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#388677 - 03/28/08 02:24 PM 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense.
Zombie Zero Offline
Compliance & Liability
Veteran

Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 1993
Loc: Lorton, VA
A martial arts expert was accosted by three people. One of them pointed a gun at him, demanding his money.

He pushed the gun away, and delivered a beat-down.

Nice that he was able to defend himself, but I have to question his common sense.

Skill level notwithstanding, if someone points a gun at me, they're an instant winner. They get my money. I never carry enough cash worth the risk of getting ventilated over.
_________________________
In my walk in the martial way, my hope is that as long as I live, I will always be a beginner.

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#388678 - 03/28/08 02:30 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: Zombie Zero]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
Agreed in Theory, but we don't know the whole story either, he may have had reason to think he was in Mortal danger.

I wonder if he used one of those gun disarms the don't work
_________________________
Undefeated in all of Asia!

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#388679 - 03/28/08 02:41 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: Kimo2007]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
I will agree with Kimo until we find out more. If I thought someone was going to kill me even if I gave them the money, I would fight back, too.

I thought high-kicks didn't work, either.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#388680 - 03/28/08 02:42 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: Kimo2007]
Zombie Zero Offline
Compliance & Liability
Veteran

Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 1993
Loc: Lorton, VA
Quote:

Agreed in Theory, but we don't know the whole story either, he may have had reason to think he was in Mortal danger.





True, but in my thinking, if I grab the one gun I can see, the other two that had until then been hidden come out and commence to splatterin'.

[I agree, if you're positive they're going to shoot, (and you can't run) then fight like a (wo)man possessed. ]
_________________________
In my walk in the martial way, my hope is that as long as I live, I will always be a beginner.

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#388681 - 03/28/08 03:25 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: Zombie Zero]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
Quote:

True, but in my thinking, if I grab the one gun I can see, the other two that had until then been hidden come out and commence to splatterin'.




Maybe, but if the other 2 are cool enough to draw on you and shoot you down while you are beating down the first guy, then you probably aren't going to get the first gun either.

One thing I should mention is despite what I have said about disarms, if the guy with the gun knows what he is doing, you aren't going to disarm him (very very low odds). For a disarm to be effective the one with the gun needs to make a mistake.

Back to our 3 amigos, if they have a gun and suddenly the tables are turned, good chance they freeze. The lost upper hand can have paralyzing effects on people.
_________________________
Undefeated in all of Asia!

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#388682 - 03/28/08 03:37 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: Zombie Zero]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
I agree unless he thought that his life was threaten even after he gave up the money, then defend yourself.

I question his defense you grab the gun and kick someone in the face and DON'T disarm them, Once you get a hold the gun you never let go. Unless doing so place you in imenient danger, like a car coming at you. But running from a gun to across the street unless its around the quickest corner and another or behind a car and keep moving until you escape is dumb and asking to get shot in the back. Like it was mentioned we were not there so we don't know the entire story.

The thing that can't be questioned is that it worked this time. Zero common sense and Zero SD sense.
_________________________
DBAckerson

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#388683 - 03/29/08 02:20 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Neko456]
Novum Offline
Member

Registered: 02/25/08
Posts: 58
Loc: New England
wow, I guess head kicks work wonders in street combat as long as you're kicking girls in the head. *takes notes* I'd have never thought that was the case.
_________________________
Therefore we are not justified in saying that all reality is in perfect agreement and harmony.

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#388684 - 03/29/08 02:42 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Novum]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
If the girl has a gun in her hand she becomes the weapon. If he gouge her eyes and broke her arm or legs as disarmed her thats tough sh%$. And shot the other two punks with gun he took. You order sh$%%, you eat it. Get a Job like the rest of us.

A woman can kill as easily as a Axe murder, with a weapon. Stop the macho crap, lets keep it real.
_________________________
DBAckerson

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#388685 - 03/29/08 03:01 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Neko456]
Novum Offline
Member

Registered: 02/25/08
Posts: 58
Loc: New England
Not knocking the guy for kicking a girl in the head at all, just taking scientific note that they're more vulnerable to it. I'm not about being macho at all, I'd squish a midget if he had a gun on me.
_________________________
Therefore we are not justified in saying that all reality is in perfect agreement and harmony.

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#388686 - 03/29/08 03:47 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Novum]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
I agree totally but we fight the way we train, its proven. Midget or woman with a weapon I'm with you. You order sh$%,...
_________________________
DBAckerson

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#388687 - 03/29/08 04:27 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Novum]
drgndrew Offline
< a god, > a man.
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 599
Loc: Toowoomba, Qld, Australia
Quote:

Not knocking the guy for kicking a girl in the head at all, just taking scientific note that they're more vulnerable to it.




just how are females "scientifically" more vulnerable to a head kick???


no comment on the disarm, I wasn't there and don't know the ins and outs.
_________________________
Sumo Pacis (Choose Peace)

With Honour in Bushido
Drew Guest
www.ToowoombaSelfDefence.websyte.com.au
Bushi Dojos Self Protection
Toowoomba Self Defence

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#388688 - 03/29/08 04:33 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: drgndrew]
Novum Offline
Member

Registered: 02/25/08
Posts: 58
Loc: New England
Referring to my personal notes: documented successful head kicks against armed male assailants-0
documented successful head kicks against armed female assailants-1. You see my logic? hahaha, take it easy, I'm just joking around. Some people are no fun at all.
_________________________
Therefore we are not justified in saying that all reality is in perfect agreement and harmony.

