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#377207 - 05/01/08 10:29 AM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: The_Master]
jkdwarrior Offline
Member

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 341
Loc: belfast, Antrim, Ireland
Yes but my initial point was because he was going to go to a wc class if he couldn't find a jkd one. Since "the master" thinks that jkd sounds right for him, if he was to go to a wc class, he would be getting something completely different.
I'm still adamant that training striking will not make you a good groundfighter, just like playing football won't make you great at swimming. I do understand your point though because even on my first few bjj lessons, I was able to beat the white belts consistently. I did have six years of MA experience beforehand though and had been run through a few things. I very quickly realised however, that I had been missing out on a vital part of fighting.
The only significant difference was that due to my standup training, I improved much quicker than the beginners, but I genuinely could not grapple to a satisfactory level until I fought on the ground regularily
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#377208 - 05/07/08 09:34 PM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: jkdwarrior]
IExcalibui2 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 961
Loc: New York City
Can't say that WC will teach you groundfighting but the knowledge you gain from standup benefits you greatly on the ground. Many southern Chinese MA focus on punching (Wing Chun for example) and if you are on either end of the guard/mount you would be more able to defend yourself against strikes (or on the flip side, start sending bombs). Also any involvement with arm, hand and core strength you already have from all the striking you do.

I say this because thats how I felt whenever I rolled with anybody. I could control their arms and pin them down a lot easier from the misc. trapping techniques and simple movements to gain passage when I delt with striking. I learned to pass people's arms and position them faster because you already learn a bit of that on your feet.
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"you're going to work till you wish you were dead and then keep going.." -Sgt Slaughter

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#377209 - 05/08/08 10:37 AM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: IExcalibui2]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
I believe that JKD gives you a wider idea of what the ranges are in fighting. It has Wing Chun idea of multiple quick efficent strikes at mid to trapping range and uses them more mobile or anyway they can it also has the Savate/Thai/western Boxing/Kali/Silat influence along with various forms of ground fighting to include BJJ/Judo like ne waza.

Wing Chun is a good traditional standup fighting system but lacks the fluidity and flexibility of the eceltic JKD idea. WC lacks the long range, mid range and ground fighting combination of a good JKD program.


Edited by Neko456 (05/08/08 10:38 AM)
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#377210 - 05/08/08 09:31 PM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: Neko456]
IExcalibui2 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 961
Loc: New York City
well I don't treat JKD as a "style" it just helps and guides me on what kind of decisions to make in terms of my training, which includes the multiple ranges that you mentioned.

Personally most of the experience I've had comes from Southern Praying Mantis and informal Muay Thai, though I've picked up many things here n there that I find useful. To me, the close range workings of Southern Mantis (similar to WC) helps me a lot when dealing with a guy on the ground (after I establish position) because of you're both very close and are essentially in trapping range.

you can say that WC lacks a multitude of ranges but many MA out there do as well. Its just because people from different areas encounter different things and design a fighting system around what they see and know. Just natural.
_________________________
"you're going to work till you wish you were dead and then keep going.." -Sgt Slaughter

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#377211 - 05/08/08 10:39 PM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: IExcalibui2]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
True. I've seen JKD guys who ran completely against what I believe the essence of JKD to be. The name has been tossed around like garbage and quite honestly, that's to be expected given that half of the people who practice it probably don't even know what it is.

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#377212 - 05/09/08 03:43 AM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: JKogas]
IExcalibui2 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 961
Loc: New York City
yep...the title of this thread is a fine example of that..
_________________________
"you're going to work till you wish you were dead and then keep going.." -Sgt Slaughter

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#377213 - 05/09/08 04:01 AM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: IExcalibui2]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
I agree completely

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#377214 - 05/09/08 10:22 PM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: IExcalibui2]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
Notice in my last post I referred to JKD as a IDEA. Wing Chun is a style and we are comparing these two fighting methods.

All version of have fighting have gyms that don't produce realistic fighting skills but this is true whether its TKD, JKD, WC or Wu Shu.

But I thought we were comparing functional realistic in method kuens.
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#377215 - 05/10/08 02:34 AM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: Neko456]
IExcalibui2 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 961
Loc: New York City
I dunno..to me JKD is pretty simple and doesnt really teach me fighting method. It just teaches me to be open to all MA, any technique, as long as it works for me so that I'm not closed and blinded (ex. realizing the need for striking AND grappling). Everything else, at least for me, came from just training techniques that say WC would offer. I learn some fighting methods of WC and then some from MT and then some from Mantis and find a way for things to work and *BAM thats my fighting method. JKD did not give me a fighting method, just helped me make my own

thats why I'm not seeing a comparison here....unless your talking about Jun Fan Gungfu.....
_________________________
"you're going to work till you wish you were dead and then keep going.." -Sgt Slaughter

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#377216 - 05/10/08 03:43 AM Re: JKD VS. Wing Chun [Re: IExcalibui2]
The_Master Offline
Banned. With extreme prejudice.

Registered: 04/21/08
Posts: 145
Loc: Australia. aka The Down Under
so JKD is about being open and flexible etc compared to other 'styles' that just say, do what we teach u?
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Use no way as way: JKD. Martial Arts is a way of life.

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