MMA as Self-Defense? - FightingArts Forums

FightingArts Estore
Pressure Points From a medical professional, straight facts on where and how to hit that can save your life.	Stretching Limber or not, anyone can add height and speed to their kicks with this method.	Calligraphy For yourself or as a gift, calligraphy is special, unique and lasting.	Karate Uniforms Look your best. Max snap. low cost & superior crafted: “Peak Performance Gold” 16 oz uniforms.	MOTOBU Classic book translation. Hard to find. Not in stores.

You are not logged in. [Log In] FightingArts.com Home Page » Forums » Interest Groups » Self Defense » MMA as Self-Defense?

Recent Posts

A post for those who might become martial artists.
by Leo_E_49
05/15/13 02:51 AM

Morihei Ueshiba and Aiki
by Chris_Li
05/12/13 11:20 PM

** Introduce Yourself! **
by Zombie Zero
05/06/13 08:57 AM

[weapon] strobing LED flashlight
by xerxes
04/29/13 04:10 PM

profile pictures
by cxt
04/25/13 01:13 PM

Forum Stats

22738 Members
36 Forums
35473 Topics
431968 Posts

Max Online: 307 @ 02/21/13 09:36 AM

Page 4 of 12

...

Topic Options

#393433 - 05/04/08 09:37 AM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: jude33]
creative Member Registered: 04/26/04 Posts: 401 Loc: UK	I don't think the point of the post was about the character. My post was very clear. What was you question I have not answered? please re ask it. - I will answer it if i feel it's relevant. Btw is the point you are going to make going to be about hand conditioning? _________________________ "Its only pain, it wont hurt you"
Top

#393434 - 05/04/08 11:11 AM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: creative]
jude33 Veteran Registered: 03/14/07 Posts: 1539	Quote: I don't think the point of the post was about the character. My post was very clear. What was you question I have not answered? please re ask it. - I will answer it if i feel it's relevant. Btw is the point you are going to make going to be about hand conditioning? Slow down. Its got nothing to do with your character. How can I put this with sounding like a know all? Ok I will speak from experience. Most people who only train punching using gloves dont have the Technique physical conditioning the tissue adjustment of the body to hit hard or effectively in a S/D scenario with out busting their hands. This applies to heavy weight boxers/ street fighters/ karate ka any body realy. People with all of the above can still get injured but it generaly isnt as bad as those who dont train for that purpose. The teachings for this go back to Trad karate. I suppose somewhere it will be in the chinese arts. To be able to defend one self effectively using bare knuckle or open hand techniques requires quite a long training regime. I think it was one of the reasons why they started using gloves in MMA Vale tudo doesnt use gloves. Even some of those guys dont connect with punches. So the skill factor is on going all the time. So in effect the training is progressive. It has to. It is like training for a 160 kg free weight bench press minus steriods. Most people would be capable of doing it but it takes a lot of time for the body to compensate. Add to the punching and hand conditioning other things like forearm shin etc it does take a fair bit of time and repetition for the body to adjust and to get the technique correct. Then in trad arts it is carried on untill people are in their 70's. Some guys in their 70's are excellent. Jude MMA to me is fine, it shows how and where techiques can be used. It can be progressive.
Top

#393435 - 05/04/08 01:28 PM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: jude33]
student_of_life Veteran Registered: 10/12/05 Posts: 1032 Loc: Newfoundland, Canada	"Jake "the Muss" Heke is a fictional character created by New Zealand writer Alan Duff. He appears in three of Duff's novels, Once Were Warriors " WHAT THE HELL MAN!!! you are the most random person i have ever seen with the ability to use a computer. _________________________ its not supposed to make sense
Top

#393436 - 05/04/08 03:34 PM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: student_of_life]
jude33 Veteran Registered: 03/14/07 Posts: 1539	Quote: "Jake "the Muss" Heke is a fictional character created by New Zealand writer Alan Duff. He appears in three of Duff's novels, Once Were Warriors " That particuler part was a copy and paste. I dont write some of these articles. ? Bit like a car, I drive them but I dont make them. I presume by your statement he exists then? Quote: WHAT THE HELL MAN!!! you are the most random person i have ever seen with the ability to use a computer. Coming from your good self I shall take that as a compliment. Now I feel good all over. random person = no definition of the term Random= governed by or depending on chance Chance is one of the favourite terms used in evolu-. tionary biology. It is by chance we exist. If we didint exist there would be no MMA or karate or computers. It can be by chance a person has to use self defence just to keep it on topic. be cool bro Jude
Top

