FightingArts Estore
Pressure Points
From a medical professional, straight facts on where and how to hit that can save your life.
Stretching
Limber or not, anyone can add height and speed to their kicks with this method.
Calligraphy
For yourself or as a gift, calligraphy is special, unique and lasting.
Karate Uniforms
Look your best. Max snap. low cost & superior crafted: “Peak Performance Gold” 16 oz uniforms.

MOTOBU
Classic book translation. Hard to find. Not in stores.
Who's Online
0 registered (), 24 Guests and 4 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
sunny, swordy, jerrybarry24, SenseiGregT, sagat
22914 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
Ed_Morris 4
futsaowingchun 3
ergees 2
Zombie Zero 2
AndyLA 2
September
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12 13
14 15 16 17 18 19 20
21 22 23 24 25 26 27
28 29 30
New Topics
STX Kickboxing Seminar
by Marcus Charles
09/09/14 06:57 PM
Biu Tzu- 1st section applications
by futsaowingchun
09/05/14 10:56 PM
2014 World Championships Chelyabinsk: The Gallery
by ergees
09/01/14 03:51 AM
Biu Tzu- Snake hand strike
by futsaowingchun
08/27/14 09:02 PM
Chum Kiu 2nd section applications
by futsaowingchun
08/20/14 09:54 PM
2013 World Championship Rio: The Gallery (HD)
by ergees
08/19/14 05:22 AM
An open letter to bunkai researchers...
by Bartfast
08/05/14 04:18 PM
The Karate punch
by Matakiant
10/30/13 07:41 AM
Where Are They Now?
by Dobbersky
05/30/13 08:08 AM
mindfullness meditation
by
01/06/09 11:27 AM
Recent Posts
** Introduce Yourself! **
by Zombie Zero
Yesterday at 04:43 PM
Eugue Ryu
by kolslaw
09/12/14 03:35 PM
attacked from behind
by AndyLA
09/07/14 07:01 PM
Biu Tzu- 1st section applications
by futsaowingchun
09/05/14 10:56 PM
An open letter to bunkai researchers...
by Bartfast
09/02/14 06:26 PM
2014 World Championships Chelyabinsk: The Gallery
by ergees
09/01/14 03:51 AM
mindfullness meditation
by log1call
08/31/14 09:43 PM
Biu Tzu- Snake hand strike
by futsaowingchun
08/27/14 09:02 PM
The Karate punch
by Ed_Morris
08/26/14 09:27 PM
Chum Kiu 2nd section applications
by futsaowingchun
08/20/14 09:54 PM
Forum Stats
22914 Members
36 Forums
35575 Topics
432492 Posts

Max Online: 424 @ 09/24/13 10:38 PM
Page 4 of 16 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 ... 15 16 >
Topic Options
#368460 - 11/11/07 12:32 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: MattJ]
Raul Perez Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 2805
Loc: Lake Ronkonkoma, NY, USA
Gung Sao anybody?
_________________________
"I'm gonna come at you like a spider monkey"

Top
#368461 - 11/11/07 03:42 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: Ed_Morris]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Quote:

You are right, I'm sceptical of meridian-based theory. I'll try not to be as biased, if you try to read my questions as being neutral...fair enough?





Just couldn't stay "on the wagon" could you, Ed?

Clearly, you are not a proponent of actually studying meridian theory, only discounting it based on arguments. Personally, I didn't see anything personal in Eyrie's suggestion that you actually find someone and train in the arts using them before decrying them as frauds... and I'm not talking about the "chi ball" crowd, but legitimate teachers in legitimate arts.

Find a good Isshin Ryu or Euchi Ryu (probably spelled that wrong) school and actually spend some time finding out the information rather than simply arguing about it.

Quote:

basically you are taking an instructor's word for it....


Okay... but aren't you as well in what you study? That sounds like the "my teacher knows everything but your's is a liar" type of kid's argument. If you want to know for real, go study for yourself. That's not real complicated, even for a skeptic.

You can nit-pick the words, phrases, definitions or anything else of the arguments presented here on the boards and when you're face to face with an opponent, it's the fire in the furnace that burns you. I'm completely comfortable with you having no faith in dim mak, meridians, and for that matter, any art or technique system that I've ever studied. It's an advantage to me to have everyone thinking I know nothing, and only talk a good fight. The proof's on the floor...

What I always found interesting, was that the skeptics of martial arts (while they might be good athletes) never really understood the information they got. They were consistently outclassed by masters who were well up in age, and who had no problems with them walking away from the schools or systems without learning the full scale of their abilities.

Modern martial arts aren't traditional martial arts, even in the TMA schools. "Bought" instruction is a product, not a skillset trained over and over for years to learn the defined skills of an art. 24-month black belts don't have the skills of 5 year shodans, and when they were taught by green belts until they made "black belt class" where they were taught by 17 year-old shodans, the level of both instruction and information went down considerably.

I told you many times before that I sought out "master instructors"... not necessarily the ones with the big reputations, but with world-class skills, and who were known internationally for their level of expertise. Whether or not you believe what they taught me is like my dog barking at the moon... the moon doesn't hear it and really doesn't care.

