ''I can cope here ,iv been here loads of times at very high intensitys and not got hurt''.Hopefully the training partners put you through worse than what you would get for real,lol.
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#399014 - 06/11/08 01:18 PM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: matxtx]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
I agree drills help you smooth out your techniques and counters to an attacks. But I wouldn't say they are any more important as anyother training exercise such as shadow boxing. The combination of drills and shadow boxing(t.e.) equals a good workout but lack the spontaneous reaction that sparring offers. I've noticed that with some drill the partner knows the same and can counter your counter this can only really be discovered in spontaneous schuffles sometimes they smother your attempt before it happens.

I agree if you are caught in sparring partner mode you only going to be as good as your partner. But if you are intent on defeating your opponent or really testing yourself you will impose your will on your opponent dispite his skill level. Only in fighting or sparring does tenacity, aggression and the will to do your best can the same technique be nearly unstoppable. Even though both know the drill, one is able to force or impose his will on the other, in sparing/fighting.

This can't be expressed with the even trade off of even resistance drill training. IMHO.
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#399015 - 06/12/08 12:59 PM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: Neko456]
matxtx Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/12/05
Posts: 700
Loc: england
I see what your saying.
I guess it depends on what the word 'drill' means to a person.
Im talking about high intensity drills where a situation is set and each has an objective.Anything can happen within that situation.
Not warm up drills or low level intensity compliant drills.

An example ,coming out of Judo training,would be two people in a clinch ,one tells the other he will be trying a particular sweep.So all he does is try to sweep the other guy.If he does it,they get up and go again.It can be done full on and at high intensitys over and over.
The key is that its harder to do something to someone when they know what your trying to do.THAT is skill.And the defender gets to learn defence against a guy very intensly doing it.So he intensly tries to stop him.

A wrestling drill example would be one is takedowns,one is takedown defence.Over and other.High intensity.

An MMA drill could be one has to takedown ,the other has to stay on his feet and can hand strike only .Both know what but not when or how so its free but adressing a particular weakness.
Or one is takedowns and has to submit the other,while One can only tie up and just stay up.They are both fighting intensily to get their goal.
It could be anything as long as its a situation that happens in a fight often enough to be worth knowing.

Personaly, I find these drills just as valuable as sparring,sometimes more so. I know top class MMA,Judoka,wrestlers,do these kind of things.
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#399016 - 06/13/08 03:14 PM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: Chen Zen]
Seiken Offline
Member

Registered: 03/29/08
Posts: 131
Loc: USA
Quote:

With the rapid rise in popularity, and subsequently number of schools, do you feel like the "JKD" or other taining that you do is on par with current MMA training available? D




Yes and no. Personally, injuries keep me from doing what I REALLY want to do. So I sort of increase the focus on what I CAN do. And what I can do is only similar to MMA training philosophy. Physical fitness wise, I dont do ANY MMA type drills like sprawls & pummeling, and any sparring I do now is light and specialized.

Pretty much all inclusive shadow fighting and high percentage techniques are what I take away from MMA or JKD the most.

While my training skills have diminished over the past few years, I feel like I used to train hard enough to be content with where I am currently, indeed light sparring can only garner so much, but observing what does and doesnt work for others helps greatly in deciding what really works and what I should work on. So in some respect light sparring does fullfill my full resistance/contact needs. But my needs are greatly different than most people. I honestly train with pure self preservation in mind, and to me that means death and health.

The more I think about it though, what I do is MMA, its just my MMA. Even when doing Kata or Poomse, I always have in mind the ever changing possibilities. And I think Jkogas is spot on once again, at its highest JKD should be MMA. I will boldly take this a step further and say any MA should be MMA at its highest.

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#399017 - 06/16/08 09:58 AM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: Seiken]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
I agree that at the highest level JKD is MMA. But let me explain its Mixed Martial art not the UFC/K1 version its merging every range to be your range or knowing your strengths and forcing your opponent to fight your fight.

In the UFC groin kicks are legal last I heard but rarely applied because of the protective cup and sportsmanship (U don't kick/grab mines and I won't kick/grab yours) but eye strikes and groin grabs/strikes should be a part of JKD curriculum. I know others disagree with the effectiveness and lack of accuracy of these methods but I look at it like a jump knee kind of risky but if it lands its Katie bar the door/No survivors/Lights out. So I believe its well worth training, as I've stated I'll trade a eye jab for a jab to the forehead anyday.

I also agree it should be training your way not look like the UFC, on the real you don't want to go in exchanging blows just to keep the rating ups, you want them to find your fight, if you have to fight.


Edited by Neko456 (06/16/08 09:59 AM)
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#399018 - 06/16/08 03:43 PM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: Neko456]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Very Good Neko. Your JKD should be as effective if not more effective than MMA today. MOST, and I emphasize MOST, MMA schools train within the construct of competition rules, such as Pride or UFC, when JKD training should include al of this but also go beyond, to train realistically, for survival not just contracts.
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#399019 - 06/17/08 12:53 PM Re: Is your "JKD" good enough? [Re: Chen Zen]
BruceLee94 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 04/26/08
Posts: 24
Loc: Lincoln, UK
We do eye jabs, and kicks to the groin, if we are being grappled and the only way to get out is to squeeze their balls, then so be it.
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#399020 - 09/28/08 02:26 AM hrm [Re: BruceLee94]
v_sho_v Offline
Stranger

Registered: 09/27/08
Posts: 3
I don't think it's fair to compare Jeet Kune DO to MMA. MMA seems to me to be very structured in it's phases of combat and from what i've seen all the fighters (with the exception of a few very skilled ones) use basically the same martial arts techniques. Jeet Kune Do as i've come to understand it was basically taking the four areas of combat (punching, kicking, trapping, and grappling) and perfecting them based off of your own unique ability's and expression. Furthermore it seems as if alot of people today are starting to compare every martial art to MMA as if it was a standard to use in judging. I honestly think that anyone who does this should stop trying to disprove an arts effectiveness compared to MMA and just train for MMA. Try to get on that ultimate fighter show while your at it i'll cheer for you.

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#399021 - 09/28/08 10:51 AM Re: hrm [Re: v_sho_v]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Quote:

I don't think it's fair to compare Jeet Kune DO to MMA. MMA seems to me to be very structured in it's phases of combat





Is JKD not also very structured in itís phases?


Quote:

Öand from what i've seen all the fighters (with the exception of a few very skilled ones) use basically the same martial arts techniques.





But think about what those techniques are? Kicking, punching, clinching/trapping and grappling. Isnít that what JKD is all about? Isnít kicking and punching just kicking and punching? Isnít that generic to the human being?

Iíd argue that one large reason you donít see a great variety of other techniques, is because they donít work in that environment. They donít work reliably when the pressure is on.


Quote:


Jeet Kune Do as i've come to understand it was basically taking the four areas of combat (punching, kicking, trapping, and grappling) and perfecting them based off of your own unique ability's and expression.




But how is that different than anyone involved in MMA?


Quote:

Furthermore it seems as if alot of people today are starting to compare every martial art to MMA as if it was a standard to use in judging. I honestly think that anyone who does this should stop trying to disprove an arts effectiveness compared to MMA and just train for MMA. Try to get on that ultimate fighter show while your at it i'll cheer for you.




Well, I think such comparisons are going to be made, as MMA seems to be the current measuring stick. Though I do think itís often unfair and inaccurate in some respects. However, MMA has done more for martial arts than anything in recent memory. If nothing else, people arenít as apt to believe in the ďmovie theatricsĒ of martial arts as they used to. Thatís a good thing. For a long time, people thought Steven Segal could really fightÖ Iím kidding (not really).

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