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#391884 - 04/19/08 07:31 PM Tonights PPV UFC 83
Seiken Offline
Member

Registered: 03/29/08
Posts: 131
Loc: USA
Whats everyones thoughts?

Mac Danzig vs Mark Bocek
Nate Quarry vs Kalib Starnes
Michael Bisping vs Charles McCarthy
Travis Lutter vs Rich Franklin
Matt Serra vs George St. Pierre

Im actually looking forward to all these fights, McCarthy impressed me his last time out im looking for even more improvement from this kid. I was shocked at his professionalism when I visited his gym in Slidell. Good character.

I love Quarry and Franklin, I wish more people were like him in MMA. Perfect poster boys. I think both will win their fights, but I expect Lutter to come in with better standup than ever. I predict Lutter faking Franklin into a leg grab from a kick to get to the ground only to get knocked out as they stand back up... bold prediction I know, buts its fun

Danzig and Bocek, ive seen so little on both I have no clue. Danzig has momentum on his side from TUF though.

Serra vs Pierre... Of course this could see either fighter winning infinite awys,... I just hope it goes all 5 rds, im tired of paying 45$ for the quickies

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#391885 - 04/19/08 08:11 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Seiken]
MattyChi Offline
Member

Registered: 02/08/07
Posts: 177
Loc: Grand Rapids, MI
I like watching bisping a lot, and I too have been impressed with mccarthy, should be a fun fight. Gotta rep Franklin cause he is associated with my gym. And definitely rooting for St. Pierre. After watchin him fight hughes he seems unstoppable. Probably my favorite fighter ATM.

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#391886 - 04/20/08 09:33 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: MattyChi]
BrianRVanCise Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/06
Posts: 110
Loc: Alma, Michigan
Definately a few good fights!

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#391887 - 04/20/08 10:28 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: BrianRVanCise]
shills11 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/19/07
Posts: 376
Loc: Glasgow Scotland
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5565q_mark-bocek-vs-mac-danzig_sport
Danzig v Bocek great fight

will try and find the rest but they only last a few hours
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#391888 - 04/20/08 10:57 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shills11]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA


Wow! Knee strikes from Danzig. Excellent fight! Gotta say that Kenny Florian did a great job as commentator.

Serra vs. St.Pierre:

http://www.mmascraps.com/
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#391889 - 04/20/08 02:26 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: MattJ]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
It was a good night except for Kalib which was a horrible fight on his part always running away. My boy and fellow Canadian GSP won which was totally expected. Not show was hometown boy Jason MacDonald beating Joe Doerken for a second time.

Good fight card.
_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#391890 - 04/20/08 02:44 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Dereck]
bo-ken Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 1228
Loc: beaver falls, PA, beaver
GSP is at the top of his game. His wrestling was unbelievable and he put Serra on defense from the get go. Danzig and Bocek was a great match up was well. That knee strike was sick. I think next month is going to be an even better fight card.

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#391891 - 04/20/08 06:39 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: MattJ]
Seiken Offline
Member

Registered: 03/29/08
Posts: 131
Loc: USA
I only got to see the Danzig fight ;( my cable company claimed I didnt my pay my bill.. so they wouldnt let me order it.(even though I just got done paying it through CC)

Mac was awesome. I didnt like him on the TUF show at first, until the finale and his real character shined. Those knees were dangerously sick, did anyone happen to see the double kidney punch at 49 seconds left of RD1? That was quite interesting.

Based on his performance , GSPs last three fights(big bird and matt hughes), and Andersons uncanny abilities I think these guys are the future of MMA.

Granted, Mac needs some title caliber fights, but his improvement showed last night, it was a big leap.

Did Serra even put up a fight?

