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#390985 - 04/14/08 12:30 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: Ed_Morris]
Leo_E_49 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/24/05
Posts: 4117
Loc: California
That was the most insightful post on this thread so far.
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#390986 - 04/14/08 08:46 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: Leo_E_49]
JohnL Offline
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Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 4309
Loc: NY, NY, USA
It's interesting to see the reaction to this from folks.

Do I agree with MMA for kids of 6 years old. No. But then again I don't particularly agree with karate for 6 year olds either. (As I've stated in posts in the past)

The problem I have is two fold. First of perception and then of realities.

Perception.

Let's look at what is being marketed (to the untrained person) Many of the fighters have shaved heads, mohawk cuts, considerable tattoo's and when talked to couldn't string a sentence of more than 5 words together. In addition the reality show for UFC presented similar folk (Chris Leben is truly a representative) who was out of control, wrecked a house, and generally behaved in a way that would not be considered acceptable in society.

If this is what's presented as role models for kids, them I'm sorry, forget it. I wouldn't let my kids within a mile of somewhere where this sport was trained and this kind of person and their behavior was held up as a virtue.

More traditional MA's (Karate, Judo etc.) have long held the values of control and self discipline as fundamental to their practice. This is a fundamental difference to the "let it all hang out" philosophy of MMA.

Reality

The idea of 6 year olds, however well protected and controlled, being put in a competetive environment where they can beat on each other, I find abhorent. I would find the same with boxing, karate, etc at this age, but from the look of it I can see why the public may look at the kids in a cage and be shocked.

If MMA wants to continue its growth as a main stream MA (and I believe that BJJ and MMA did a lot to dispel a lot of BS prevelant in TMA) then it needs to look at what it's presenting in the long term in lieu of short term.

If it wants to project itself as unrestrained violence that simply satisfies viewers bloodlust, then don't be suprised when the arbitors of public tastes come down heavy on it and it goes the way of the Dodo.

I believe that MMA has both good and bad sides to it and in order for it to be seen in the right light and continue its development, its image needs to be carefully considered.

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#390987 - 04/14/08 10:01 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: Ed_Morris]
McSensei Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/15/05
Posts: 1068
Loc: Kent, England

I agree with the post by VDJ and request that the picture be deleted. Despite the fact that it 'amuses' a moderator is no reason to leave it there


Edited by JohnL (04/14/08 11:07 AM)
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#390988 - 04/14/08 10:34 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: McSensei]
SNieves Offline
Member

Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 76
Well said McSensei. Last I knew, a moderator's job was to enforce the rules, not go by their own personal feelings.
Hasta.



Edited by JohnL (04/14/08 11:10 AM)

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#390989 - 04/14/08 10:55 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: McSensei]
MattJ Offline
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Tony -

This thread is not a political statement. It was more a statement on hypocrisy in the media when discussing kids and MMA. Some people have no problems teaching kids how to use firearms, but balk at combat sports. Is that hypocritical? How about how MMA is marketed? Is that hypocritical?

Does anyone agree that Hannity did a good, fair job on the story?


Edited by MattJ (04/14/08 11:13 AM)
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#390990 - 04/14/08 11:07 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: MattJ]
cxt Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/11/03
Posts: 5823
Loc: USA
In general, part of the problem is that MMA is kinda a victim of its own marketing.

The sport has taken great pains to show how "tough" and "real" and yes..brutal..the fights and training can be.

And its worked.

In a nut shell, now that they have convienced people MMA is the real deal...people are getting worried about kids doing it.

(and to a lesser extent non-pro adults)

Not saying its right of course...there is no reason why, with the proper coaching, MMA is any more dangerous than anything else...such as boxing or football etc.

Its a brand problem that is going to have serious repurcussions for years to come.....how do you take an activity that markets the "blood and guts" and present it as safe for people esp children to practice without hurting and undercutting the brand??????

Tough question....for which if I had a good answer I would be calling Dana White.


Edited by cxt (04/14/08 11:14 AM)
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#390991 - 04/14/08 11:12 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: cxt]
JohnL Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 4309
Loc: NY, NY, USA
Guys
I have de-politicized the posts. If you're upset, tough.

I leave it to Raul to decide if the picture should stay or not.

Let's keep on topic. I think it's an important one that should be discussed and taken further.

Thanks for your cooperation.
John
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#390992 - 04/14/08 11:18 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: cxt]
JohnL Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 4309
Loc: NY, NY, USA
cxt

It's also interesting to note that when BJJ came on the scene (the pre-cursor to MMA events) and dominated events, many of the fights won by Gracie and subsequently focused on were won by arm locks, leg locks, and strangles. The publics perception of these was one of tolerance because it seemed an almost non-violent method of ending a conflict.

I know that many were bloody affairs but the focus was more on the Gracies.

That seems in marked contrast to the striking oriented affairs (especially from the mount) which seem to influence peoples perception of events today.
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#390993 - 04/14/08 11:35 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA *DELETED* [Re: JohnL]
SNieves Offline
Member

Registered: 12/13/07
Posts: 76
Post deleted by JohnL


Edited by SNieves (04/14/08 11:39 AM)

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#390994 - 04/14/08 11:53 AM Re: Sean Hannity on youth MMA [Re: SNieves]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
Personally I rather chuckled at Raul's keeping of the picture and if I'd been modd'ing this thread I'd have done exactly the same thing! It's a bloody internet forum for god sake, smile and see the humour in it! Why don't we get back to commenting on some of the interesting points raised in this thread rather than bitching about how crap the moderating team is? Don't you think we already know that? We've accepted it, so should you, now move on....either in this thread, or if the forum as a whole is so unbearable...ease the pain man!

Now I for one totally agree that MMA marketing is to blame for all of this. Sensationalism sells. The fighters are buying into it for bigger pay cheques. The Promoters are buying into for bigger pay cheques. The networks are playing the same song too. And whose supplying the dollar bills for the bigger pay cheques......the consuming public. To me the UFC is now 90% WWE and only 10% about skilled athletes fighting. Like John I don't want my fighting in a cage, but I believe that's a billion times safer than a lot of other sports. And public perception is as it is because of the way Ultimate Fight Championship and it's ilk are promoted. I wouldn't now watch a live PPV if my life depended on it, I'll tape the free re-runs and whizz through the BS amateur dramatics to get to the athletes competing. The MMA industry complaining about this where really it only has it's self to blame.
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