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#388689 - 03/29/08 06:27 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Novum]
drgndrew Offline
< a god, > a man.
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 599
Loc: Toowoomba, Qld, Australia
I just thought a male would be more vulnerable due to having 2 heads, one located 2.5-3ft closest to the ground
_________________________
Sumo Pacis (Choose Peace)

With Honour in Bushido
Drew Guest
www.ToowoombaSelfDefence.websyte.com.au
Bushi Dojos Self Protection
Toowoomba Self Defence

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#388690 - 03/29/08 08:54 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Zombie Zero]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
I'd say the guy is lucky he isn't dead and that he was apparently targeted by the Apple Dumpling Gang.

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#388691 - 03/29/08 01:10 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: drgndrew]
Leo_E_49 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/24/05
Posts: 4117
Loc: California
Quote:

I just thought a male would be more vulnerable due to having 2 heads, one located 2.5-3ft closest to the ground




Ouch! Regrettably true.
_________________________
Self Defense
(Website by Marc MacYoung, not me)

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#388692 - 03/29/08 07:14 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: Zombie Zero]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3116
Loc: East Coast, United States
"The Darwin Principle" AGAIN... wow.

Style and stupidity are different S words, but I would substitute them in this particular case . He rolled the dice and won, this time...



Jeff

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#388693 - 04/04/08 07:12 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Ronin1966]
Jacob Offline
Newbie

Registered: 04/03/08
Posts: 8
This is why you carry your concealed .32 in the pocket where one usually keeps one's wallet.

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#388694 - 04/20/08 01:24 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: Neko456]
haze Offline
Dragon

Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 106
Loc: Syracuse NY USA
Pushed the gun kicked her and ran,,,,,not much of a beat down.

Maybe he knew the gun was not real and ran because he also felt that the other 2 men might beat him down.
_________________________
David

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#388695 - 04/30/08 04:52 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: haze]
werewolf Offline
Member

Registered: 07/06/05
Posts: 29
Loc: northwest
With the information given, I'd say this man isn't the brightest bulb in the box. My first and third rules of weapon defense...Give them what they want.
_________________________
Uhhh...hi

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#388696 - 05/12/08 11:58 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: Zombie Zero]
MAGon Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/22/03
Posts: 1737
Loc: Miami, Fl.
I know I've said this before here on the forums, and some of the oldtimers are apt to get testy with me for repeating myself, but here goes: Many years ago I ran into some copies of one of the early H2H manuals of the Brit commandos. In it were quite a few armed-vs.-unarmed techniques against rifle, bayonet, pistol, knife, etc. But at the bottom of one of the pages was a very stark comment by the author or authors, stating that an unarmed commando using these techniques stood a 10% chance of surviving the encounter with an armed opponent. Therefore the techniques were meant to be used when it was judged that death was inevitable, regardless of whether or not resistance was offered.
It struck me hard then, as a young MArtist who believed that he could do the same thing as in the Bruce Lee- Chuck Norris movies, if only he trained hard enough. It brought in a healthy dose of reality to my thinking.
To this day, I guide myself by this principle of 10% survivability against an armed attacker. Thank God it's been many, many years since I've had to even think about it!
_________________________
Just when you think something is foolproof, they come out with a new and improved type of fool.

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#388697 - 05/15/08 07:24 AM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for sense. [Re: MAGon]
sasori_te Offline
Member

Registered: 05/04/08
Posts: 39
Loc: Matthews, NC
This one is for Neko.

"If the girl has a gun in her hand she becomes the weapon. If he gouge her eyes and broke her arm or legs as disarmed her thats tough sh%$. And shot the other two punks with gun he took. You order sh$%%, you eat it. Get a Job like the rest of us."

Unfortunately, in our lovely litigious society this would over-step the bounds of reasonable force. Sure, you could probably get away with killing or maiming the person with the gun, but as long as the other two were just standing there you couldn't by law touch them. As a trained person you open yourself up to more liability than your average joe. To put it in words closer to your own, they might have ordered sh!t but you'd end up stuck with the check.

However, I agree with your general sentiment. As one of my previous instructors used to ask, "Is it better to be tried by 12 or carried by 6"?

Check please
_________________________
A block is a strike is a lock is a throw ....

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#388698 - 05/16/08 02:22 PM Re: 10 out of 10 for style, but a flat zero for se [Re: JKogas]
ITFJJ Offline
Member

Registered: 05/08/07
Posts: 88
Loc: Montréal
Quote:

I'd say the guy is lucky he isn't dead and that he was apparently targeted by the Apple Dumpling Gang.




That is too funny and too true
_________________________
ITF II Dan

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