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#391892 - 04/20/08 07:08 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Seiken]
Stormdragon Offline
Who Dares Wins
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 3409
Loc: Salem, OR
So what happens if Franklin loses to Silva again but no one else can beat him? Personally I think he should next fight Henderson before getting a title shot.
_________________________
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#391893 - 04/20/08 10:23 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Seiken]
Spade Offline
Member

Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Auburn, Al.
I thought Franklin did awesome.
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#391894 - 04/21/08 12:19 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Spade]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
GSP, awesome, as expected!

Franklin, did ok, got the W.

Quarry vs. the running man,lol, never saw anything like it. Loved the Rocky 4 ending comment,lol.

Danzig did very good, his opponent was tough!
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The2nd ammendment, it makes all the others possible. <///<




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#391895 - 04/21/08 05:02 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: MattJ]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

Gotta say that Kenny Florian did a great job as commentator.




Apart from 'congratulating' Serra on his loss- twice

Is there anyone else here who just gets mesmerised by GSP when he fights and kind of thinks 'wow. every other fighter on earth sucks'. The guy is phenomenal. Then he (and Serra to be fair) finish with huge class. Compare that to Hopkins performance and his after fight interview, and you see why UFC is increasing in popularity at such a speed.

I loved the crowd shouting 'KNEES!! KNEES!!' when Franklin was controlling the clinch Must have felt good to be on the other side of the situation for a change

Nate Quarry is a solid fighter who got a good cardio workout chasing his oponent on the night- I doubt he covers that distance in his roadwork

It was a great card, and GSP, in performance and conduct, stamped his card as the true successor to Couture as ambassador for MMA/UFC. Dana White must be delighted, and hugely relieved to have him.
_________________________
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#391896 - 04/21/08 08:40 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Cord]
Raul Perez Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 2805
Loc: Lake Ronkonkoma, NY, USA
I always hated Kalib Starned when he was on TUF. Always whining and complaining. This just solidified what a little be-atch he really is. I hope the Zuffa Bros. cancel any remaining contracted fights he has with them.

Bad form old chap, bad form.
_________________________
"I'm gonna come at you like a spider monkey"

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#391897 - 04/21/08 09:22 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Raul Perez]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Fellow Canadian Kalib Starnes I highly doubt we will see again any time soon. Dana will have hated that performance however Nate Quarry just got a little shining star beside his name and we will definitely see him again.
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#391898 - 04/21/08 09:52 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Raul Perez]
Supremor Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
I can't understand why Lutter bothered to try and fight Franklin. You'd think a guy who failed to make weight for his previous fight would learn something from it and make sure he was in good shape for his next fight. Gassing in the second round like that is simply not acceptable if you expect to fight at a high level.

Danzig was impressive. I remember watching a pre-fight interview with him, where he said that stylistically he felt the match-up was not good for him, and he was worried it would become a boring fight. No sign of that! Although definitely it was one of the hardest fights I've seen a TUF winner debut with.

I was really impressed with Bisping too, he looked really fast at 185. I can't see him ever being an elite middleweight because he lacks a great ground game, but in terms of stand-up, strength and quickness, he'd be a hand-ful for anyone in the division(maybe not Silva suprisingly). Actually I wouldn't mind seeing Bisping-Franklin in the future, I think it'd be a real war, although I think Franklin might have the edge. Hard to see who Franklin will fight if not Bisping.

GSP did what everybody expected him to do and beat on Matt Serra. I am so impressed with GSP's wrestling and positional ground-work. It seems like it's impossible to ever put him on the bottom, which is ofcourse, a huge advantage. If John Fitch is the next fight for GSP then I honestly feel sorry for him- much like the middleweight division, GSP is in a class of his own at the moment. There are so many really good fighters in the welterweight division, and it's incredibly deep, but just about all of those guys are a tier below where GSP is.

Wow, that must have been one of the only recent cards not to have some shocking upset in it!

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#391899 - 04/21/08 10:10 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Supremor]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
WOW awesome armbar escape by Rich Franlkin at 3:55 in the first round. Excellent.

LOL at Khalib's "roadwork" vs Quarry.

