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#367276 - 10/27/07 01:36 PM Gentle Fist
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Can someone tell me what is the gentle fist style I know it uses palm strike but I don't see how it can do more damage than a punch can someone tell me?

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#367277 - 10/27/07 06:33 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
MattJ Offline
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Why would you think that a style called "gentle fist" would be able to do more damage than a punch?
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#367278 - 10/27/07 10:45 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
hedkikr Offline
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Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 2827
Loc: Southern California, USA
Never heard of it...sounds like something out of a Chinese Kung-fu movie.

But, if you don't want to injure your knuckles on a hard target, the palm-heel strike is a good choice of weapons. This isn't exclusive of "gentle fist style", it's found in nearly all striking arts...including karate.

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#367279 - 10/27/07 11:52 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: hedkikr]
Kirky Offline
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Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Yes but i don't see how palm strike are effective I need someone to explain the relationship between palm strikes and pressure points cause self proclaim master of karate told me A palm strike could be deadly on pp points if hit at the right once with the right force

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#367280 - 10/28/07 12:08 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
Bushi_no_ki Offline
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Registered: 05/03/05
Posts: 1667
Loc: POM, Monterey CA
Kirky, the "deadly" comment is off the wall, but the palm heel strike is powerful because you are using a part of the hand that will align with your arm automatically. You don't have to worry about your wrist flexing. The obvious downside is that you are more limited in the targets you should strike. As hedkikr said, you aren't going to break knuckles on a hard surface, but you are less likely to penetrate a specific target.

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#367281 - 10/28/07 12:12 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Bushi_no_ki]
Kirky Offline
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Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
You have a point there and i knew that guy was talking bs about the deadly crap I'm gonna see him next morning

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#367282 - 10/30/07 11:56 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
hedkikr Offline
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Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 2827
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I never said that a palm-heel strike isn't deadly. It can be - just like any other type of strike using proper target & impact. It's just not exclusively a deadly technique.

And you can't push the nose bone into the brain w/ palm-heel to instantly kill someone. If the nose bone is shoved into the brain, chances are high the the entire face is crushed as well. People have survived this injury as well as died from it (in auto accidents).

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#367283 - 10/30/07 10:00 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: hedkikr]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
damn I've heard of that before but I saw this guy he had a unique palm style of his own he call it his gentle fist he for a rookie just in martial arts he took out that pro after the match he said its his own style and he told me its not about hurt the opponent on the outside but hurting him internal what does that mean? I saw him palm striked that veteran in the arms a couple time and it was like the guy's arm got heavy on him then i saw him him like he was doing this weird thing he stared at the pro for a while like he was marking out his pp points he was gonna strike and I saw him fired three palm strikes to his chest then the guy dropped just like that I was like I wonder if I could ever beat a guy like that

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#367284 - 10/30/07 10:07 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Quote:

damn I've heard of that before but I saw this guy he had a unique palm style of his own he call it his gentle fist he for a rookie just in martial arts he took out that pro after the match he said its his own style and he told me its not about hurt the opponent on the outside but hurting him internal what does that mean? I saw him palm striked that veteran in the arms a couple time and it was like the guy's arm got heavy on him then i saw him him like he was doing this weird thing he stared at the pro for a while like he was marking out his pp points he was gonna strike and I saw him fired three palm strikes to his chest then the guy dropped just like that I was like I wonder if I could ever beat a guy like that




Well, you see, Neji Hyuuga is a pretty tough customer. His special eye-seeing-power thing allows him to accurately perceive the points on your body, from which you can emit chakra. He channel his own chakra through his strikes, and uses it to close said portals. As such, it becomes more difficult to use your limbs.

Will you ever be able to beat him? No; he's an anime character. You will find it impossible to interact with him in any way, much less fight him.
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#367285 - 10/30/07 10:43 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean





Well, you see, Neji Hyuuga is a pretty tough customer. His special eye-seeing-power thing allows him to accurately perceive the points on your body, from which you can emit chakra. He channel his own chakra through his strikes, and uses it to close said portals. As such, it becomes more difficult to use your limbs.



The guy I know is Morris Dylan Chin and who is Neji Hyuuga? and Chin does not have all eye seeing power which i don't think anybody does besides God and i don't think Morris uses so called powers all he did was picked out pp points(and Morris is very smart when it comes to pp points and has vast knowledge of that) and struck them knocking him out it was on different parts of his chest not these portals you speak of.



Will you ever be able to beat him? No; he's an anime character. You will find it impossible to interact with him in any way, much less fight him.



