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#330326 - 03/22/07 11:49 PM Critique my shadow boxing
Reidar Offline
Stranger

Registered: 03/22/07
Posts: 4
I don't have any formal training due to transportation issues, but I practice boxing on my own. This is a bad idea and a teacher is essential for pointing out flaws and stopping bad habits early, but I do it anyways. Offer your opinion on how much this affects me. Be brutal and honest. For some background, I'm 20, 223 lbs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gh-HTqNkWuE

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#330327 - 03/23/07 12:09 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Reidar]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
1) You're too squared up. I couldn't decide if whether your right or left leg was leading but it seemed that it was your right.

2) No hip. Your punches were mostly 'bolo'. Meaning you only use your arm to deliver the blow.

3) No shoulder in the punch. You don't turn your shoulder, so not only don't you get power, you don't get distance.

4) Your fists are clenched all the time. Let them lose.

5) Hands are placed awkwardly. The rear hand protects the chin, the lead hand is in front of the body.

6) No movement of the head. It's like a sign that says "hit me". Move your head.

7) Learn to jab. Wasn't impressed with the hand speed. You're doing "cat paw" not a jab. Cat paw is basically a slap that looks like a punch.

8) Learn to box from orthodox before going southpaw. Just because southpaw is good doesn't mean you can skip the basics. Go orthodox first until you're good there, then change to southpaw.

9) Your shadow boxing is very linear. Move around more, not just stand there and let loose blows after blows. This is "shadow boxing" not kata.

10) Your uppercut. Go learn it. It's not done by throwing your fist up like that. It involves lowering the upper body, with the elbows at your hips, your palm facing 45 degrees to the ceiling, your hips and legs pushing forward and your hand going up. That's an uppercut.

11) When punching, you have no defense whatsoever. Tuck your chin in with the shoulders. If it was a pro match, you'd be knocked out by a lucky punch. Chin in with shoulder.

12) Your jabs are stiff. They should be snappy.

Recommendation; Good start, but you have lots to learn. Your hands are fast because you punch at a lower height. It's a lot easier to punch something downwards than upwards. If you're going to practice body shots, go for angled punches like hooks and uppercuts, not jabs. Learn your basics as well, I wasn't too impressed with your mechanics and form.

You do have, however, good conditioning, so that isn't your area of concern. Learn basics and how to use them. Speed will come later.

I'm being brutally honest.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#330328 - 03/23/07 12:18 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Taison]
Reidar Offline
Stranger

Registered: 03/22/07
Posts: 4
Thanks for that.

You really think that one should stand conventionally even if they're more comfortable with southpaw? I didn't even know I was southpaw until a friend told me, so would that not be the "basics" for me?

I realize I'm an arm-puncher. I watch too much Muhammad Ali.

As much as I would like to say that this works for me, I really can't legitimately without having proven myself with actual wins - not yet. So I will take everything you said into account. I wasn't expecting such thorough analysis, by the way - thanks. More comments welcome.

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#330329 - 03/23/07 12:46 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Reidar]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
I forgot to ask if you're left handed or right.

If you're left-handed, go with the southpaw.
If you're right, go with the orthodox.

Me being stupid again, I guess.

Muhammad Ali NEVER did arm punches. His punches were done with his whole body working together like one unit. When he threw he jabs, his foot came forward, his hips turned, his shoulder rotated, his fist went out and snapped back. That's what I call a 'punch'.

Basics isn't the stance. Basic that you need to learn is 'how to punch'. Most of it are arm punches. Arm punches only work in amateur boxing when you try to 'tap' your opponent for punching. It's called 'bolo' and doesn't work. Ever.

Quote:

I really can't legitimately without having proven myself with actual wins - not yet.


Good luck. Just learn some proper basics before you get yourself hurt.

Another thing about southpaw. Why does people adopt this stance? You have more targets opened for you. It's easier to hit the liver, the face, the body. But at the cost of it being easier for him to hit you. Unless you believe you've got superior skill than your opponent or you believe that the only way to hit him is in southpaw, you don't go for the southpaw.