Was impressed with McCarthy's defense against Bisping. But we all know you can't win a fight on defense. Bisping's attacks were very sharp - those knees!

Good fights this one!
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#391900 - 04/21/08 01:23 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Supremor]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Quote:

I can't understand why Lutter bothered to try and fight Franklin. You'd think a guy who failed to make weight for his previous fight would learn something from it and make sure he was in good shape for his next fight. Gassing in the second round like that is simply not acceptable if you expect to fight at a high level.




Lutter didn't do his homework. He fought Franklin exactly how Jason MacDonald did and tried to take him to the ground and constantly had his head down. Jason would never make that mistake again and would have learned from this but obviously Lutter didn't.


Quote:

Danzig was impressive. I remember watching a pre-fight interview with him, where he said that stylistically he felt the match-up was not good for him, and he was worried it would become a boring fight. No sign of that! Although definitely it was one of the hardest fights I've seen a TUF winner debut with.




I didn't much like this guy on the show as I found him a little arrogant however this fight was very good, he fought an excellent fight and was very classy afterwards.


Quote:

I was really impressed with Bisping too, he looked really fast at 185. I can't see him ever being an elite middleweight because he lacks a great ground game, but in terms of stand-up, strength and quickness, he'd be a hand-ful for anyone in the division(maybe not Silva suprisingly). Actually I wouldn't mind seeing Bisping-Franklin in the future, I think it'd be a real war, although I think Franklin might have the edge. Hard to see who Franklin will fight if not Bisping.




I don't like Bisping; not at all however I would like also to see him face Franklin; Franklin would let him know what the real caliber of Middle Weight is. I like McCarthy however after all of his antics and didn't back it up, I'm glad Bisping won the fight and decisively.


Quote:

GSP did what everybody expected him to do and beat on Matt Serra. I am so impressed with GSP's wrestling and positional ground-work. It seems like it's impossible to ever put him on the bottom, which is ofcourse, a huge advantage. If John Fitch is the next fight for GSP then I honestly feel sorry for him- much like the middleweight division, GSP is in a class of his own at the moment. There are so many really good fighters in the welterweight division, and it's incredibly deep, but just about all of those guys are a tier below where GSP is.




Can't agree more; GSP is the man and I've said it all along.
_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#391901 - 04/21/08 06:13 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Dereck]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
That was a good fight for Rich Franklin he showed that he can fight well on the ground Lutter got in a great arm bar set it up nice. But Franklin counter was awesome after that it wasn't much of a fight, it showed how far ground fighting has come usually a arm abr sunk that deep it was over. Lutter knew he couldn't stand with him even though he showed some nu%%s takng that head kick without going down but it was pretty much over after that. It's hard to imagine that he shot his wad after the 1st round but that was a solid head kick Rich gave him in 2nd. You just can't be a mostly single discipline man anymore and win in UFC unless you're lucky.

GSP and Serra was a great fight not wanting to give Serra a Puncher's chance he took it to the ground and pound & ground showing great balance. Dominating Serra but who else noticed the spining move to the full guard that Serra kept using every time GSP pulled full or near full mount, Serra is a great grappler with heavy hands but GSP was not to be denided. Great fight!!!

That was a good card!!!
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#391902 - 04/21/08 08:04 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Neko456]
shoveldog Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 88
Well, it could have been a good card, if Lutter had actually trained cardio enough to go past the first round, if McCarthy hadn't decided that a good strategy was to stand still and take knees to the head, and if Kalib Starnes hadn't inspired YTMNDs like this:

http://kalibsucks.ytmnd.com/

And they should have shown the Demian Maia fight. Then, it would have been a good card.

