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#346215 - 06/08/07 10:32 PM Working on Forms/Katas
WhiteDragon11 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/02/07
Posts: 1165
Loc: Florida, United States
Hey guys/girls,
I was wondering, do you believe working on your forms and katas are important to become a better martial artist? If so, do you think it is more important to work on forms or stances (i know a lot of you dont like stance work)?
I believe katas/forms are important and I work on them. But I see a lot better result working with techniques on a bag or in the air to get down the steps.

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#346216 - 06/14/07 01:49 PM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: WhiteDragon11]
Ironfoot Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 2682
Loc: St. Clair Shores, MI USA
Anyone who doesn't like stance work is headed for a fall. Working on the bag helps hone techniques. Working on kata harvests those techniques for you to work on.
_________________________

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#346217 - 06/14/07 06:17 PM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: WhiteDragon11]
shoshinkan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
for practical karate the kata is simply a tool to deliver the 'karate' technique,

Its an essential ingrediant as part of a balanced recipie......which includes many other things
_________________________
Jim Neeter

www.shoshinkanuk.blogspot.com

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#346218 - 06/14/07 09:57 PM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: WhiteDragon11]
wristtwister Offline
like a chiropractor, only evil

Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 2210
Loc: South Carolina
Do you even know what kata means? The "public perception" is "forms", but the literal meaning is "how one behaves". As Shoshinkan put it, it is merely the vehicle to deliver information to you and it's purpose is to change your behavior.

Kata can be merely the "stepping through" of one technique, or the "forms" which are so popularly changed on a daily basis by those that don't have a clue how they should conduct business. You don't just "learn kata", you progress through kata, and find the techniques becoming increasingly more complex and difficult to perform (in most cases). They are designed to help you develop proper body mechanics, focus, kime', and a host of other "small things" that simply can't be taught individually due to only having one lifetime in which to learn them. They teach you to change stances, do proper stances, do techniques from stances, and to remain balanced while moving... so there is a host of information involved in kata.

As for bag work, there is more to hitting than just finding the target. I've watched others at our dojo "hit the bag" and the bag swings on it's chains... when I hit it, the bag pivots... the top moves... the bottom comes up, and then it swings on it's chains... one hell of a difference in force delivery.

Clearly you have a "beginner's mind" from how you discuss kata, so before you start "deciding" what to focus your training on, try listening to what your teachers say, and follow their instructions. You'll do much better than trying to do it on your own.

_________________________
What man is a man that does not make the world a better place?... from "Kingdom of Heaven"

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#346219 - 06/15/07 03:54 AM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: wristtwister]
shoshinkan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
Begineers Mind is a good thing! LOL

Sho Shin.
_________________________
Jim Neeter

www.shoshinkanuk.blogspot.com

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#346220 - 06/15/07 08:17 AM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: wristtwister]
Ironfoot Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 06/10/04
Posts: 2682
Loc: St. Clair Shores, MI USA
Quote:

... I've watched others at our dojo "hit the bag" and the bag swings on it's chains... when I hit it, the bag pivots... the top moves... the bottom comes up, and then it swings on it's chains... one hell of a difference in force delivery....




That's when you know you've hit it right; you've delivered force with focus, not pushing. The bag must jump.
_________________________

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#346221 - 07/18/07 11:34 AM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: Ironfoot]
hedkikr Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 2827
Loc: Southern California, USA
It's also not enough to learn the application (bunkai) if the application fails in body mechanics. There are so many incorrect interpretations of the techniques that w/o an understanding of body mechanics, the kata is only a dance.

Done correctly, kata will really enhance your MA training. Bagwork, although important, is not enough.

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#346222 - 07/18/07 07:02 PM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: hedkikr]
WhiteDragon11 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/02/07
Posts: 1165
Loc: Florida, United States
Wristtwister did you read where I said I practice them and work on them? I was asking for your guys opinions not what I do. So before you tell me I have a "beginners mind", read into what I am asking.

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#346223 - 07/18/07 07:05 PM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: hedkikr]
pmt Offline
Newbie

Registered: 06/22/07
Posts: 7
Loc: Ireland
Kata when practiced correctly will make you a better martial artist in the long run if you engage your brain. Bag work is equally important as was said b4 it needs to jump not swing. Also of major importance is kumite a living game of chess. All aspects come into to play to round off your martial arts education.

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#346224 - 10/29/07 12:31 AM Whats goin on? *DELETED* [Re: pmt]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Post deleted by oldman

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#346225 - 10/29/07 09:20 AM SPAM ALERT ATTN MODS
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Check that jackass' signature. Ban please.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#346226 - 10/29/07 11:27 AM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: WhiteDragon11]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3113
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Whitedragon11:

Critical to becoming a good practitioner. You cannot seperate stance from sequence. Stacne unto itself teaches the structure. The kata sequence give them intelligent context, whispers hints of principles.

When the solo kata, its pieces are known understood well, you add bodies and increase resistance. Without kata you miss the long term; anyone not in ideal physical perfection.
Kata can be explored by anyone no matter what their conditions/challenges.

The time line has many possibilities solo technique, power, sequence and the cycle begins again. I can do it by myself, have learned to control the big stuff, now I explore my knowledge with another person, them slowly resisting. Explore that. Then another body, and another. See what factors exist between different bodies, temperments. Then return to the kata, the bag and improve explore how to generate power.

Jeff

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#346227 - 11/07/07 06:16 PM Re: Working on Forms/Katas [Re: Ronin1966]
WhiteDragon11 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/02/07
Posts: 1165
Loc: Florida, United States
Thanks Jeff, good post.

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