FightingArts Estore
Pressure Points
From a medical professional, straight facts on where and how to hit that can save your life.
Stretching
Limber or not, anyone can add height and speed to their kicks with this method.
Calligraphy
For yourself or as a gift, calligraphy is special, unique and lasting.
Karate Uniforms
Look your best. Max snap. low cost & superior crafted: “Peak Performance Gold” 16 oz uniforms.

MOTOBU
Classic book translation. Hard to find. Not in stores.
Who's Online
0 registered (), 71 Guests and 1 Spider online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Thomas_Kungfu, traa1, JohnRay50, nogibjjgear, Jrogers001
23250 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
traa1 1
liangxiaoyu123 1
Thomas_Kungfu 1
May
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
New Topics
differences between shaolin and wing chun ?
by liangxiaoyu123
04/28/20 01:05 AM
Recent Posts
differences between shaolin and wing chun ?
by liangxiaoyu123
04/28/20 01:05 AM
Forum Stats
23250 Members
36 Forums
35704 Topics
432774 Posts

Max Online: 488 @ 01/23/20 01:55 PM
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#353111 - 07/25/07 03:47 PM Is JKD the Father of MMA???
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
Is JKD the Father of MMA??? I ask because of its founder philosophy of using what works and throw out what does not work for you. The range fighting concept that gives a realsitic idead where your strengths are and how to defend against your weakness and exploit you strengths.

Though Gracie's BJJ seem to have brought it to the fore front, BJJ real strength is in its ground work, yes it does standup, throws and most the things that JJ does. But like JJ or at least BJJ rarely is standup their strength, they seem to score more knock out kicking from the floor up, it seems, then standup. They do finish well after you hurt. And submission is their game. I'm really talking aboiut the Gracies not all of BJJ.


Anyway whats your thoughts is JKD the FATHER of MMA in concept or JKD sport level?

I know JKD is serious street application armed and unarmed.
I hope this doesn't offend.


Edited by Neko456 (07/25/07 03:51 PM)
_________________________
DBAckerson

Top
#353112 - 07/25/07 03:57 PM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: Neko456]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
No, Brazilian Vale Tudo is the father of MMA.

Top
#353113 - 07/25/07 04:28 PM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: medulanet]
Neko456 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 3260
Loc: Midwest City, Ok, USA
Was Brazilian Vale Tudo practiced back in 1964-70s this is approximately when Lee brought up the concept of JKD. I understand that and you are right Brazilian Vale Tudo predates the UFC but was it there before the JKD idea?


Edited by Neko456 (07/25/07 04:30 PM)
_________________________
DBAckerson

Top
#353114 - 07/25/07 05:44 PM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: Neko456]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Brazilian jiu-jitsu was the forerunner to modern vale tudo. JKD was the forerunner to modern MMA.

What's the difference? Brazilian jiu-jitsu was/is a more one dimensional art. MMA means "mixed" martial arts. That is by definition, multi-dimensional.

What was the JKD concept about? Totality. To "float in totality" instead of "partiality".

Totality = MMA. Partiality = Brazilian jiu-jitsu.

I think that about sums it up.


-John

Top
#353115 - 07/25/07 05:44 PM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: Neko456]
Kimo2007 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 03/31/07
Posts: 1057
A true renaissance man, Bruce Lee was a talented artist, poet, philosopher, writer and actor, apart from being a formidable fighter. Bruce Lee can be considered a prophet in some ways. He combined boxing punches, grappling, low and high kicks in a unique style that was criticised vastly by most traditional martial artists at the time. Today all mixed martial artists are training in a similar way. The difference is that he was brilliant enough to do so more than 35 years ago. If you don’t believe me, watch the opening scene of “Enter the Dragon”. That was a true free fight event.
Back in Lee’s era, no training equipment was available. He had to invent it. His focus gloves and his fighting gloves are very similar to the ones that are used in MMA training today. If you see some techniques in his books (and his films), you will find out that his style can still be used in a ring effectively. The techniques used in his movies are a bit flashier but full of martial arts wisdom. Guess what? He finished most of his opponents with grappling. In "Way of the Dragon " he finishes Chuck Norris with a neck break. In "Game of Death" he beat Kareem Abdul-Jabbar with a headlock. In “The Big Boss” the final fight ends with a mount.
Bruce always seemed so far ahead of his era. The techniques that are used today in JKD schools are (in my opinion, and I don't mean it as an insult) too influenced by Wing Tsun, Kali and Fillipino martial arts. I mean, I haven't seen a JKD guy that can really kick. Come on guys, Bruce was a great kicker.
Bruce proved to everyone that it is not how much you train, but how smart you train. Many people have said a lot of bad things about Bruce. Some claim that his physique was too skinny to withstand a powerful blow. Others say that although he embodied the use of free weights in his training, he could not lift as much as today’s champions do. Others say that he was not really ring proven. I have seen all his movies and studied them very carefully and I must say that I learned more by watching his movies alone than I ever learned in any seminar or by watching any training tape. The techniques used in his books are the most inspiring I have ever seen. There are many books out there but every book has a technique or two that are useless. His books have none.