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#391903 - 04/21/08 08:22 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

and if Kalib Starnes hadn't inspired YTMNDs like this:

http://kalibsucks.ytmnd.com/






LMFAO
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#391904 - 04/22/08 08:14 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: MattJ]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
_________________________
The2nd ammendment, it makes all the others possible. <///<




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#391905 - 04/22/08 11:38 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: BrianS]
Raul Perez Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 2805
Loc: Lake Ronkonkoma, NY, USA
oh that's just awesome!!!
_________________________
"I'm gonna come at you like a spider monkey"

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#391906 - 04/22/08 11:44 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: BrianS]
Tom2199 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 834
Loc: England
tbh i think bisping is over rated, he looked robotic and unfomftable in his stance. doesnt utilise his reach either, against franklin he would probably just go for the ground and pound.
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#391907 - 04/22/08 11:57 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
Seiken Offline
Member

Registered: 03/29/08
Posts: 131
Loc: USA
So thats what fight or flight looks like in a cage! LOL

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#391908 - 04/22/08 12:47 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Tom2199]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

tbh i think bisping is over rated, he looked robotic and unfomftable in his stance. doesnt utilise his reach either, against franklin he would probably just go for the ground and pound.




But would it work? At the end of the day, its not what a fighter doesn't use to win, its what he does use to win that counts.
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#391909 - 04/22/08 03:32 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Cord]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Cord's rooting for his homeboy.
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"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#391910 - 04/22/08 08:02 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Dereck]
shoveldog Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 88
Bisping is certainly overrated. Zuffa wants to tap the UK market and they've pushed Bisping shamelessly. He's fought no one of any quality except Hamill, and a clueless judge gave him that one in a travesty of a decision. Or maybe it was divine intervention:


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#391911 - 04/22/08 08:13 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Dereck]
_kyle Offline
Newbie

Registered: 01/01/08
Posts: 23
Loc: Montreal
GSP was amazing and I think proved that his loss to serra was a just a blemish on his amazing record.

If Jon Fitch is next I honestly believe it won't be much a fight, GSP will outwrestle Fitch and Fitch has practically no stand up compared to GSP who started out with just a BB in kyokushin

I've liked Mac Danzig since his appearace on TUF6. To be honest at first I disliked him because he was a [censored] all of the time but I think his beliefs are in the right place. Seeing him win even over a fellow Canadian is nice

Kalib Starnes' performance was an embarassment to all Canadians I believe. Nate showed up to fight but unfortunately Kalib didn't. I thought Nate's antics saved the whole fight in terms of entertainment.

Franklin looked impressive as always(except when fighting Anderson Silva). I thought it was hilarious Travis Lutter had no energy left in the second round when he is supposed to be a professional fighter.

Finally Bisping looked good at 185, his standup is pretty tight but he seems a bit one dimensional and I don't think he could beat Franklin let alone Silva because of that.

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#391912 - 04/23/08 05:30 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: _kyle]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

Finally Bisping looked good at 185, his standup is pretty tight but he seems a bit one dimensional and I don't think he could beat Franklin let alone Silva because of that.




OK, lets say that Bisping is being given an easy ride by the matchmakers, it wouldnt be the first time this has happened- I recall the same being said of Franklin as he was on the up. Whatever happened to Lindland? contract got dropped before ol' 'Hills have eyes' could get his hands on Franklin the boy wonder, thats what.
As a fighter, Bisping has to fight who they put in front of him. He freakin spanked Macarthy. Can you actually think of a more dominant display of stand up in recent times- only Couture's exhibition of dirty boxing against Sylvia comes to mind for me.
Starnes runs like a beotch, and Quarry gets sympathy/respect, Macarthy goes feotal, and Bisping gets doubted. At least macarthy tried to fight back.
Anyone think Quarry is being given an easy ride?
If you knew nothing about the UFC, and watched that card, which guy would you think had his opposition 'tampered' with in some way?
I dont think either fighter did anything but the best they could against the man in front of them. Time will tell how far they can go- I never thought Jardine would beat Liddel, or Serra would beat GSP, but thats what makes the sport so awesome- there are no clear favourites in an MMA match.
Bisping has heavy strikes and good clinch, and superb knees- how did Sylva beat Franklin again? TWICE.
I am not saying Bisping is proven as good as Sylva, but I am saying that what he likes to do, Franklin hates to recieve.
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#391913 - 04/23/08 06:27 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Cord]
shoveldog Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 88
Franklin's overrated, too. I doubt Rich was in on it, but Ken Shamrock obviously "put Rich over" in their fight; the video clearly shows Ken taking a dive without being hit. I could cite other examples, but what's that got to do with Bisping? Nothing.