#393437 - 05/04/08 05:14 PM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: jude33]
creative Member Registered: 04/26/04 Posts: 401 Loc: UK	Quote: Quote: I don't think the point of the post was about the character. My post was very clear. What was you question I have not answered? please re ask it. - I will answer it if i feel it's relevant. Btw is the point you are going to make going to be about hand conditioning? Slow down. Its got nothing to do with your character. Are you telling a joke that I don't get? I never mentioned MY character?! You seem not to read posts very well. Quote: How can I put this with sounding like a know all? Ok I will speak from experience. Most people who only train punching using gloves dont have the Technique physical conditioning the tissue adjustment of the body to hit hard or effectively in a S/D scenario with out busting their hands. This applies to heavy weight boxers/ street fighters/ karate ka any body realy. People with all of the above can still get injured but it generaly isnt as bad as those who dont train for that purpose. The teachings for this go back to Trad karate. I suppose somewhere it will be in the chinese arts. To be able to defend one self effectively using bare knuckle or open hand techniques requires quite a long training regime. You don't sound like a know it all! This is perhaps the first point you've made backing up your 'long time' to punch thoughts. lol. I'm going to disagree with you here too!! While i'm sure hand conditioning can reduce the chances of breaking your hand punching, I do not see it as a worth while practice. A few reasons for this include: 1) When punching someone you should not be aiming for the solid bone parts of the body. You should not break you hand punching to the nose (cartilage) or the jaw (has 'give) - ofcourse you can easily miss. 2) Conditioning has negative effects such as deforming hands, reducing dexterity. This may not hamper your martial arts, but is not good for every day life. 3) Time conditioning can be spent more effectively i.e. improving skill. To be honest even if you hit someone to get out of a self defence encounter and in the process cracked a knuckle, i'd call that pretty effective self defence. Better than having messed up hands all your life, only to be used once or twice (or never) in self defence. Quote: I think it was one of the reasons why they started using gloves in MMA Yes that was one of the reasons. but in SD one or two strikes should hopefully be enough, you are not going to be g'n'ping your opponent so much in SD! I think that hitting a makiwara - or what ever. Is wasting training time that can be spent more efficiently, But I do understand why people do it, even if i disagree with it. Edited by creative (05/04/08 05:15 PM) _________________________ "Its only pain, it wont hurt you"
Top

#393438 - 05/04/08 06:02 PM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: jude33]
student_of_life Veteran Registered: 10/12/05 Posts: 1032 Loc: Newfoundland, Canada	i said random because you "quote" stuff that has no revelance to whats being discussed. "Jake "the Muss" Heke is a fictional character created by New Zealand writer Alan Duff. He appears in three of Duff's novels, Once Were Warriors " how does that apply to the topic of MMA as self defence? "I presume by your statement he exists then?" what in the name of god are you talking about? who am i saying exists? the characture in some dudes books? "It can be by chance a person has to use self defence just to keep it on topic." and no, your not keeping on topic. not in any way shape or form in the sense of the word topic are you keeping on topic. i feel bad for derailing a thread to this point, but come on man! _________________________ its not supposed to make sense
Top

#393439 - 05/05/08 09:45 AM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: creative]
matxtx Enthusiast Registered: 07/12/05 Posts: 700 Loc: england	Good points about the bareknuckles. In Brazil they have gone back to bareknuckle MMA.Look for Rioheroes on YouTube. Other points I would add are that it doeant take a full slam into someones head or face to knock them out.A knockout is caused by the brain suddenly jolting so you want to make the head spin suddenly so clipping the jaw and spinning the head is the type of thing needed. Also it depends on your personal tactics .Doing big massive full on shots that leave you open and off balance if you miss but hurt your hands if you do hit are not a good idea it seems.Better to use shorter sharper punching that wont damage and at least stuns. Also maybe tacticaly look to set up knees and elbows as finish strikes so you wont as likely get damaged. This is advice I have seen and makes sense to me and it works well. Plus I think that a person fully involved will keep going and not notice untill after or maybe the next day,injuries to things like the hands. _________________________ I point my saxaphone at the rare Booted Gorilla.
Top

