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#377386 - 02/08/08 11:18 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: von1]
VDJ Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 1674
Why not just look to include it at the East Coast get together in August (posted on the martial arts talk forum).

VDJ

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#377387 - 02/08/08 11:59 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: VDJ]
EFRAIN Offline
Member

Registered: 08/14/05
Posts: 193
Loc: Paterson, NJ USA
Sure..I can bring some of my GTF TKD and Yin style Bagua zhang buddies...

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#377388 - 02/09/08 12:22 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: von1]
flynch Offline
Member

Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 265
Quote:

Flynch

It sounds like you have the inside dope but want to keep it to your self. This forum is about conversing why not share with the rest of us this secret knowledge. This is what its all about, putting things out there and having friendly debate it will just not be as one sided as it used to be. No disrespect intended just trying to get you to open up more with your reply to ITFUNITY




No not trying to be secretive. I have been involved in these type of discussions to varying degrees for about four years and helping edit aricles and interviews and a book on Tae Kown Do history for the last three. I was just reminding ITFunity about some of them. There are no secrets. There is the truth which we will never really know and then there are the stories from the people that were there which allow us to form opinions based on those peoples character and some historical information which we can use to come to our own conclusions. the WTF has one story and the ITF has another story. The dificulty lies in teh fact that some of the people who where actually there in th 50's, 60's etc are still aroung and practicing Tae Kwon Do and they remember the events slightly different than others do. Since I am fairly knew to this board I know what it would sound like if I started to make statements like my instrcutor said this...
I too just want to discuss things. I did not mean to be secretive.

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#377389 - 02/09/08 12:47 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: von1]
flynch Offline
Member

Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 265
Quote:

ITFUNITY

The part of your reply from the very first sentence, made me dizzy! "Even those that just do Olympic sparing are still in a better position to defend themselves if they did nothing. This is what I am talking about, I do not know of a single school that only teaches Olympic sparing! I am sure if some one searched the globe long enough one may find one somewhere, this is what is driving me crazy on this forum, the insistence that these schools are everywhere. This is exactly the attitude I am trying to dispel because it simply is not so. Yes there are bad instructor always has been even in old day training. Next dizzying comment, If you want sd, one must train in that system that only does SD & nothing else. What the heck system would that be? I can not figure why ITF people insist that they have any better lock on training for SD than a WTF affiliated school, again not so! dizzy dizzy dizzy. I know you meant no harm with your reply this is the underlying attitude on this discussion forum.




It is unfortunate that the Olympic TKD is seen as sport only. I don't think anybody is saying that all schools are sport but there seems to be alot out there that focus on sport start the kids off at 4-5 years old and they are ready for their BB in two years. I am not sure about where you are so I can only comment on what I see. Around here or with in 10 minutes of my house there are 5 WTF schools (1 also teaches Kum Do), 1 ITF school (ITF-V), 6 karate schools (2 run by JC Kim's students teaching ITF patterns) 2 Kickboxing (one by former UFC guy) and 2 BJJ schools. I try to talk to the instructors, go visit the schools in my spare time and I wach the classes.

Me I still drive an hour across town to train. Although we teach ITF we have a fair number of WTF people come by because of our level of sparring. Some of these people are WTF black belts straight from korea (we are at a university). Some are good and others well...So that is where I get my opinions from.

Back to the point of this thread. Tae Kwon Do has gained populatiy over the years but because of this it has been watered down and now there is alot of TKD lite being taught because that is what sells and that is what the suburbia wants. But that does not mean that there can't be good schools out there. Martial arts is an individual journey it all depends on the instructor and the student (and the student should take more responsibility as they progress)not the martial art whether ITF, WTF, TSD, KSD, Karate, Kung Fu, MMS etc..

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#377390 - 02/09/08 02:01 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: flynch]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

Back to the point of this thread. Tae Kwon Do has gained populatiy over the years but because of this it has been watered down and now there is alot of TKD lite being taught because that is what sells and that is what the suburbia wants. But that does not mean that there can't be good schools out there. Martial arts is an individual journey it all depends on the instructor and the student (and the student should take more responsibility as they progress)not the martial art whether ITF, WTF, TSD, KSD, Karate, Kung Fu, MMS etc..




Couldn't agree more, especially about the MAs being a personal journey!

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#377391 - 02/09/08 02:04 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: flynch]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

6 karate schools (2 run by JC Kim's students teaching ITF patterns)




JC Kim was one of the most important ITF instructors. How can his students be teaching Karate?

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#377392 - 02/09/08 02:33 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: ITFunity]
flynch Offline
Member

Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 265
Well one is a Martial Arts Academy the other is labeled Karate but he clearly teaches TKD patterns as I talked with him and watched a few classes. JC Kim lives here and he has a few students with schools I beleive his son also has a school.

I don't think he had a pleasant split with the General

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#377393 - 02/09/08 03:31 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: flynch]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

I don't think he had a pleasant split with the General




That is a shame & something that sadly was repeated all too often. If you can, please PM me if you feel comfortable elaborating.

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#377394 - 02/09/08 10:58 AM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: ITFunity]
von1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 260
To all discussion participants"

I was hoping to generate more opinions, feed back, debate or even criticism from people regarding my reply to ITFUNITY on page 10 posting #15983565 COMENTS ABOUT striking arts, MMA, etc.


Edited by von1 (02/09/08 11:00 AM)

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#377395 - 02/09/08 02:13 PM Re: Taekwondo loosing it's face/popularity [Re: von1]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

ITFUNITY
Respectfully, What do you consider to be original Tae kwon do, It seems to me that all of today's martial arts could be considered sport arts, this is why there is a knock on the striking arts for not having a ground game, or not enough ground game. Lets face it, if the arts that focus perdominatly on striking were taught to be what they once were(killing of the enemy with 1-3 strikes to vital spots) none of the striking arts would need much of a ground game, the last place these combatants wanted to be was on the battle field in the dirt striving for a dominant position to ground and pound the enemy. They strove to strike first, strike hard, strike with precision at vital points and end the encounter fast hopefully ending it in a death so as to move on to their next victim. In to days world these techniques will land you in prison, so all the striking arts have switched to a more competitive focus/sport! We are all being trained to compete with little emphases on killing(this is a good thing) we need now to fight and because we do not want to kill anyone there is now a need for a ground game aspect to our training, there lies the knock on most all the striking arts and the emergence of MMA! Just an observation that I will probably catch he-l for any thoughts anyone?

P.S. I am not implying that people who participate in any of the striking arts could not do great damage or kill an assailant I am only saying that striking arts today have a new goal, competition and entertainment, and they are all losing the battle to MMA. What people in the striking arts were originally meant to be (killing machines when necessary) these skill sets do not transfer over for entertainment because people will die. Many people now days consider MMA to be the real and ultimate form of martial art. The observers of competitions love it when people bleed, me included, however I do not consider MMA to be the real deal as a martial art form. I consider it to be a brutal form of entertainment and a bit of a brawl and have already been informed I am a duff-us for this opinion. To summarize, original striking arts were meant to cause death to an opposing enemy they did not want their warriors to fight, that was their deal and it was real. Not trying to come across as an authority just attempting to stimulate conversation. I can take it if you want to call me a duff-us.




This is the post, I think, right?

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