So Bisping "spanked" McCarthy, another lower tier fighter. Is that all ya got? Sort of proves the point doesn't it?

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#391914 - 04/23/08 07:18 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

So Bisping "spanked" McCarthy, another lower tier fighter. Is that all ya got? Sort of proves the point doesn't it?




Er....no, not really. If Bisping was not a class above his oponent, he would not have dominated him so badly would he?

Far as i am concerned, I cant really see Sylva being beaten anytime soon, but Lutter is the only guy so far to run him close, and if you want to tell me that lutter looked anything but a 'lower tier fighter' the other night, then I suggest you get glasses

Bisping has the tools to deal with Franklin and/or Lutter on any given night, and as such, stands as much chance as anyone against Sylva at the moment.

I would agree that Franklin was overrated- I cant comment on the Shamrock fight, as I have not seen it. I do feel however, that Franklin has improved after his defeat by sylva. It is arguable that how a fighter responds to loss is more important than how he responds to victory. I think the franklin that fought on '83 is more impressive than the Franklin that held the belt.
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#391915 - 04/23/08 07:34 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
Tom2199 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 834
Loc: England
there no fluidity in bispings combinations and it annoyed me even more when the commentator said great combinations from bisping, robotic arkward movment, no reach, poor technique (his knees looked the best out of all his game) and poor defence which has yet to be capitalised on. His ground and pound looks impressive against lower tier opponants but we have seen him struggle against competition such as rashad evans another mediocre fighter, he failed to even pull off any decent striking against him

Nate Quarry is also a bad striker i mean how can you call that a performance... he got tagged so easily on the way in with what little shots kalib threw, from what kalib did show yes it was very little it seemed he had the better movment nate looked flustered from the little short shots as if to think why am i getting hit. against a heavy handed good striker who likes to bang those are knock out opportunities, take a look at 3:36 of round 3 you can just see how robotic and stiff nate is.
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#391916 - 04/23/08 07:40 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Tom2199]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

there no fluidity in bispings combinations and it annoyed me even more when the commentator said great combinations from bisping, robotic arkward movment, no reach, poor technique (his knees looked the best out of all his game) and poor defence which has yet to be capitalised on. His ground and pound looks impressive against lower tier opponants but we have seen him struggle against competition such as rashad evans another mediocre fighter, he failed to even pull off any decent striking against him

Nate Quarry is also a bad striker i mean how can you call that a performance... he got tagged so easily on the way in with what little shots kalib threw, from what kalib did show yes it was very little it seemed he had the better movment nate looked flustered from the little short shots as if to think why am i getting hit. against a heavy handed good striker who likes to bang those are knock out opportunities, take a look at 3:36 of round 3 you can just see how robotic and stiff nate is.




i thought his striking was strong and fluid, but we all see things differently. I am sure you will make short work of him when you get your chance as your career develops.
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#391917 - 04/23/08 07:42 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Cord]
Tom2199 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 834
Loc: England
not really we are in different weight classes haha

on another note anyone looking forward to BJ Penn and Sherk, Penn is an animal!
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#391918 - 04/23/08 10:25 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Tom2199]
Supremor Offline
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Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
Quote:


there no fluidity in bispings combinations and it annoyed me even more when the commentator said great combinations from bisping, robotic arkward movment, no reach, poor technique (his knees looked the best out of all his game) and poor defence which has yet to be capitalised on.




