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#356782 - 09/03/07 08:22 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Ed_Morris]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
I don't charge for shiatsu treatments Ed yet anyway...but I still need to eat anyhows)! And my operating system is being upgrading every single day Ed. What have you studied today Ed? This morning I've done an hour of Taiji and Qi Gong. I've been studying the muscles of the body (including origins and insertions) for my up and coming western anatomy and physiology exam, tonight I'll being doing an hour of MMA training with a local fighter and then taking my own self defence class (admittedly I charge for that...I do have to eat!). What have you done today to justify you're continual arguing from either a western or eastern point of view? What have you done to upgrade your operating system>

Funny how when we get to discussing what good your doing for the world you get all defensive Ed. Again if I'm helping someone with Shiatsu, a faith healer is helping someone or a doctor who is on a 6 figure salary is helping someone what difference does their method of life observation make? WHAT GOOD IS YOUR SKEPTICISM DOING??????

EDIT - I reread your post, I take it all those things you spoke about are things that you're doing. Sound rather bitter about helping others Eddy baby? An angry little man who should rejoice in the good his doing rather than projecting bitterness onto others.

Forgot another thing I have because of Chi...a happy life!


Edited by Gavin (09/03/07 08:27 AM)
_________________________
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www.SHIKON.COM
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#356783 - 09/03/07 08:25 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Ed_Morris]
jude33 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/14/07
Posts: 1539
Quote:

ah...now you google-fu'ers rely on wikipedia.

Quote:

The experiment still shows energy in motion. The gas ionization photographed around the body needed a living body with electro and mechanical energy in the body as well as the other elements required for the experiment. The fact it wouldnt work in a vacuum only proved it wasnt paranormal.It doesnt disprove the human body is a walking bundle of electro and mechanical energy.



Quote:


wrong. keep reading, google-meister. it doesn't need a living body.




Writings of hines
Living things ...are moist. When the electricity enters the living object , it produces an area of gas ionization around the photographed object, assuming moisture is present on the object. This moisture is transferred from the subject to the emulsion surface of the photographic film and causes an alternation of the electric charge pattern on the film. If a photograph is taken in a vacuum, where no ionized gas is present, no Kirlian image appears. If the Kirlian image were due to some paranormal fundamental living energy field, it should not disappear in a simple vacuum (Hines 2003).

End of the writing from hines



Are those the words of the guy who disputed the paranormal claim?

Change the experiment to a vaccuum and there will be no ionization of gas because there will be no gas to ionize.
It still doesnt repute the human body has electro mechanical energy as written by wristtwister.


I will come back to the other question

Jude

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#356784 - 09/03/07 08:30 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Ed_Morris]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
Quote:



you always try to change these conversations to the personal...you don't know everyone on here, you have no idea what people have contributed and sacrificed during their lives - so how can you even begin to compare?




That's why I asked what your model of observation gets you. My whole point was if you are doing something to benefit who are you to question what makes them do it?
_________________________
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www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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#356785 - 09/03/07 08:38 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Gavin]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
well, today is a holiday (ironically called 'labor day' in the US). woke up and had a 1/2 cup of coffee and took a crap while reading 'angry white pajamas' - great book btw.

scaned the newspaper, then the kids woke up and we made breakfast together....I was teaching them how to make a 'light over easy' egg without breaking it. sat down and ate over a discussion about what to do today - we decided on the 3-county fair, which is a traveling amusement park in the area this weekend. they can bring 1 friend each. so it looks like today I'll be waiting in line for ride-tickets while 4 pre-teens seek out the most dangerous looking contraptions to trust their lives on. amusement parks always facinate me - I can just sit there and look at the rides, working on mentally figuring out the physics and dynamics of each. occationally riding on ones that look fun.

that'll be my day.

[edit] oops, did I say 'pre-teens'? I meant 'young-teens'...they are growing up fast.

