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#389769 - 04/03/08 08:35 AM Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!)
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Anyone see the Ulitimate Fight Night Live last night? Some very controversial calls from Steve Mazzagatti in the Karo Parisyan vs Thiago Alves and Houston Alexander vs James Irvin fights.

Judge for yourself:

http://www.mmascraps.com/

I think he was right in both cases, but........

Maybe another second or two to give the defenders a chance to show that they are defending or not. Very tough call.

Thoughts?
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"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#389770 - 04/03/08 10:15 AM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: MattJ]
Cord Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/13/05
Posts: 11399
Loc: Cambridge UK.
Alexander was done. No question. Caught cold. If Mazzagati hadnt stepped in, he just would have been sent to the ER. His arms were out to his sides, and whilst the fists were in the air, he was not able to defend himself.

Great superman punch, looked to have landed right off the tip of the chin- reminds me of Arlovski vs Buentello.

The reffs always get a tough time of it. Its a mark of just how good Big John is that he is actively appreciated by fans. Herb Dean has made some bad calls in his time, but Mazagatti was spot on this week.
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#389771 - 04/03/08 01:46 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: Cord]
Dereck Offline
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Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Alexander was definitely out, no question and he can deny it but that is the fact. Parisyan as well went limp and dropped though he recovered fast however not enough to really defend himself. His arms may have covered his head but by no means was that defending himself but rather that is how his body turned when being hit. These are know as flash knockouts where the person is not even aware they went out and it is only for a fraction of a second. The ref stepped in and it is possible that Parisyan may have been better off then Alexander to continue however you cannot leave that to chance and the ref made the right call.

Being a ref in a combat sport is a tough job. There is a fine line between many calls that if they let it go the person takes a real bad beating so they side on caution. I would rather side on caution then chance.
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#389772 - 04/03/08 02:25 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: Dereck]
dicen Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 57
I don't know I looked at the Parisyan fight a couple times and I think that one was called too early. I go by this rule if the winner is says "I think the ref did a good job." during the interview it usually means the ref called the fight too early. I've seen Mazzigoti take longer to call a fight and he's a really good ref. Look at the Florian fight and how long it took the ref to call that one. Yes there wasn't a knock out but Lozoune couldn't do anything but lay there and get beat and the fight went on for a full minute or longer before the fight was called.

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#389773 - 04/03/08 02:57 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: dicen]
BrianRVanCise Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/06
Posts: 110
Loc: Alma, Michigan
The Lozone fight was a good call. The Alexander fight was a good call as well. Unfortunately the Parisiyan fight could have gone a little longer. Just my 02.

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#389774 - 04/03/08 03:01 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: BrianRVanCise]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
So...would a standing 8 count be good for the sport??

Tough because of tap outs, but I would love to see it!
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#389775 - 04/03/08 04:17 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: Kimo2007]
Seiken Offline
Member

Registered: 03/29/08
Posts: 131
Loc: USA
No standing 8 count IMO. It contradicts the many claims that MMA is safer than Boxing and most other contact sports. If a fighter is damaged enough to need a break by way of intervention ..... then he is defeated. Life is precious.

EDIT: BTW.. I think Mazzagatti was pretty spot on. Alexander clearly out, Karo was in trouble, recovering from a flash knockout and recovering while someone like Thiago Alves is whooping you a good one are two different animals.


Edited by Seiken (04/03/08 04:22 PM)

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#389776 - 04/03/08 08:36 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: BrianRVanCise]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

The Lozone fight was a good call. The Alexander fight was a good call as well. Unfortunately the Parisiyan fight could have gone a little longer. Just my 02.




Parisyian fight was a tough call. When he got hit, his legs instantly turned to jello, implying he was KTFO. He did seem to recover quickly once down, though. Watch that second right when Karo gets hit - I can understand the call, although *I* might have let the fight go on for another second or two.

Tough call.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#389777 - 04/03/08 08:56 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: MattJ]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Moustacheagatti is a seasoned ref and has made plenty of good calls on many different fight cards.

The refs only have a few seconds,if that, to determine what to do. Very hard job imo and someone will always whine. Their job is to keep the fighters safe,bottom line.

I would offer them some cheese and tell them to get back to training.
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#389778 - 04/03/08 09:16 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: BrianS]
BrianRVanCise Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/06
Posts: 110
Loc: Alma, Michigan
No standing eight. No way!

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#389779 - 04/03/08 09:22 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: MattJ]
BrianRVanCise Offline
Member

Registered: 05/14/06
Posts: 110
Loc: Alma, Michigan
Quote:

Quote:

The Lozone fight was a good call. The Alexander fight was a good call as well. Unfortunately the Parisiyan fight could have gone a little longer. Just my 02.




Parisyian fight was a tough call. When he got hit, his legs instantly turned to jello, implying he was KTFO. He did seem to recover quickly once down, though. Watch that second right when Karo gets hit - I can understand the call, although *I* might have let the fight go on for another second or two.

Tough call.




That is pretty much where I sit as well. I would have let it go a little bit longer.


Edited by BrianRVanCise (04/03/08 09:24 PM)

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#389780 - 04/07/08 04:11 PM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: BrianRVanCise]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
I think he did a great job in each fight. Of course a fighters going think its too close, fighters want to fight but thats not their call. I can't see how Alexander could view the replay and say he wasn't defenseless.

I'm a Parisyian fan but his legs went limp under him and he was done even though instinctively he covered, trained fighters do that even cold cocked.
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#389781 - 04/08/08 08:51 AM Re: Mazzagatti as a MMA ref (spoilers!) [Re: MattJ]
Supremor Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
Man, how good is the lightweight division at the moment!?! Aurelio's transition to an armbar was incredible, and Gamburyan had a gorgeous throw and a lightening quick guillotine. The fights that went on longer really showed the quality of both fighters. Sammy Schiavo's stand-up was absolutely awesome, although he looked a bit lacking on the ground, mainly because of Guida's brilliant wrestling and constant pressure. Guida-Huerta had to be the fight of the year in 2007, and both fighters seem capable of putting on a show everytime they fight.

My favourite fight had to be Maynard-Edgar. I had Maynard as my pick on the ultimate fighter, and was pretty disappointed when he lost. The guy's wrestling is just incredible, I mean he was punishing Edgar in the third round. Also, Maynard's stand-up is looking pretty technical at the moment- there were some nice knees too- something I wasn't so impressed with when he was on TUF. The sky's the limit for both those guys.

It's funny, after watching Sherk-Franca, I honestly thought that no-one was going to be able to challenge Sherk for a long time. But in the last year, the lightweight division has become so deep, and the card for the event showed that. It had to be one of the best cards I've ever seen on the UFC, and certainly the best Ultimate Fight Night so far.

Honestly, at the moment, I could get by just watching the Lightweight and welterweight divisions on the UFC. Sure there are some great heavier fighters, but for depth, excitement and technicality, the lighter divisions are unbeatable.

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