I disagree, I thought Bisping looked very comfortable and technical in his fight. He threw some good combinations and had McCarthy playing a turtle in his shell all fight. Sure McCarthy is a lower tier fighter, but that doesn't take anything away from how Bisping handled himself.

Quote:

His ground and pound looks impressive against lower tier opponants but we have seen him struggle against competition such as rashad evans another mediocre fighter, he failed to even pull off any decent striking against him




It will always be difficult to play ground and pound against a good wrestler like Evans because you're probably going to end up on the bottom. Also, don't forget that Bisping has just moved down a weight category. It's difficult to say just how much that will help him- he looks strong and fast at 185 and I think it will be more difficult for his opponents to take him down. Heck, Sherk had his problems at 170, and he was huge, but look at how he ripped through his opponents in the 155lb category.

And that leads me on to Sherk-Penn. I see Sherk winning it in a convincing decision with Penn on his back for most of the fight. I think Sherk will be just too strong and able to smother Penn's BJJ game. Can't see a knockout, and I'd never rule a submission artist like BJ out, but I would go with Penn based on his amazing performance against Franca, where he was able to bully franca on the ground. Sherk= one heck of a wrestler.

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#391919 - 04/23/08 11:44 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
Neko456 Offline
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Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
Quote:

Franklin's overrated, too. I doubt Rich was in on it, but Ken Shamrock obviously "put Rich over" in their fight; the video clearly shows Ken taking a dive without being hit. I could cite other examples, but what's that got to do with Bisping? Nothing.





I don't think Rich win over Mr. Ken Shamrock put him over it started him being recongnized but his convincing victory
over the next up and coming powerhouse Nate Quarry did the trick. Everybody expected Rich to get whipped bad even Knocked Out and Franklin did the knocking out and made it look vicious and easy. Nates career took a turn and Rich's soared that was suppose to be a tough fight and Franklin quiten all the naysayers in that fight.

Franklin, like Randy and GSP are prime example of MMA champs. I like Serra too after his UFC coaching and both fights verse GSP he a bad man.

Do you think Serra could beat Matt Huge? Standing he got a chance don't know if it goes to the ground Huge is still a hand ful anywhere imho.


Edited by Cord (04/24/08 03:30 AM)
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#391920 - 04/23/08 01:59 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Neko456]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
I will go with Sherk when he fights BJ Penn. BJ Penn is a good grappler by all means but the strength and speed of Sherk is far greater. I wonder however with him having to take steroids if that might change things slightly.

I would like to see Matt Serra and Matt Hughes fight; I think the fans would too and I think both would as well. I sit on the fence for who would win though ... a toss up in my books.
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#391921 - 04/24/08 06:47 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Cord]
shoveldog Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 88
Quote:

Er....no, not really. If Bisping was not a class above his oponent, he would not have dominated him so badly would he?



Sorry, but this makes no sense. McCarthy is a lower tier fighter, so beating him is nothing to crow about. I didn't say Bisping wasn't a better fighter than McCarthy, I said that victory didn't mean anything. And no, it doesn't mean Bisping is another class because he won convincingly. Surely I don't have to explain why that conclusion doesn't logically follow.

As far as your statement about not finding a more "dominant display of standup in recent times," dude, you need to get out more. Revew Anderson Sylva's fights with Franklin, check out Cung le's demolition of Frank Shamrock, look at Lyoto Machida's fights, just to suggest a few. Bisping is nowhere near that level, and never will be. I know you like the guy, but jeez, don't embarrass yourself with that kind of hyperbole.

And, I admit, I don't like him as a result of the Hamill fight, and I had my say about that here:

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/s...ue#Post15961747

As they say in my profession, this is an issue on which reasonable men may differ, and you and I certainly do.
I've said my piece, and I'm disinclined to waste any more pixels on Mr. Bisping. Onward and upward.

