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#383775 - 09/19/08 12:04 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: JAMJTX]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Prize,

I agree with what you've said;

IMO, all mr Cates is teaching is a form of Goshin Jutsu, which in itself is just a branch of Judo for self-defense, not a style in itself. It's like saying 'I'm teaching Shuk-a-Do which is basically Goju-ryu Bunkai'.

I'm sick of all these 'New Jitsu'. They don't teach anything new, just sloppy mish mash of who knows what.

~Donnie
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#383776 - 09/19/08 06:05 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: Taison]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:

Other than that, I enjoy humiliating them by wearing a pink gi, however, instead of pants they have to wear a kilt colored like the american flag just to show patriotism.




LMAO You made me shoot coffee out my nose dude!

Anyway, I know nothing about the style, but I don't get reinventing the wheel like that.

Why not just do Judo and integrate whatever else you like?


Edited by Zach_Zinn (09/19/08 06:35 PM)

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#383777 - 09/19/08 10:22 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: Zach_Zinn]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Exactly,

What's the purpose besides monetary benefits for founding your own system?

~Donnie
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#383778 - 09/19/08 11:08 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: Taison]
OldJudoka Offline
Stranger

Registered: 09/18/08
Posts: 3
Shouldn't have taken offense, sorry.

Professor is now 75 and not very internet-savvy. I tend to be a bit protective of him on-line.

Apologies to all.

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#383779 - 09/20/08 03:20 AM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: OldJudoka]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Lol, feel free to hate me

I'm not accusing Mr Cates of being a fraud or anything. Just think it's weird he founded his own system when he's just teaching Judo with some mix of this and that.

~Donnie
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#383780 - 09/21/08 06:58 AM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: OldJudoka]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Well no need for apologies. Sometimes these threads can seem personal, but I can assure you this is not the case!

Again, Mr Cates may well be a very good teacher. Certainly I would like to still be active in Martial arts aged 75!!! And from the link I posted earlier, I like the sound of "Successful principles and techniques for longevity in the martial arts"

Sometimes the names of these "New Jitsu" styles ( I am copyrighting that term BTW!!) can actually do more harm than good. If I looked at the name "Neko-Ryu Goshin Jitsu" I would initially have a negative reaction. If I seen the "World Sokeship Council..." thing, I wouldn't even pay Neko Ryu Goshin Jitsu a second thought...

If I read what Mr Cates was actually teaching though (Judo, Judo from a SD perspective and Longevity in Martial Arts) then I would be quite interested in having a look!

The problem is when people muddy the pool of what it is they are teaching by adding all these whistles and bells, it can be easy to dismiss them, despite that fact that when it comes to the actual martial arts side of it, they actually have sound knowledge and would be a good source of training.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#383781 - 10/29/08 12:47 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: Prizewriter]
Ames Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 1117
Quote:

They are created by people who have had little to no experience of authentic, traditional Japanese Ju Jutsu. They study some Judo, a bit of Karate, and hey presto, they make up a "Ju Jitsu" style




Just to play devil's advocate here, but couldn't one say this about 'Gracie Jujitsu'. I mean, no, there isn't any Karate,but its basically just Judo techniques used with an altered strategy. To my knowledge, the Gracie's had absolutely no training or knowledge of 'authentic' Japanese Jujutsu.
_________________________
"Seek not to follow in the footsteps of the men of old; seek what they sought."
--Basho

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#383782 - 10/29/08 01:44 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: Ames]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Possibly, but the thing with Gracie Jiu Jitsu is that they tell people it is what it is i.e. their Jiu Jitsu, their method of Jiu Jitsu. They don't pretend that it is some antiquated art form from medieval Japan. They are clear and direct about what they were taught, and how they adapted it, and how it came to be. They also named it to show it's unique identity, in comparison to traditional JJ.

I have read that at the time of Count Mitsuyo Maeda arriving in Brazil the term "Judo" wasn't widely in use. Some folks referred to what we considered as Judo as "Kano's Ju Jutsu" or "Kodokan Ju Jutsu". The Gracies may have been following that trend.

My initial objection was people using a full title made up of Japanese (e.g. "Atemi Aiki-Jutsu") for JJ to make is seem like a traditional Japanese Art, in order to get Samauri Fantasists in through the door. It's an abuse of a culture and language to turn a quick buck in many cases.

People would be better following the Gracies example and calling any new interrpretation of JJ after themselves or the place it originated from e.g. Robert Clarke could call his style "British Ju Jitsu" or "Clarkes Ju Jitsu" to show that it is something he created out of his own experience, rather than having people in the WJJF tell everyone they are learning a "traditional Japanese art".
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#383783 - 10/29/08 04:28 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: Prizewriter]
JMWcorwin Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/13/07
Posts: 731
Loc: SoCal, USA


nuff said.. new thread.
_________________________
There are no PERFECT techniques, only perfect execution for the situation at hand. ~Corwin

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#383784 - 11/02/08 01:43 PM Re: Neko-ryu Goshin Jitsu: Thoughts/Opinions? [Re: JMWcorwin]
Ames Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 1117
Don't you love it when people declare a thread as being "done"? It's a great way to kill what could be an interesting conversation. These are discussion boards after all. If you don't feel like the reading the thread, then don't. But to declare it "done" is very rude, no matter how many greaemlins you throw out there.

Prizewriter:

I agree with you that someone should be upfront about where their style of jujitsu came from. I often read sites where the jujitsu is obviously modern, yet it gives it's history as coming from 'ancient Samurai techniques etc."

My point was more that there are indeed new takes on jujutsu that appear from time to time that have merit. However, the style should make clear where its origins come from, this I agree with.

--Chris
_________________________
"Seek not to follow in the footsteps of the men of old; seek what they sought."
--Basho

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