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#356786 - 09/03/07 08:42 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Ed_Morris]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
Sounds like a productive day and I agree totally that it is a great book. A great way to use your Chi and creating some productive interactions of energy.
_________________________
Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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#356787 - 09/03/07 08:55 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Gavin]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
I'm happy to hear you can appreciate the more subtle training oportunities that exist everyday. standing in line is good training. even taking a crap can be an opportunity - dropping your weight using your hara. lol

good chatting. have a great day.

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#356788 - 09/03/07 09:07 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Ed_Morris]
jude33 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/14/07
Posts: 1539
Quote:

however, my earlier question went unanswered: does a synthetic leaf made out of plastic emit an energy?




Yes it does but no point in arguing about it as plastic leaves dont practice martial arts well at least the ones I have seen dont. Maybe other things could be discussed such as rooting or spirelling or even martial arts techniques that make use of chi maybe?

Ps I think from your lack of response you were proven wrong about the experiment but never mind, dont feel bad, be happy, have chi, these things happen.

Why do I feel so good all of a sudden?


Wristtwister you were correct.


Jude


Edited by jude33 (09/03/07 09:17 AM)

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#356789 - 09/03/07 09:16 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Ed_Morris]
Gavin Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 2267
Loc: Southend, Essex, UK
It's all cool with me baby. Steve R actually says that having a crap is one of life's natural Zen moments!

Here's his take on the whole Chi thing...t'is a good read!

http://www.shikon.com/Z%20Is%20Chi%20Real.htm

Have a nice day off!
_________________________
Gavin King
www.SHIKON.COM
Follow me on twitter @taichigav

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#356790 - 09/03/07 10:58 AM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: Gavin]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Esoteric learning... "knowing is doing"...

"There are those things that can be explained but not done, there are those things that can be done but not explained"... Fumio Toyoda (in a dinner conversation after a seminar).

Gavin...

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

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#356791 - 09/03/07 06:44 PM Re: what can you actually do with chi? [Re: jude33]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
Quote:

Quote:

however, my earlier question went unanswered: does a synthetic leaf made out of plastic emit an energy?




Yes it does but no point in arguing about it as plastic leaves dont practice martial arts well at least the ones I have seen dont. Maybe other things could be discussed such as rooting or spirelling or even martial arts techniques that make use of chi maybe?

Ps I think from your lack of response you were proven wrong about the experiment but never mind, dont feel bad, be happy, have chi, these things happen.




you are incorrect. These are YOUR words:

Quote:

The gas ionization photographed around the body needed a living body with electro and mechanical energy in the body as well as the other elements required for the experiment. The fact it wouldnt work in a vacuum only proved it wasnt paranormal.It doesnt disprove the human body is a walking bundle of electro and mechanical energy.



nope, doesn't need a living body.


from the wikipedia article:
Quote:

In addition to living material, inanimate objects such as coins will also produce images on the film in a Kirlian photograph setup.




therefore, using your logic, I could also say that the Kirlian effect does not disprove that a twinkie is 'a springy bundle of electro and mechanical energy'. since the results are the same with living vs. inanimate. I could also say the Kirlian effect doesn't disprove bigfoot or the lost city of Atlantis.

see the point? This type of photographic effect doesn't support any argument that we are walking around emitting energy. which is what wristwister stated:
Quote:


The body is a walking bundle of electro-mechanical energy, as evidenced by kirilin photography, so "blending ki" (which is the basis of Aikido) could involve any number of people, correct? Then why would me lending her my "hand position" create that dynamic? The only answer is "ki"... because there wasn't anything else in play there.




Which showed his misunderstanding (as most chiropractors beleiving in this photo effect do), that in fact, inanimate object also produce similar effect. however, if he's willing to say his hand produces as much ki energy as a twinkie, then Kirlian photography could not disprove that claim either.

Did you see the average age of the people reading here? SOMEBODY has to point them in the alternative direction of critical thinking in this forum section.

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