Your lack of faith in old knowledge doesn't make it moot.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#368462 - 11/11/07 06:03 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: wristtwister]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
Quote:

The proof's on the floor...



a simple question I asked earlier: What is the nature of that 'proof on the floor' when it comes to Dim Mak?

Top
#368463 - 11/11/07 06:32 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: MattJ]
eyrie Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/28/04
Posts: 3106
Loc: QLD, Australia
Quote:

Yet another condescending, ad hominem attack. Don't suppose you would care to actually answer a question, or actually add some detail, would you?


Er... which part of look up "musculotendinous system" is not "adding detail"? Look fellas... the information I have given you is right there... in front of you. At least have the decency to either look it up, look into it and analyze it FWIW. I'm not here to do your research and thinking for you. Neither am I here to spoon feed you. MA is a "thinking AND doing" person's game. It's about body awareness on many levels - not just kinesthetic, and not just your own body.

However, if you want to debunk something and argue about it.... at least do some research and argue it intelligently. Otherwise, any fool can argue just about anything.

Top
#368464 - 11/11/07 06:48 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: MattJ]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
...and there he goes, another "exit, stage left"...

Top
#368465 - 11/11/07 07:05 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: Ed_Morris]
eyrie Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/28/04
Posts: 3106
Loc: QLD, Australia
Well, Ed... it seems to me that you would rather argue about anything and nothing instead of actually having an intelligent discussion about something. Why not discuss "musculotendinous system" and how that might affect the body on a somatic level?

Oh, wait... that means you might have to do some research first... and that'd be too much work, right?

So, why should I bother if you can't?

Top
#368466 - 11/11/07 07:11 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: Ed_Morris]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
You win, Ed... Dim Mak doesn't work. All those points and combinations I know are B-S, which is why I spent so much time learning them. Your overwhelming proof of "I don't believe it" wins the day... I can't remember what your actual proof that it doesn't work is... but what the hell, I don't have the genetic code you must have been born with to automatically detect scams.

What I do know is that when I hit certain places, I get certain results... and when I create certain situations with an opponent using those points they go into excruciating pain... but I'm sure they're just doing it to make me feel better. It can't really hurt, they're just being nice because I showed them a technique and they want to make me think it worked.

I guess that means I can start slapping the hell out of the restricted points in DM and my opponents will be just fine... I have your guarantee. I know that because "you don't believe in it", so that makes it true.

I notice that you don't bother to take any instruction in it to debunk it first hand, but you argue like you're a master of it, and that's not an ad hominem attack, just an observation. I'd be glad to put you in touch with the right people who could leave you as a lump on the floor... but lucky for you, they aren't that kind of people.

Whatever the actual truth of it is, the method and training of DM has survived many years beyond your 40-odd on the earth, and the world is a big place. There's a lot of things I haven't seen, and wouldn't believe if I did... but that doesn't make me right about them. Maybe belief in the system is what makes it teachable, and the meridian system could be a clever method to disguise "other things" about it. You'll never know.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

Top
#368467 - 11/11/07 07:54 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: eyrie]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

Er... which part of look up "musculotendinous system" is not "adding detail"? Look fellas... the information I have given you is right there... in front of you. At least have the decency to either look it up, look into it and analyze it FWIW. I'm not here to do your research and thinking for you. Neither am I here to spoon feed you. MA is a "thinking AND doing" person's game. It's about body awareness on many levels - not just kinesthetic, and not just your own body.

However, if you want to debunk something and argue about it.... at least do some research and argue it intelligently. Otherwise, any fool can argue just about anything.




Decency, eh? Culled from this thread here -


http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/s...p;vc=1&nt=4

MattJ - How about some examples of non 'surface-level' stuff? Videos? Something?


Eyrie - Sorry, no vids... just checked out prices of video camcorders and it'll have to wait a while... still paying off the mats.

Here's what I mean... stand in a relaxed stance, shoulder width apart. Extend your left arm out and have a partner push on it gently, but with consistent pressure. Without moving your feet, or arm or turning the waist or transferring your weight... see if you can bounce them off your arm.

There's a trick to it, but it's not ki magic - it's physics 101. Plain and simple.


MattJ - Sooooooo........how do you do the trick? What you are describing is impossible.


Eyrie - Hard to do, but not impossible. The concept itself is very simple. Think Newton's 3rd law... every action has an equal and OPPOSITE reaction


MattJ - OK, I'll try again. What exactly are you moving to make the oopponent "bounce off" if it's not your arms, legs, waist, etc. Must be something, right? You said "physics 101".

So what is it?

Eyrie - Not moving anything Matt.... it's a simple body trick using Newton's 3 Laws... You're smart... you'll work it out.


Eyrie - Like so many, you want to run before you can crawl... If you can't do this simple body trick under static load, or you don't even understand how it works, how can you hope to apply it dynamically in any given situation? It all starts (and ends) with THE basics. Dynamic application is based on the same principles as static practice. Why wouldn't it?