Will I ever beat Morris i don't know I don't think i'm in his league yet and seriously you need to lay off that japanese anime cause this thing but Neji who just creeped me out.
Why would i write about fictional martial arts on a non fictional martial arts forum. But I do think he just made up a simple name for his style

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#367286 - 10/30/07 10:54 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
I dunno. It just bears a LOT of resemblance toward a Naruto character. Plus, having read some of your stuff in the boxing section, which seemed to be based entirely off of Hajime No Ippo... Well, I couldn't help but to assume...

Plus, I find it hard to believe that someone uses palms to strike pressure points. Using your finger knuckles is much more effective, since it gives you better penetration. But, hey, that's just my opinion. I'm no master of pp fighting.

Anywho, I'm just a very skeptical person when it comes to martial arts. I'll look up this Morris Dylan Chin fella. Is he Chinese American? His last name is very Chinese, but not so much his other names... Got I hope he's not an Ashida Kim type, who has a fake surname...
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The early bird gets the worm, yet it is the second mouse who gets the cheese.

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#367287 - 10/30/07 11:05 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
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Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Quote:

Plus, I find it hard to believe that someone uses palms to strike pressure points. Using your finger knuckles is much more effective, since it gives you better penetration. But, hey, that's just my opinion. I'm no master of pp fighting.





I believe it. Some pressure points can be "activated" from a strike to a large area, it doesn't have to be a pinpoint.
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#367288 - 10/30/07 11:21 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: BrianS]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Hmm, before I say something stupid, I'd like to again point out that I'm admittedly ignorant about all but the most obvious pressure points...

But which pressure points can be effectively damaged by a palm strike? And, in which case would a palm strike be more efficient than finger knuckles (for pressure points)?
_________________________
The early bird gets the worm, yet it is the second mouse who gets the cheese.

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#367289 - 10/31/07 04:34 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Quote:

Plus, having read some of your stuff in the boxing section, which seemed to be based entirely off of Hajime No Ippo... Well, I couldn't help but to assume...




Like I said before it was my cousin all the time this isn't the first forum he has covered in BS and this is the second time he's done it in one of my profiles on forums.








Anywho, I'm just a very skeptical person when it comes to martial arts. I'll look up this Morris Dylan Chin fella. Is he Chinese American? His last name is very Chinese, but not so much his other names... Got I hope he's not an Ashida Kim type, who has a fake surname...




Your almost like my cousin only difference you don't intentionally write BS off animes and you actually ask proper question and like i said Morris Chin is in my country he's my classmate so i don't think research him will help you find him since he's not famous in the world we're minor martial art learners so he can't be looked up but during the match the veteran was clearly holding back Morris knew and he was upset he wanted the pro to give him his all but i told him to be careful of what he wished for.

Now back to the question what does he mean by he attacks internally? cause he won't tell me

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#367290 - 10/31/07 04:49 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
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Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

Like I said before it was my cousin all the time this isn't the first forum he has covered in BS and this is the second time he's done it in one of my profiles on forums.




Simple solution - change your password.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#367291 - 10/31/07 04:56 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: MattJ]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
I already did and he's on a long ban from the computer

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#367292 - 10/31/07 06:24 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
[quote=kirky/quote]
Your almost like my cousin only difference you don't intentionally write BS off animes and you actually ask proper question and like i said Morris Chin is in my country he's my classmate so i don't think research him will help you find him since he's not famous in the world we're minor martial art learners so he can't be looked up but during the match the veteran was clearly holding back Morris knew and he was upset he wanted the pro to give him his all but i told him to be careful of what he wished for.

Now back to the question what does he mean by he attacks internally? cause he won't tell me




First off, I'd like to reject the comparison that you've made between me and your cousin. I'm nothing like either of you, as should be quite evident in our writing.

That, and I can easily discern BS. I'll admit that 8 years isn't a particularly long time in studying martial arts, but still, I'm yet to come across anything that resembles what you've described. 'Internal' attacks could just be over-glorified affects of a strike. For instance, I punch you in the solar plexus, you lose wind and feel like your insides hurt (OH NOEZ TEH INTERNAL STRYK). I could very well damage you internally, but...then again, you could get internal damage from falling off of your bike. Either way, its hardly as mystical as the right phrasing can make it seem.

Anyway, this 'pro' fighter... What does he compete in?
_________________________
The early bird gets the worm, yet it is the second mouse who gets the cheese.

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#367293 - 10/31/07 08:22 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Hey Sanda you just reminded me of something now ! remember internal attacks I think it has something to do with internal arts or something and it isn't anything mystical and what do you mean by what he competes in his outfit or something?

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#367294 - 10/31/07 09:30 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Well, you said that the guy Morris beat/trained with was a pro -- as in professional. So I was wondering if he was a professional what? a pro boxer, kickboxer, mma fighter, etc.

Glad I could help you remember... What did you remember?
_________________________
The early bird gets the worm, yet it is the second mouse who gets the cheese.