I know a friend that thought "southpaw is comfortable, I'll go with it". Guess what happened? He fought against a leftie who was in orthodox who had more skills. In round 1 and 2 he got the cr4p beaten out of him. Then he changed back to orthodox, and started taking less hits. In round 5, the match ended with a draw. If only he decided to take orthodox in round 1, he'd won.

I'm not saying southpaw isn't good, it's just that you need to possess some skill level before you go into it. I'm myself a right-handed southpaw, but recently I've changed back to orthodox because I feel I'm no longer in the shape to take hits and dish out. I rather play a safe game than 'slugging it out'.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#330330 - 03/23/07 12:59 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Taison]
Reidar Offline
Stranger

Registered: 03/22/07
Posts: 4
I'm right handed, but I naturally felt better doing southpaw. But that incident with your friend is very interesting.

About Ali arm punching (perhaps this is for a separate thread): he knocked down Cleveland Williams while moving backwards, for one example. It wasn't my intent to say that I can copy Ali and make it work, of course. I want to fix what you advised.

By the way, you do Muay Thai? I practiced Muay Thai even before I became interested in boxing, but my kicks need more work than even my punching. My interest exceeds my ability at this point.

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#330331 - 03/23/07 01:22 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Reidar]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
The Ko against Williams, was a proper punch. As he stepped back, he used inertia to redirect his CG forward. Imagine driving at a high speed and then applying a higher force to break and slight move yourself in the opposite direction. That's one of Ali's wonder. His footwork was amazing, but I like Marciano better. Never liked 'out boxing' that much.

Quote:

By the way, you do Muay Thai?


Depends on what time and place. A few years ago, I left Muay Boran for the full-contact nature of MT. Then I left MT because I grew bored with the rules.

If I was to classify myself as anything, I'd be either a Judo-ka, karate-ka or a MT artist. But I just like calling myself "heavy hander".

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#330332 - 03/23/07 11:14 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Taison]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
I applaud your enthusiasm and encourage you to continue. However you will not learn to box via the internet. You need a qualified trainer desperately!

Look at all the flaws Taison picked out, hereís 3 more;

Your elbows stick out, you bounce too much and your feet arenít planted when you punch!

I have every bit of confidence in you, that with six months of proper training your next you tube video will show a remarkable improvement and you will look good!

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#330333 - 03/23/07 11:23 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Reidar]
Prizewriter Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 10/23/05
Posts: 2573
Agree with Taisons excellent critique.

In particualr, I would recommend you work on your jab. You are pawing it out rather than shooting it out.

Extend your arm fully when jabbing. Make sure your chin gets tucked down beneath your shoulder when your arm is fully extended.

Speaking of which, keep your chin down!!! Try lying it on your chest when punching.

I would also recommend boxing in front of a mirror. You will be able to see gaps in your own defense much quicker, and it also gets you into the idea of punching where an opponents defence is weak.


I have said this a 1000 times, Muhammed Ali is THE WORST person to learn boxing from! Brilliant boxer, but highly unorthodox.

Try using more conventional, modern examples of purists of the noble art to study. Guys like James Toney, Bernard Hopkins and Ronald "Winky" Wright are good places to start.
_________________________
"Let your food be your medicine, and your medicine be your food" Hippocrates.

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#330334 - 03/23/07 11:26 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Taison]
Zombie Zero Offline
Compliance & Liability
Veteran

Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 1992
Loc: Lorton, VA
I agree with Taison's entire list in his first post. I was also going to point out the stance, hip use, hand placement, and need for footwork.

Thanks for sharing the video. I see a TON of potential there. Do yourself a huge favor, and join a boxing gym.

Oh, and welcome to the forums!
_________________________
In my walk in the martial way, my hope is that as long as I live, I will always be a beginner.

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#330335 - 03/23/07 11:28 AM Re: Critique my shadow boxing [Re: Reidar]
Zombie Zero Offline
Compliance & Liability
Veteran

Registered: 06/17/05
Posts: 1992
Loc: Lorton, VA
Quote:

My interest exceeds my ability at this point.




I hope that's always the case for me. Because if my interest stays really high, my ability will always continue to improve.

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