#393440 - 05/05/08 10:34 AM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: student_of_life]
jude33 Veteran Registered: 03/14/07 Posts: 1539	Quote: i said random because you "quote" stuff that has no revelance to whats being discussed. " Jake "the Muss" Heke is a fictional character created by New Zealand writer Alan Duff. He appears in three of Duff's novels, Once Were Warriors " how does that apply to the topic of MMA as self defence ? Was in response to the crabs posting. If you bothered to read the thread it was quite clear. I have put the points you missed in bold format so you dont miss them again. The crabs quote scroll back a bit its there. Quote: in fact, the whole topic of different martial arts effectiveness in self defence is void. It comes down to who does it, not who does the art. theres a lot of really tough [censored] around who have never trained before in anything. youtube jake the muss or something Quote: "I presume by your statement he exists then?" what in the name of god are you talking about? who am i saying exists? the characture in some dudes books? Its no wonder you refuse to recognise or see ground fighting in karate. You dont seem to want to read all the postings on here. Just going off topic some what. Quote from some one else Control your emotion or it will control you. --Chinese adage End of quote from some one else. SOL take it easy. Jude
Top

#393441 - 05/05/08 11:21 AM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: creative]
jude33 Veteran Registered: 03/14/07 Posts: 1539	Quote: lol. I'm going to disagree with you here too!! This could get interesting. Quote: While i'm sure hand conditioning can reduce the chances of breaking your hand punching, I do not see it as a worth while practice. A few reasons for this include: 1) When punching someone you should not be aiming for the solid bone parts of the body. You should not break you hand punching to the nose (cartilage) or the jaw (has 'give) - ofcourse you can easily miss. Quote from MIke Tyson. ''I haven't been in a street fight in seven years,'' said Tyson. ''I was scared. He hit me in the chest. I hit him over the eye or something. He came back again. I had no other choice but to defend myself. He was not in a good state of mind. He was upset http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940DE0DB133CF937A1575BC0A96E948260 This is where he substained a fracture in his hand. Unusual for Tyson. He didint knock the guy out. First off if during a punch out the attacker is moving his head a lot and the fur is flying it would be very doubtfull if the defender has a great choice where he connects. Yes there are all these wondefull techniques but they cant always be relied on to work everytime. Combine that with a scenario where there are more than one present with an attacker. On an attacker the solid parts of the body are also target areas although not for the fist. If the defender hits the attacker on the jaw hard enough with the outer two knuckles then there is a 90 percent chance the hand will be damaged in that area. Quite a common injury in gloved boxing. Again this goes back to technique training using bareknuckle with high reps. To try to perfect the technique. Quote: 2) Conditioning has negative effects such as deforming hands, reducing dexterity. This may not hamper your martial arts, but is not good for every day life. That is a total myth. If done correctly then there are no side effects. If done incorrectly and to attempted to speed up the process then perhaps Quote: 3) Time conditioning can be spent more effectively i.e. improving skill. Press ups? Arent they done anyway? Difference is using the fingers and on the fist as opposed to just flat hand Striking practice? Weight training isnt that done anyway? . Quote: To be honest even if you hit someone to get out of a self defence encounter and in the process cracked a knuckle, i'd call that pretty effective self defence. So what happens if the defender has broken hands and the attacker(s) hasnt? Bad choice. Quote: Better than having messed up hands all your life, only to be used once or twice (or never) in self defence. Doesnt mess up the hands if done correctly. Quote: I think it was one of the reasons why they started using gloves in MMA Quote: Yes that was one of the reasons. but in SD one or two strikes should hopefully be enough, Doubtfull if that would work but dependent on the attacker. To hope for that and train for that is foolish. Quote: I think that hitting a makiwara - or what ever. Is wasting training time that can be spent more efficiently, But I do understand why people do it, even if i disagree with it. So would you say the same thing for bag work then? striking is striking. Regardless what is struck. Bag work is still done as well as makiwari. so is the use of a speed ball. Jude
Top

#393442 - 05/05/08 11:36 AM Re: MMA as Self-Defense? [Re: matxtx]
jude33 Veteran Registered: 03/14/07 Posts: 1539	Quote: In .Doing big massive full on shots that leave you open and off balance If your going off balance and you are left open you might want to revise your training. Quote: Quote: Better to use shorter sharper punching that wont damage and at least stuns. It is called the jab in boxing and the same comparison can be found in karate and I should imagine kung fu. The jab or comparative punch in karate can be used to set up the as you term the big shot. But I dont think the big shot would be thrown quite as you state. And why not work on devloping a fast hard jab or comparitive punch in karate?. In which case life would be easier. There have been knock outs using the strike, Sonny Liston was one guy who did it on a regular basis. Also maybe tacticaly look to set up knees and elbows as finish strikes so you wont as likely get damaged. Ok Quote: Plus I think that a person fully involved will keep going and not notice untill after or maybe the next day,injuries to things like the hands. I dont think it always works like that. Busted/ broken hands= cant use them Busted/broken wrists= cant use them There are techniques in trad karate soley for that purpose to do that kind of damage to an attacker. Jude Edited by jude33 (05/05/08 11:39 AM)
Top