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#367295 - 11/01/07 12:15 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6768
"gentle fist" ? I think it has something to do with smiling with your eyes closed for 10 minutes.

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#367296 - 11/01/07 08:09 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Ed_Morris]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
The professional was holding back everyone knew he just did it to make Morris feel good you wouldn't expect some pro to come and beat up a guys who's like 10 years younger than him it would be an unfair fight. He didn't reveal his fighting style he was doing some good acting though acting like he was in pain but the strike at the arms and chest really hurt. For a while i thought he was using Jeet Kune Do he was intercept neutralize Morris's palm strikes with his own but when i saw him use tat Judo hip throw I think it may be possibly he's skilled in a variety of martial arts he has a blackbelt but won't tell what he's a black belt in which martial art.
Well I can't wait for the rematch I told he's Morris is gonna get creamed Morris challenged the guy again but the guy must go all out on him. He made a bet to make things worse If Morris wins the veteran declares his style the best style but If Morris lose he becomes the guy's student . I warned Morris that we don't even know his style and he's a veteran he has years of experience that our fighting skills can't compare to I'll tell you how it goes when I come in later I'll be acting as Morris's second but I think I'm just wasting my time cause I don't it'll a minute he told Morris that his style his so called Gentle Fist couldn't help him in a situation where there are two or more opponents because they just won't stand and watch him call out the pp points he's gonna strike

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#367297 - 11/01/07 10:59 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
underdog Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1270
Loc: Mansfield, MA U.S.A.
For a "gentle" fist, I like the "Blood Pool" hand. It seems to be very effective at sending penetrating energy into body PP targets. I'm not completely sure what you mean by "gentle" fist so I am guessing. A strike with Blood pool hand might look gentle, but it is not.

In my humble opinion, sometimes palm is the right strike for a pressure point and sometimes not. If you need to penetrate into the seems between muscles, it will do nothing. If you are hitting a cluster of points on the surface, particularly if there is bone behind the cluster, than a palm is perfect.
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#367298 - 11/01/07 11:32 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
hedkikr Offline
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Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 2827
Loc: Southern California, USA
OK, but what do you have against punctuation marks? Those were some long-azz sentances.


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#367299 - 11/01/07 01:45 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: hedkikr]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Kirky, you tell very interesting (though rather cliche and overworked) stories. As hedkikr insinuated, such tales would probably benefit from some periods. =P

Underdog, what is the 'blood pool' hand? Could you describe it to me? Also, what you said makes a lot of sense. For instance, the nerve cluster between your upper lip and nose, would that be an example of a pp best struck with an open palm? Any others you would recommend?
_________________________
The early bird gets the worm, yet it is the second mouse who gets the cheese.

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#367300 - 11/01/07 02:09 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
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Registered: 11/25/04
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_________________________
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#367301 - 11/01/07 04:40 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: MattJ]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Well there it is. Morris is a student now four rounds and in the first but he did manage to beat my one minute last bet by 1 minute 10 secs.
I felt kinda sorry for him but he was arrogant and had to learn the hard way. We've been in arguments in lot of time when he said my boxing and karate interest was a load or garbage. I told him first of all don't you ever call the sweet science of boxing garbage. I told him if he ever got into the ring with guys like Floyd Mayweather Jr. It would have ended faster than the match he lost I told him he could never be in the same with him with that attitude. Then he said to me ok how about a sparring Saturday you and your external fighting against my internal destructions or some crap. I agreed then I told him but he may regret asking for it.

Is it true theres a way that you can palm strike a guy and cause him to go into cardiac arrest?

edit for grammar and punctuation




Edited by BrianS (11/01/07 04:44 PM)

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#367302 - 11/01/07 04:45 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Kirky,

This is the karate forum. Please see the MA Tales and Stories forum for futher postings of this nature.

Thanks, Brian
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The2nd ammendment, it makes all the others possible. <///<




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#367303 - 11/01/07 05:59 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: BrianS]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
There was a MMA tales forum all along I just noticed its just that I've never paid attention to it I've gotta see what its about

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#367304 - 11/01/07 07:12 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
butterfly Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 3012
Loc: Torrance, CA
Kirky, you also have to know when someone is being facetious.

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#367305 - 11/02/07 05:11 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: butterfly]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean



Kirky, you also have to know when someone is being facetious



I've never been use to that I take things too serious so I can't really tell when someones facetious but thanks for the advice.
Well Matt's post with the pp forum already answered most of my questions and see Morris lose is the same And Sanda helped too cause Morris admitted he stole the name off Naruto. So thanks guys. Brian thanks about making me realize theres a mma tales forum this is one one of the best sites I've been too. Since all the questions are answered I won't be typing on this again unless a need arises. And thank you butterfly for making me know a new word in my vocabulary facetious this will help in school.