Not my words I just happened to be reading up on Bruce Lee a few days ago.
_________________________
Undefeated in all of Asia!

Top
#353116 - 07/25/07 05:53 PM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: Neko456]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Depends on how far back you referring to. Vale Tudo is probably the closest relative to the MMA we know today. But you could make a theoretical case for JKD, Bartitsu, or even Pankration.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

Top
#353117 - 07/25/07 07:27 PM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: JKogas]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
Quote:

Brazilian jiu-jitsu was the forerunner to modern vale tudo. JKD was the forerunner to modern MMA.

What's the difference? Brazilian jiu-jitsu was/is a more one dimensional art. MMA means "mixed" martial arts. That is by definition, multi-dimensional.

What was the JKD concept about? Totality. To "float in totality" instead of "partiality".

Totality = MMA. Partiality = Brazilian jiu-jitsu.

I think that about sums it up.


-John




What about guys like Marco Ruas who were not just BJJ guys, but strikers/wrestlers as well. In addition vale tudo means anything goes, not anything goes as long as its BJJ.

Top
#353118 - 07/25/07 08:04 PM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: medulanet]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Quote:

What about guys like Marco Ruas who were not just BJJ guys, but strikers/wrestlers as well.





That’s a valid point! Theres no denying that about Ruas. Ironically, the immediate impression I had when I first saw Ruas in the UFC was that he was the quintessential jkd man. I remember thinking that to this day.

And how old would Ruas have been back in ‘67? Maybe 5 or 6?

My point is that BJJ pretty much owned vale tudo for years since it’s modern incarnation beginning in 1925 in Brazil. Sure there were a few individuals who were remarkable in some ways. No denying that.


Quote:


In addition vale tudo means anything goes, not anything goes as long as its BJJ.





Maybe not, but that’s how anything WENT, if you follow me. I think that it wasn’t until more multi-dimensional fighters began making the scene that the sport truly became “MMA” however. That was something that wasn’t a part of the vale tudo movement early on that it is TODAY. That was my point.



-John

Top
#353119 - 07/26/07 03:25 AM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: JKogas]
IExcalibui2 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 961
Loc: New York City
I would say John's first post just about sums it up
Then again what about Pankration? (Matt beat me to it)
Ancient combat competition that pretty much let 2 naked dudes go at it in the dirt. And it probably had like 2 rules, 3 at most? And how about old Chinese Lei Tai fights? Though generally Chinese MA revolves a lot around striking and stand up, but there would be nothing to stop a man if he decides to take someone down and mount them.

Lee's thoughts about flow and formlessness is not original, though his thoughts on totality are. Formlessness is just as old as MA itself, especially seeing that San Sao/Shou is the level that most Chinese MA hope to attain. "

So MMA could've been born from Lee's JKD, but then again Lee's JKD or modern MMA could have came from other stuff. Who knows?
_________________________
"you're going to work till you wish you were dead and then keep going.." -Sgt Slaughter

Top
#353120 - 07/26/07 03:53 AM Re: Is JKD the Father of MMA??? [Re: IExcalibui2]
jkdwarrior Offline
Member

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 341
Loc: belfast, Antrim, Ireland
Well when MMA began, it was full of specialists in one range. People who could punch against those who could wrestle. Over the years however, it has been found that those who are most well rounded usually fare better. This has been the general idea of jkd since it was founded, it's just that through these types of competitions that this philosophy has been found correct. Jkd however is more geared towards the street where there aren't any rules and the nastier more destructive techniques fare well also
(the groin is a primary target). You could say that all these MMA practitioners are doing jkd, i.e. adapting their fighting to their situation and training for every octagon eventuality.
_________________________
Sticks n stones'll break my bones, but if I land the first one, you're in trouble!

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >


Moderator:  Cord, JKogas, MattJ, Reiki 




Action Ads
1.5 Million Plus Page Views
Monthly
Only $89
Details

Fight Videos
Night club fight footage and street fights captured with the world's first bouncer spy cam

How to Matrix!
Learn ten times faster with new training method. Learn entire arts for as little as $10 per disk.

Self Defense
Stun guns, pepper spray, Mace and self defense products. Alarms for personal and home use.

TASER MC26C
Stop An Urban Gorilla: Get 2 FREE TASER M26C Replacement Air Cartridges With Each New TASER M26C!

 

Unbreakable Unbrella

krav maga