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#377936 - 04/16/08 04:48 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: EFRAIN]
fileboy2002 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 999
Loc: Chicago, IL
Here's a good question: Why has this thread been allowed to go on (and on and on and on and on) while so many others have been locked down so fast?

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#377937 - 04/16/08 06:07 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: fileboy2002]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
... sssshhhhh .... we are going for the world record.

Actually I think the post had finished as the last one was on the 30th of March. But as you've jumped on 17 days later and now I've posted ... this bad boy may come to life again.

_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#377938 - 04/16/08 07:59 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: fileboy2002]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Well the topic was where it should be:
TKD/Korean Arts

The majority here are interested in this. The common perception is that TKD, the world's most popular MA, is becoming weak or watered down. Hence the rise in MMAs for SD purposes. So we had a bunch of people on both sides debating their hearts out.
Is it a record?

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#377939 - 04/16/08 11:01 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: ITFunity]
EFRAIN Offline
Member

Registered: 08/14/05
Posts: 193
Loc: Paterson, NJ USA
IT'S ALIVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE LOL
THE POST IS BACK...


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#377940 - 04/16/08 11:02 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: EFRAIN]
EFRAIN Offline
Member

Registered: 08/14/05
Posts: 193
Loc: Paterson, NJ USA
I THINK LOL....

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#377941 - 04/17/08 02:57 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: fileboy2002]
Supremor Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 2510
Loc: UK
Quote:


Here's a good question: Why has this thread been allowed to go on (and on and on and on and on) while so many others have been locked down so fast?




Because on this thread the usually fractious world of TKD has actually been able to string together a conversation without turning to swearing, name-calling or flaming. It's not like I ever want to close a thread, but when you have two posters highjacking a thread for a slanging match, I have no choice but to close the thread.

I hope that this thread will become the template of future long threads. It is much more preferable than what I have had to moderate in the past!

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#377942 - 04/17/08 06:14 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: Supremor]
trevek Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/15/05
Posts: 3337
Loc: Poland
Exactly. The thread developed and evolved, bringing with it some very good conversation and points.
_________________________
See how well I block your punches with my jaw!!

Supporting everyone saying "nuts to cancer"

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#377943 - 04/20/08 05:36 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: BrianS]
jeff_andle Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 241
Loc: Falmouth, Maine USA
To quote Mr. Miaggi, "... have all kinds of belts". Who cares what belt you have or need? I've seen people walk into my school with no formal training whatsoever and instictively show common sense reaction with good technique and I've seen 3rd and 4th dan students with absolutely no reflexes that were amazing instructors.

The burning desire to ridicule MMA as the new pop art is saddening. It's not my art, but I respect its intent. The simple fact is the mixing martial arts is needed in any no rules competition. "MMA" is simply a formed style mixing a few that seem to work well together.

UFC may only be polular because it is graphically brutal. It is UFC that most people discuss when they berate MMA. MMA is mostly practiced out of view of the camera and isn't there to entertain drooling arm-chair warriors. It's there for start to finish fighting/defense.

That said, I've never needed to use self defense in the 7 years that I have been studying martial arts. When i did need self defense it was to protect my face from cashing my mouth's checks, but I was up to the general level of need without training.

Until people admit that others train for different reasons then each other there will always be senseless debates full of scrimony and false pride. I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that my style is best - for me. It doesn't even matter which style that is.

I would agree that MMA does attrat a lot of people that are fighters and not artists. Maybe we can introduce a new division amongst ourselves?
_________________________
sam dan Songham Taekwondo The learning has just begun...

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#377944 - 04/20/08 06:01 PM Re: Taekwonddiscussio loosing it's face/popularity [Re: von1]
jeff_andle Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 241
Loc: Falmouth, Maine USA
Quote:

With a well defined system and strong governing body those not affiliated would not be TKD. This is impossible though unless ITF and WTF come together as one, determine the standards, monitor those standards, enforce the standards, and legally expel those clubs that do not live up to the minimum standards. The only way to pull this off is with a governing body that consist of both WTF, and ITF, so there is no question who governs and owns the TKD concept. With out involvement from both we end up with what we have now, two main entities fighting for recognition and dominance.




I am sure that ATA falls in your definition of McDojo, but to say that ITF and WTF define what is or isn't TKD is laughable if not for that fact that it underlies the many layers of division that will never be patched over in my lifetime.

FWIW, these schools have their place and serve their purpose. Even if you do not respect the use of TKD as a vehicle for making kids into better people (and maybe adding a percentage of them to the roles of serious MA students), you can hardly dismiss an organization which has had a million people train for some period of time and has hundreds of thousands of ongoing students.

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#377945 - 04/20/08 06:08 PM Re: Taekwonddiscussio loosing it's face/popularity [Re: ITFunity]
jeff_andle Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 241
Loc: Falmouth, Maine USA
Quote:

Keep in mind, when it comes to McDojangs, standards mean little, as if they are not applied locally, that is, in the school, then all the high standards don't amount to a hill of beans. For instance a certified ITF II can test up to half their rank. So a 4th dan can give up to a 2nd dan to their students based soley on their signature. Likewise a 6th Dan can do the same up to 3rd. The change takes place at 4th, where the ITF promotion committee rules take over.





FWIW, ATA rules are that there must be two fully certified instructors having at least two dan levels higher than the testing student's new rank. As a 3rd dan I can test and mid term first dan but need to invite two 4th dan guests in order to hold a midterm for my student that wishes to test for 2nd dan recommended, etc.

Tesing into 4th dan requires:
testin at national or world tournament in front of a panel of 6th, 7th, & 8th dan (maybe at grand master's table even),

having passed three mid term exams,

having held 3rd dan for at least three years,

being a full-time instructor in a licensed school.

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