Edited by Kirky (11/02/07 05:13 PM)

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#367306 - 11/02/07 06:26 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
Kirky,

Not "mma tales forum", but an MA (Martial Arts) Tales and Stories Forum. Reserved for martial art related tales and stories such as the ones you have told in this thread.

Thanks.
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#367307 - 11/02/07 08:13 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: BrianS]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Ok I think i can continue the story here its perfect thanks man

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#367308 - 11/03/07 02:29 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
The conclusion of the story today with results of Kirk vs. Morris

It was a nice day after shower I got down to the gym to meet Morris. As i entered he was already in the ring warming up with his palm strike I got on my trunks warming up with some low intensity pad training. I put on by boxing gloves and stated doing minor shoulder shrugs bouncing on my feet a little then I got into the ring and sat at our corners the coach spoke to me saying, "That kid is all fancy talk and tender touches your a slugger a bruiser stick to the strategy start out with outboxing I'll tell you when to use your real style." I answered clearly and firmly "Yes sir," I said pounding my fist together.Morris's friend was instructing him too.
Then the a guy from the gym came in to ref the match, "Ok fighters to the center of the ring." he said loudly. We stood in the center I gave him my usual emotionless glare then the ref spoke again, "Ok we are gonna have a ma fight Kirk will be using his boxing style and Morris his self-proclaimed gentle fist style, Now I want a clean fight no biting no low blows and you guys know the rest." he stepped back a little. Morris had on a black marina and his a long shorts he wears when training and fighting and a white tie around his head. We were in the corner warming up then the bell went.
Round 1 had begun it was a total of four rounds. I started bouncing on my feet like that Apollo Creed guy in Rocky dancing around him. I intentionally placed myself into the corner waiting for his stupid dash. He rushed at me with his usual unorganized dash, "Predictable!" I said as I footwork out of there and let him crashed into the corner and I started pounding him with one-twos and body punches. Then he dropped lying down on the ground and the ref told me to get back to my neutral corner. I lied back in my corner watching him by the count of 8 he got up. The ref shouted, "Fight!" then I started dancing around again he keeps attempting palm strike but I dance pass then and knock him with a one-two again then he started attacking with more palm strikes although I was blocking my arms were starting to feel funny then I remember he knew pp points so even though I was blocking was still get hurt. As he palm strike at me I did something i always wanted to do. I cross countered his palm strike and he stumbled a little then I knocked him down right hook. Walked back to my corner leaning back watching relaxing my arms easing the tension. He got back up but just as I was about to attack the bell rung the end Round 1. The coach got the chair and started to massage my arms and shoulders. "Look like no matter how you block it still hurts." he wet my head and wiped it off "Time to show him the sweet science of boxing kid, its time to go into slugger mode pressure him bob and weaving the palm strikes to the head but if its the body use your footwork or catch it if he rushes you you rush him back." I got up, "Yes sir." I felt hungry to beat the crap out of Morris now that the coach said to switch to infighting we walked to the center of the ring then the ref shouted, "Fight!"
Morris was surprise to see me just walking to him and not using my feet as I got into middle range i got into an orthodox position Morris was too in shock and too puzzled to do anything he was wondering why I stopped moving. He had his guard up but then I gave him a straight that open the guard then I gave him a right punch to his body that literally lift him off the canvas then I started giving him a series of left and right hooks that sent him flying into the corner. I widen my legs a little then I started knocking him with hook using my legs as pivots. He looked unconscious but he woke up just in time the cover up but when he cover up I used a right shovel hook then opened it up then I gave him the combination I use in most spars A left uppercut to the tip of his chin and and right hook under his ear. Ad he was down it looked like he couldn't go on. I leaned back Morris's friends was shouting out his name and I shook my head cause I knew if he had abandoned that dumb style he would have stand a chance. But he got back up and i smile cause I noticed during the match his attitude was slowly changing. As he got up the bell rung. And he was carried back to his corner by his friend he was squirted with alot of water meanwhile the coach was telling me, "Good good keep up the pressure and continue to clobber him he should be a little dizzy from get hit at the tip of the chin and under the ear so take advantage and finish it." we got there and the ref said, "Fight!"
Round 3. As I rushed in I was surprised at Morris he clinched me he never did this to anyone I felt proud at last he was realizing that is greater depends on the person who use it and why they practice it. Then when the ref parted us he threw a punch I barely managed to duck under then I knocked him in the body and he dropped the ref said its over and i won but I was proud of Morris he actually threw a punch and not a palm strike.
After taking our showers and putting on our clothes i walked home with him. Both of us weren't talking for a long time while we were walking but then Morris said, "Kirk I'm sorry you guys are right I am arrogant and foolish to think my style was better than all was stupid and I'm glad that that veteran will be teaching me some boxing I deserved to lose you were a better fighter and person." I turned to him and smiled "Morris you will become a good fighter while we were fighting I noticed maybe if you were using the right techniques and actually punching it could have been a different story you never give up and thats the start of a good fighter's attitude." it was a great day Morris finally started to become a good fighter

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#367309 - 11/03/07 03:39 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Wow.... Wow... Wow... I'm at a loss for words at the moment. I think that my senses have been put in shock by the overwhelming stench of putrid bull-honky.