*Note how the trick has gone from "plain and simple" to "hard to do" to "simple". Which is it?


Eyrie (asking Ed Morris) - Ok, Ed, what do you understand about breathing? Utility for what Function and Purpose? How do you do it? What are you focusing on in breath work? What are you looking to accomplish as a result of breath work?

And don't just say "inhale/exhale". Give us the meat.


MattJ - What are your answers, Eyrie?


Eyrie - What's your answer? Ed's answer? I asked first. Show me why you think what you do is "internal" and based on non-esoteric concepts, since my answers are obviously unsatisfactory.


*Note that Eyrie has not directly answered any of my questions, and insists on me answering a question that he asked Ed, not me.


Eyrie (answering Ed Morris) - In other words, you have no idea - apart from a cursory and surface level understanding of basic breath control.

* Ad hominem attack. Obviously we don't know much about IMA. That's why we ask questions.


Eyrie - Maybe you should do your own research... why should I share anything with you, and your sarcastic, Mr-know-it-all attitude?

Besides, even if I did explain it, what's to stop you from twisting it around and putting words in my mouth, as you always do?

Instead of coming here and thinking you know it all and can explain this from your non-qi perspective, go do some research and maybe you won't have to ask me to explain it.

As for the exercise earlier... can you do it? Can you explain it?


Eyrie - You want an explanation? Fine... breathe thru your skin.


Eyrie (answering Ed, when Ed asks Eyrie to answer his own questions) - Why? So you can tear it down with your twisted sarcastic remarks?

So what if you think I'm hedging or being dishonest or deceptive? I couldn't care less what you think.


MattJ - What do you mean "breathe thru your skin?" I know that humans do pass oxygen through the skin - but not enough to stay alive in lieu of normal respiration. I don't get your point.


Eyrie - It's too detailed to go into, and I'm not going to do this here on an open forum. Suffice to say, humans are capable of skin respiration, not to the same extent that some other species are capable of - and certainly not to the level of absurdity that Ed makes it out to be. However, the point is not about actually breathing thru your skin (the absurd point that Ed is insinuating), but to exercise micro-level control over specific body functions. Such micro control (using the breath - since it is the only autonomic function that is under our conscious control), is not the end in itself, but a means to exercise overall control of our bodies on an internal level.

Such overall control leads to, overall, more efficiency in movement and power generation. Power generation in IMA is different to EMA. But like the hard/soft dichotomy, it is not a purely this or that distinction - there will be varying degrees of internal/external along the continuum. Most arts will have some elements of both internal/external, some more so than others in various ways. I think this needs to be clear. It is not simply a case of "oh, we also do that...so what's the difference?", and certainly not for discussion purposes.

For starters, breath pressure manipulation of internal structures is merely a power augmentation device, but it's not as simple as inhale and exhale on output. It's a lot more complicated than that.

And then there's the rest of it - peppered throughout this and other threads. Look for the gems.

That's all I'm saying on this issue.

I'll just add that if one practices sanchin/tensho and does not fully know or understand what it is they are practising, then chances are, they are merely replicating an internally-bereft fascimile. Same goes for taiji forms or what have you forms - aikido techniques included.

Knowing and understanding what you are practicing helps add the correct intent and focus on your practice, true?

Otherwise, you might as well be better off hitting the weights and getting stronger that way. It's still strength training right?


Eyrie (after Ed again asks Eyrie to answer his own questions) - If you think that is going to bait me into sharing anything with you, you are sorely mistaken. It just makes you look like a pregnant female gorilla's a$$.

So, were you bullied in school, or were you the bully?

*Ad hominem attack


Eyrie - Let me make one thing clear... I can be short, annoyed, but never angry. It takes a lot more to get me really riled. I intentionally left out a lot of information, simply because, and as you well know... without having experienced it and actually FEELING it, it is hard to describe it to someone who has no point of reference with which to comprehend what you mean.

Thanks for the help.
Note how Bossman, Gavin, and Butterflypalm offered up actual answers at times through that thread.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#368468 - 11/11/07 07:59 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: MattJ]
eyrie Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 12/28/04
Posts: 3106
Loc: QLD, Australia
Thanks for dredging this up... And what's this got to do with THIS thread?

Top
#368469 - 11/11/07 08:02 PM Re: This is worth watching. [Re: MattJ]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Why don't YOU tell ME?
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
Page 4 of 16 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 ... 15 16 >


Moderator:  Ames, Cord, MattJ, Reiki 




Action Ads
1.5 Million Plus Page Views
Monthly
Only $89
Details

Fight Videos
Night club fight footage and street fights captured with the world's first bouncer spy cam

How to Matrix!
Learn ten times faster with new training method. Learn entire arts for as little as $10 per disk.

Self Defense
Stun guns, pepper spray, Mace and self defense products. Alarms for personal and home use.

TASER MC26C
Stop An Urban Gorilla: Get 2 FREE TASER M26C Replacement Air Cartridges With Each New TASER M26C!

 

Unbreakable Unbrella

krav maga