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#391922 - 04/24/08 07:25 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Neko456]
shoveldog Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 88
Neko456,

We're getting a little off-topic here, but here's a link to a 3 second gif that will show Shamrock taking a dive in his fight against Franklin years ago.

http://www.ultimate-fighter.ca/Forum/viewtopic.php?id=5769

I really like Rich and I doubt he had anything to do with this, but you can't convince me that Shamrock didn't throw that fight. Watch Ken's feet and note that Franklin's right hand never connects. Looks like Ken learned a little from his professional wrestling days, eh?

If the link doesn't work, let me know, and I'll try to host the gif file myself and give you another link.

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#391923 - 04/24/08 07:41 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
MattJ Offline
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
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Quote:

here's a link to a 3 second gif that will show Shamrock taking a dive in his fight against Franklin years ago.

http://www.ultimate-fighter.ca/Forum/viewtopic.php?id=5769




Wow. Very damning video. Shamrock's feet start folding before Rich even touches him.

RE: Sherk vs. Penn. I think that Penn will take that fight, assuming his conditioning is up to it. I don't think Sherk's skill level is anywhere near what BJ's is. Penn gassing is the only way I see him losing that fight.
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#391924 - 04/24/08 07:47 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: MattJ]
Supremor Offline
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Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
Quote:


RE: Sherk vs. Penn. I think that Penn will take that fight, assuming his conditioning is up to it. I don't think Sherk's skill level is anywhere near what BJ's is. Penn gassing is the only way I see him losing that fight.




BJ will only be able to show his skill if he is able to get guard or a dominant position. With Sherk being so good at wrestling, and so good at smothering his opponents, I doubt BJ will get much of a chance to use his submissions, and there is no way in hell he is taking Sherk down.

On the feet, Penn may have a better chance, but I still don't fancy him, because if Sherk want to take the fight to the ground, then it WILL go there. That's how I read it anyway, after watching Sherk's last few fights before his suspension, if he's as good as he was then then I can't see anyone in the light weight division really beating him. As I said, I can't see a knockout, but I can see 5 rounds of ground and pound.

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#391925 - 04/24/08 07:53 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Supremor]
MattJ Offline
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Registered: 11/25/04
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Loc: York PA. USA
I agree with you on Sherk's takedown ability. But BJ has fantastic jujitsu skills, and I can see him submitting Sherk once on the ground. But I have been wrong before.

EDIT -

Started a UFC 84 thread here, to keep this from going off-topic:

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/s...=0#Post15996142


Edited by MattJ (04/24/08 07:54 AM)
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#391926 - 04/24/08 07:55 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
Supremor Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
Quote:


And, I admit, I don't like him as a result of the Hamill fight, and I had my say about that here:





I can't understand the resentment that people feel towards Bisping because of this fight. It wasn't his fault that he was fighting at home with judges who may have got it wrong. Sure, he felt he won the fight, but it was a close fight, and I'm sure both fighters thought they'd won.

Bisping comes accross as a really nice guy, both in the TUF series and when he's doing interviews. He made a small booboo after the hamil fight, but honestly, the beef he gets is crazy.

He looked good in the McCarthy fight. Whatever way you want to look at it, he looked like a good fighter with good stand-up. McCarthy may have been a lower tier fighter, but that was who Bisping had been given to fight and he did it well. maybe he is not a match for Franklin, and I certainly don't think he is a match for Silva. But apart from those two, I think he's more than capable of beating anyone in the division. Coming up short against the best two fighters in your weight class is not a sign of mediocrity!

He fought well, give him his dues.

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#391927 - 04/24/08 09:23 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: MattJ]
Tom2199 Offline
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Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 834
Loc: England
i agree with matt, i think penn is an animal. I think it will be a hard fight as sherk has alot of strength and conditioning, i dont think he is any fitter than penn though i mean wow the guy said he had been training and he meant it (penn that is). Dont let the roided up meat head physique of sherk sqayer your decision, the only thing he has going for him is top quality wrestling a bit 1 dimensional in my opinion, unless someone would like to correct me on his stand up?