Some reasons why this story is clearly a lie

1) Your boxing gym is actually letting you guys use a ring for a 'martial arts match.'

2) Morris is either not wearing gloves, which a boxing gym would never permit, or he is trying to strike palm strike you with boxing gloves. Neither works.

3) If you're blocking, he can only strike your outer forearms. If there are pressure points there, its not the type that can be damaged by open palm-strikes.

And finally, the narrative was just too artificial.

I've come to suspect that you're either a REALLY good troll, who is patient enough to abstain from overly-rediculous lies and settles for small victories at a time... Or, you live in a fantasy world. But if my first supposition is correct, you're a troll who is very good at capturing the essence of the 'fantasy warrior.'

But, honestly, you have a certain charm to your troll-esque behavior. It keeps me entertained and engaged. Your continued 'ahem' contributions are welcomed by me. =D
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#367310 - 11/03/07 07:10 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
Kirky Offline
Member

Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Its not a boxing gym just a gym down here boxing gyms ain't all that so we kinda have a special gym with section where we practice our art since there little amount of martial artist down here since our country doesn't really look at ma seriously we don't have dojos and those stuff just huge special gyms And the reason I write like that is because I'm kinda a English Language nerd I can't write or type a story whether its real or not without proper punctuation and grammar and story like parts It who I am I just love it i just have to but that comma in the right place the periods the paragraphs indentation the quotation marks.
Lol I hope i didn't sound like a geek. We have this rule in the gym too since it was Morris who challenged me since I'm from the boxing section he must fight in my environment which is a regular boxing ring and Morris was from the karate. The challenger must fight in his opponent's environment thats why I use my head and don't challenge anyone i make them challenge me.
Thanks for the compliment Sanda I think

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#367311 - 11/03/07 08:27 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
TheSandaPanda Offline
Member

Registered: 10/23/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Boston, Massachusetts
Lol. Your proper punctuation overwhelms me.

And np. My friend, who's not on this forum, thinks you're awesome.
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#367312 - 11/03/07 10:14 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
Kirky Offline
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Registered: 10/04/07
Posts: 99
Loc: The Caribbean
Thats why I told him if he wasn't over reliant on the palm strike the fight may have been different but I'm still proud of the guy

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#367313 - 11/30/07 07:30 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
Suthek Offline
Stranger

Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 1
Well, troll or not troll, the palm strike thing is actually NOT a tale...a palm strike martial art does exist and from this martial art is Nejis Juken-Style...
It's called 8 Trigramm-Boxing or Bagua Zhang...and a technique like this what the guy does with finishing with a tripple palm to the heart is also a technique from this fighting style...the naruto-creator copied the style for his charakter

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#367314 - 12/12/07 07:29 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
fileboy2002 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 999
Loc: Chicago, IL
That is a euphamism for masterbation. Duh!

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#367315 - 12/13/07 12:25 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: BrianS]
WC_Lun Offline
Member

Registered: 12/08/07
Posts: 30
Loc: Kansas City MO
Back to the palm strike and its' effectiveness...one reason it is effective is if struck with the right part of the palm it is just as hard as a fist, with the same amount of penetrating power. I do mean a palm strike and not a slap. Big difference. Also, after a palm strike is administered it can turn instantly into a grab, which if applied correctly, certainly can hit multiple pressure points. Speaking from experience that hurts a LOT. An example would be the jaw line.

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#367316 - 12/14/07 11:41 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: WC_Lun]
ericjones80 Offline
Newbie

Registered: 12/10/07
Posts: 10
the palm strike into the grab is a good technique...maybe the only thing it has over a punch
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#367317 - 12/19/07 03:16 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: ericjones80]
Ironfoot Offline
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Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 2682
Loc: St. Clair Shores, MI USA
I didn't think of shoteis (palm strikes) when I heard of gentle fists (and not being as pervered as Ed I didn't think of what he did). I envisioned what kuta calls the "Egyptian fist" - a very loose fist with a protruding thumb. I've also seen one of Victor's main influences, the late Sherman Harrill, use a gentle fist. Contact with the opponent is what ends up closing the fist.
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#367318 - 12/28/07 11:50 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
senseijack Offline
Newbie

Registered: 08/10/06
Posts: 7
that style uses tai chi like softness instead of what a hard style would be relying on physical strerngth and such... is it effective? No opinion on that

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#367319 - 12/28/07 02:14 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: ericjones80]
JMWcorwin Offline
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Registered: 07/13/07
Posts: 731
Loc: SoCal, USA
A properly done palm strike has plenty of advantage over a punch regardless of the grab after technique. The palm strike lines up naturally all the bones from your wrist to your shoulder creating a very unforgiving striking tool. You have to feel this part, but they also tend to have a more penetrating quality. It seems to go past the surface and into the organs. It's a strange feeling. I've had palm strikes done on me at below 50% power that hurt far more and far longer than puches I've taken to the same location at full power. Again, this is talking about a correctly done palm strike and not a slap or push. ( as someone already stated )
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#367320 - 12/29/07 09:22 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Ironfoot]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
My version of this technique was done with the same motion as "breaking a stick", where the fist closes as your arm reaches the target... no potruding thumb (but I have seen Nishiyama Sensei punch that way). It's as if you're reaching out to break off a branch of a tree as you're walking. The snapping of the wrist is what makes the technique's shocking power, and it's extremely quick.

If you take your open hands and simply roll your wrists so your hands rotate around each other you can see the possibility of a series of these punches (which is quite effective and damaging) if the focus of the punches are in the upward or forward direction at the first two knuckles.

Using a "whip-like" motion with your arms from your side (natural way you walk with your hands by your side), it makes one hell of an uppercut too. It's all in the wrist motion... along with keeping the hand "soft" until contact.

FWIW

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#367321 - 12/31/07 01:10 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: wristtwister]
Ironfoot Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 2682
Loc: St. Clair Shores, MI USA
I like your analogy of breaking off a stick, wristtwister. Hanging around Isshinryu guys like you do, you know the mechanics of the vertical punch well, and like you, I also keep the fist loose and the arm tension-free until just before contact (last inch, preferrably). I'm not a big fan of kuta's Egyptian fist - the one with the protruding themb -as you hit with too much surface area of the hand, not just the 2 knuckles. I prefer its "lashing" shotei.
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#367322 - 12/31/07 03:03 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Ironfoot]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
I always thought a protruding thumb was a "miscalculation risk"... a slight miss, and your thumb becomes "the stick"...

In my "old" Isshin Ryu training, the forearm and fist were turned into a "solid object", and the power was generated from the elbow and shoulder. Everything below the elbow was tightened, and everything above the elbow was loose... it was a "learned skill" to do that. Now, they just "make a fist and punch"... so the "development" of karate has lost some significant details that generated a lot of power.

In the late 1980's, I had a conversation with Nishiyama Sensei, who expressed concern that no one was spending any time learning to generate power in their karate. It was all getting so tournament oriented, that it was just more of a "hit and hope" situation rather than "power delivery".

I always had fast hands, so I liked the speed techniques, but when I learned the other methods, I worked on getting them operational "instantly", so I had the best of both worlds. The combination of speed and power trumps either one by itself.

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#367323 - 01/02/08 03:07 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: wristtwister]
Ironfoot Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 2682
Loc: St. Clair Shores, MI USA
Make a really loose fist (hate to sound sexist, but the one you see most women make), then put the thumb on top so that it sticks out just slightly more than the index finger's second knuckle. One past sensei described this as the "doorbell technique" that you can use to jab the thumb into soft areas.

But I hear you, Grady, about the lack of punching technique. People don't get that wet-towel-snap idea. Instead they're too tensed up to be fast. It's easy to be hard, but apparently hard to be easy.
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#367324 - 01/03/08 02:40 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TheSandaPanda]
jude33 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/14/07
Posts: 1539
Quote:

3) If you're blocking, he can only strike your outer forearms. If there are pressure points there, its not the type that can be damaged by open palm-strikes.






?
My student thoughts.

Might be debate-able.

If the side part ( the outside of the hand sort of semi shuto) is used while using palm heel strikes it can numb the forearm.

See this is the reason I have problems with pressure points.
If the thigh is struck hard anywhere the damage to the muscle causes the numbing effect.

Ditto forearm.

Jude

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#367325 - 01/10/08 12:25 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: jude33]
Ethann Offline
Stranger

Registered: 01/10/08
Posts: 4
Loc: Montréal
I don't know if anyone answered the first question of this thread, but I've found something that (imo) seems to fit the description. First of, I'm assuming that the person was searching for the style the caracter "Neji" juses in naruto. Since i found that a martial art that focuses on pressure points would be interesting, i started looking for it. As i thought it is not named "gentle fist" even tho, there is a tai chi form called YinChuanDao (the way of the gentle fists) that teaches the philosophy Neji and Hinata uses.