Penn is naturally gifted with his striking on his feet, i dont think he trains in near as much as he could but he can get away with it due to his raw talent.

I think the fight will go something along the lines off sherk will take a few shots, shoot for the takedown. penn is a master on the ground in submissions i think sherk will have a tough time although the pure strength and agression of sherk will have penn playing defensivly for a while.

Anyway im with BJ penn hes a great guy and sherk is just a nob.
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#391928 - 04/24/08 10:45 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Tom2199]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
In case you missed the fights or are locked out, here is another website ALSO showing fights you did not see. Take a look at the EXCELLENT fight by my hometown boy Jason MacDonald. To think they showed Kalib/Quarry's fight over this. I don't get it.

http://www.mmatko.com/jason-macdonald-vs-joe-doerksen-fight-video-ufc-83/

Other videos on the right side.
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#391929 - 04/24/08 10:47 AM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
Cord Offline
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Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Quote:

Quote:

Er....no, not really. If Bisping was not a class above his oponent, he would not have dominated him so badly would he?



Sorry, but this makes no sense. McCarthy is a lower tier fighter, so beating him is nothing to crow about. I didn't say Bisping wasn't a better fighter than McCarthy, I said that victory didn't mean anything. And no, it doesn't mean Bisping is another class because he won convincingly.




Contradiction aplenty in that little diatribe.

Quote:

Surely I don't have to explain why that conclusion doesn't logically follow.




Yep, you do.

Quote:

As far as your statement about not finding a more "dominant display of standup in recent times," dude, you need to get out more. Revew Anderson Sylva's fights with Franklin




equally dominant.

Quote:

check out Cung le's demolition of Frank Shamrock




Embarassing sparring match.

Quote:

look at Lyoto Machida's fights




Couldnt comment.

Quote:

Bisping is nowhere near that level, and never will be. I know you like the guy, but jeez, don't embarrass yourself with that kind of hyperbole.




Wasn't aware that I had qualified Bisping as absolutely top flight, merely, by obesrvation, noted that his eye catching performance and overall fight record warrant him being in the mix as a prospective challenger. Time, and his next oponents will decide his level, not you, or I.

Quote:

And, I admit, I don't like him as a result of the Hamill fight, and I had my say about that here:




cant blame a fighter for a judges decision. Blame Hamill for not taking him out.

Quote:

As they say in my profession, this is an issue on which reasonable men may differ, and you and I certainly do.
I've said my piece, and I'm disinclined to waste any more pixels on Mr. Bisping. Onward and upward.




Nothing like having the last word is there
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#391930 - 04/24/08 12:48 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: Cord]
BrianRVanCise Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/06
Posts: 110
Loc: Alma, Michigan
I too am looking forward to the Sherk vs. Penn fight. I do think that Penn will win because he is trickier and also because Sherk will want it on the ground. My major questions are if Sherk will be the same post steroids and will Penn's cardio be good. All in all this will make for an interesting fight.

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#391931 - 04/24/08 01:31 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: BrianRVanCise]
shoveldog Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 88
I don't think BJ will ever be able to match Sherk's cardio, or his training work ethic for that matter, although I do believe BJ is the better technical fighter. But because of Sherk's physical strength and stamina, if BJ doesn't submit Sherk in the first two rounds, I think he's probably toast, and I hate to say that because I'm pulling for BJ.

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#391932 - 04/24/08 07:36 PM Re: Tonights PPV UFC 83 [Re: shoveldog]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
On the note of Bisping, I don't like him and I have always thought he's overrated. He did look good during his last bout,but the guy fought made him look better than he actually is imo.

I've always said Ken Shamrock takes dives!!! HA!!

BJ Penn will beat Sherk.
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