The real art tho is called Bagazhang, it is comonly called "Eight trigram palm". The "gao" style enphasis on palm strikes and it's "post heaven" section has a teaching of "64 linear palm" which is highly familiar to theses naruto caracters. The "fu" style as the caracteristic of using many spinning movements and point strikes that can dammage internal organs. Also it uses the same stance as they do in the anime therefore confirming that Bagazhang is what inspired them into creating the "gentle fist" style in naruto. Hope this helps, heres the link for the infos i foud.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baguazhang

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#367326 - 02/11/08 02:30 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
bocaj Offline
Stranger

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 1
Actually the funny thing is... for all my life whenever I got into a fight, I NEVER used my fists but my palms as a gentler punch thus making my palm strikes stronger than my fist strikes. So I guess that makes me a Gentle Fist user. Great now I'm a stuck up [censored] from the Hyuuga Clan. But I've been doing this since 1992 in my first fight at the age of 5. NOW all I need is the Byakugan

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#367327 - 05/09/08 02:39 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: bocaj]
whyt Offline
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/08
Posts: 1
funny thing about all this is an actual style does exist which implements this form of attacking and it uses the same techniques as what you only learn once you have undergone a lot of hard training in karate
i cant remember the name off the top of my head but i think its called the relaxed punch and it uses the same principles where instead of doing external impact damage it moreso jolts the body causing possible broken bones and damaging internal organs
the idea of the gentle fist is to either strike with a relaxed palm only tensing it and activating every muscle in your arm at the time of impact to send a jolt into your enemys body
or to use a straight forward open handed strike with the fingers to hit pressure points and nerves to cut off circulation or just trigger extreme pain by turning a nerve cluster on
the whole idea has been to overfantasized by the creators of naruto making it nearly impossible to even mention using these techniques without being laughed at but if you try it you will be shocked by the results
if you want to learn the correct way study a book called "bubishi the bible of karate" and learn the locations of the correct pressure points to strike but i will warn ny1 reading this it can be dangerous if your not careful and it isnt easy to learn
well just thought id add that so have fun playin round with that new info and i hope you have fun and learn some interesting ways to improve your strikes cya!

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#367328 - 05/19/08 02:13 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: whyt]
maitogai1989 Offline
Stranger

Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 1
Hi, I have been reading all of this, and love the unique info given. First off, I am an avid Naruto fan. In my defense, I will tell all of you that I know most of it is purely fiction. However, I have studying Neji Hyuuga's techique. I too have found it to be an incredibly effective style. And to the guy who told that vivid story of beating the who uses the gentle fist, from the sounds of it, the guy you fought was nothing more than a second-rate impersonater. He did not perform the style correctly. You may have been blocking with your arms up, but with what I have learned, there were plenty of opportunities he could have taken such as attacking the bladder, liver, or maby even the kidneys. He could have been real fancy and taken out your knees. This technique relies on strategy. You must observe yor opponent and take advantage of his weak spots. No matter how much you train your body, your interal organs will always be weak spot. Again with second-rate impersonater, this technique utilizes a combination of two-finger jabs (for specific points), four-finger jabs (for larger areas), AND the palm thrusts (for the shear penetrating power). Granted the whole chakra thing is exagerated, but it is still effective. I found that with the combination of the hand forms stated earlier and with some good foot work to confuse your opponent, this style rather hard to beat. These assumption are based on actual testing and not just theory. The human body really has a disturbingly large amount of faults. In the hands of a studied practicer, it could very well be detrimental to the opponent. In any case you did not fight a true user, and to whoever this was I wil scorn for making a mockery of this formidible style. One last thing and it's a bit subject, but does anyone know of any fighting competions near northern Indiana. I would like to test myself in more formal way.

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#367329 - 06/19/08 09:41 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
umd23 Offline
Stranger

Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 1
i train in it so ill tell you gental fist requires a thing called iner strengh we use movments with small bods to gain speed and techtstarity we attack the inside of the bodsy that cant be trained and use the defense agianst them if they block we use that to attack the arms imobolizing eny attacks wich means check mate

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#367330 - 06/20/08 07:03 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: umd23]
dandjurdjevic Offline
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Registered: 05/10/08
Posts: 844
Loc: Australia
I haven't read all of the thread, but has anyone mentioned the Kyushu related karate episode of the Human Weapon, featuring the palm heels strike to the heart nerve from saifa?
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#367331 - 06/20/08 07:08 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: dandjurdjevic]
harlan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/31/04
Posts: 6664
Loc: Amherst, MA
Are you talking about the end of the karate episode, where Mario H. intruduces 'kyusho' to the two hosts?

I did bring it up in a different thread...as I was curious how long Mr. H. had been teaching that, and how long he had been using the term 'kyusho'.

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#367332 - 06/20/08 07:51 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: harlan]
dandjurdjevic Offline
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Registered: 05/10/08
Posts: 844
Loc: Australia
Sorry - typo.

Yes kyusho.
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#367333 - 06/20/08 09:35 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: umd23]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

i train in it so ill tell you gental fist requires a thing called iner strengh we use movments with small bods to gain speed and techtstarity we attack the inside of the bodsy that cant be trained and use the defense agianst them if they block we use that to attack the arms imobolizing eny attacks wich means check mate



Holy cr4p - my eyes just exploded.
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#367334 - 07/06/08 12:26 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
Pox Offline
Stranger

Registered: 07/06/08
Posts: 1
he means rather damaging him as outside skin parts that you can see he means damaging inside as the organs, the 3 hits he did to the chest could have damaged his ribs or stopped him breathing for a moment so the guy fell. i heard of it as well but im going to try and find someone who can tell me more about it

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#367335 - 07/06/08 08:00 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Pox]
Zach_Zinn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 1031
Loc: Olympia, WA
Quote:

he means rather damaging him as outside skin parts that you can see he means damaging inside as the organs, the 3 hits he did to the chest could have damaged his ribs or stopped him breathing for a moment so the guy fell. i heard of it as well but im going to try and find someone who can tell me more about it




What exactly are "outside skin parts"? geez go take an anamtomy class or something, this crap is ridiculous, there's only so many ways to hit someone and none of them are some myterious vibrating of organs or anything like that.

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#367336 - 07/06/08 09:19 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Zach_Zinn]
dandjurdjevic Offline
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Registered: 05/10/08
Posts: 844
Loc: Australia
Then there is the art of kinet. It's where I press the kiboard and transmit ki through the net to you and it explodes your eyes.

I did it to Matt just then. Matt needs a braille keyboard now. So watch out.

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#367337 - 07/07/08 09:26 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: dandjurdjevic]
TKD_X Offline
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Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 786
Loc: HERE
Quote:

Then there is the art of kinet. It's where I press the kiboard and transmit ki through the net to you and it explodes your eyes.

I did it to Matt just then. Matt needs a braille keyboard now. So watch out.






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#367338 - 12/29/08 02:47 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TKD_X]
TiredOfHollywood Offline
Stranger

Registered: 12/29/08
Posts: 2
Have you ever heard of a fighter named Mirko Filipovic? He follows the same logic of thinking when it comes to his kicks. Instead of spreading the damage out over the entire width of his foot, he concentrates it on the tip of his big toe. All the damage is concentrated into a "spike" if you will, bruising internal organs. The same principle is applied to the Gentle Fist Technique. Shrink the area of contact and you increase the damage internally. And just so you will all shut up a palm strike does have less impact zone than a fist strike, thus causeing more damage internally.

Fist strike, palm strike, knuckle strike, fingertip strike. In that decending order is the impact zone of hand strikes.

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#367339 - 12/29/08 03:08 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TiredOfHollywood]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

Have you ever heard of a fighter named Mirko Filipovic? He follows the same logic of thinking when it comes to his kicks. Instead of spreading the damage out over the entire width of his foot, he concentrates it on the tip of his big toe. All the damage is concentrated into a "spike" if you will, bruising internal organs.




I.......where are you getting this info from? This is not accurate at all. Crocop is well known to use his shin, not his big toe, for his kicks.
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#367340 - 12/29/08 03:15 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: MattJ]
TiredOfHollywood Offline
Stranger

Registered: 12/29/08
Posts: 2
Look at his fight against Ibragim Magomedov. He kicked him in the side using his toe. He damaged his liver with that kick. He has done it against many opponents.

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#367341 - 12/30/08 11:22 AM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: TiredOfHollywood]
Ilove2Hit Offline
Member

Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 264
Loc: Athens, Greece
true. just watched it. big toe!
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#367342 - 01/02/09 04:07 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Ilove2Hit]
JMWcorwin Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/13/07
Posts: 731
Loc: SoCal, USA
There's another one on youtube called Mirko cro cop VS Poor Japanese I just watched. He does a great job of throwing a high kick and then bringing it back fast enough to stuff the takedown attempt. A couple times the guy shoots while Cro Cop is still kicking but he still manages to sprawl. Nice.
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#367343 - 05/12/09 06:17 PM Re: Gentle Fist [Re: Kirky]
artemis Offline
Stranger

Registered: 05/12/09
Posts: 1
Good shot on the Neji thing. That's obviously what he's thinking of

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