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#328022 - 03/12/07 05:43 PM Lets Go Technical Part 5
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
After some discussion, it was decided that the Jab, its uses, advantages and disadvantages would be the next topic in the Technical Series.

The jab is one of the most simple, yet most misunderstood attacks available to a fighter. So we are going to break it down a little starting with body mechanics.

A good jab, is a loose and relaxed attack. If you are tense when you try to jab, it will only slow it down. You must relax. Your lead hand should shoot straight out, then return along the same path. The closest distance between two points is always a straight line, so thats the path you want your hand to take.

The attack starts at the feet, through the hips, shoulder and on to the fist. However, you dont have to over do it when adding momentum to your punch. If you punch too hard, you wont be able to withdraw quick enough. The impact instead should come from a whipping motion, similar to that of snapping a towel. Your fist and arm will remain loose until impact, where it should clench upon impact, relax, and withdraw to original position. You should be hitting with the first two knuckles, and your arm should extend only about 90%. You dont want to fully lock out. Its may damage the elbow, as well as slow you down or set you up to get locked.

So there is a basic understanding of how to throw the punch, now comes, How can I use it?

TO GAUGE DISTANCE AND TIMING: You can work the jab over and over again, without exerting much energy. This will allow you to find your range, your opponents range and also it will allow you to judge his attributes. You can judge his footwork, reaction speed, his timing, and his posture. You are afforded this luxury by being able to keep him back, but also keep him busy by working a consistant jab alone, or in combination with other attacks.

AS AN OPENER: As an opening technique, it could be argued that there is nothing better than a good jab. Its you quickest attack, and it can easily confuse an opponents defense and create openings. A good jab can water your eyes heavily or stun you. Ali was known to KO with his jab.

AS A FEINT: Whenever fighting, when you choose to be evasive, to trap, draw, or feint, you are doing so for two reasons, (1), to time the committment of an opponent, such as a step forward, or a telegraphed attack. Myabe he tries to block your feint. The #2 reason is to find the timing for any gaps he may have between one movement to the next.

A jab is great for this. Say you are trying to time a committment. Take a half step back, causing him to step forward one whole step. As soon as you take the half step spring back forward with the jab, as he committs to his full step. You can do this going backwards as well if he is one of those raging bull types.

Another way you might use this is if he has quick hands, and can defend well. You can either feint the jab, baiting him to defend and leaving him open, or you can simply attack with the jab. If he has defended it successfully, his is not on the offensive, but on the defensive. Keep firing away cause he cant block everything.

TO FIND GAPS: A "gap" is a moment of inactivity on the part of the opponent. Usually this is found in the withdrawal of the opponents attack. He punches, then withdraws the fist back to his defensive structure. The time when he is withdrawing, until the time he attacks is his gap. Also his gap could be how long it takes to transition from one position to the next, such as from one attack, to the next. For example, how long it would take hime to execute an uppercut after having thrown a hook.
Often these gaps a short, but a good jab is able to make use of these situations.

AS A STOP HIT: Despite not requiring the force of most punches, there are things you can do to fascilitate KO power in your jabs. You can use a falling step, a springing step, or a good slip, or bob and weave, to add weight and momentum to your punch, and to time your opponents gap, committment or opening.

So there is a brief overview of the jab. Im sure there is much I missed so please, feel free to critique and contribute.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#328023 - 03/12/07 07:02 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Chen Zen]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Perhaps we could all weigh in on this and describe ways in which we personally use the jab or, describe our experiences with it.

I use the jab whenever I'm out of optimum position (such as after a miss with the cross). In that sense, I'm using the jab not only as a means to score and keep HIM from scoring (defensive use) but to put my body back into the right position structurally.

I will also use the jab when circling toward the power (rear) hand of my opponent. As we are taught not to circle to the power side of our opponent (as it sets you up for the right hand), it becomes obvious that this is a rule that will have to be broken, otherwise all you would see are boxers constantly moving around in a tight, counter-clockwise circle (if in orthodox leads). So obviously this doesn't happen as people move laterally to cut off the ring and stalk you into a corner or against the ropes (cage, fence, wall, car, or whatever obstacle you might find yourself up against). Thus the jab is one means of safely enabling you to move toward the power hand (especially using the DOUBLE jab in this case).

The jab can be thrown as a sort of reverse hammerfist as well. I like this especially when I shoulder roll away from a straight punch. With good timing, it catches them wide open as they are throwing their shot. You'd treat this no differently than any other jab and use it as a set up for the cross or any other attack combination.

Another good use for the jab is as a set up a double leg shot. Moving around and throwing some good combinations to get my opponent thinking "upstairs" for a bit is a great set up. Then you come back in with the jab to get him on the defensive (moving his arms up to parry/block), change levels and shoot in for the takedown. This has got to be one of the easiest set ups in existance as it gets so many people.

Lastly, when throwing the jab, I don't want to have my head over my arm. That tends to raise you up and takes power away from the punch. I like to throw moving my head away from the punch, slightly toward the rear hand while stepping forward with my lead leg (this if I'm wanting to land the jab with a little more authority).

As with many of my punches, the fist can be horizontal of vertical. The problem with a vertical jab is the opening you leave to hit you in return. The elbow doesn't raise and the shoulder also stays low and keeps the chin uncovered. Nowhere are you more open to being hit than WHEN you're hitting. The harder I plan on hitting, the more rotation I put into the fist. One side benefit of this is you can't hyperextend your arm on a miss the way you can (and will) using a vertical punch.

Just a few thoughts based upon my experiences I thought I'd share.


-John

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#328024 - 03/12/07 09:53 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Chen Zen]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:

Your lead hand should shoot straight out, then return along the same path.




And it should return just as fast as it shot out at.



Quote:

The impact instead should come from a whipping motion, similar to that of snapping a towel.




For a flicker jab yes but for a power jab no. There is more than one way to throw a jab (more than two ways for that matter).


Quote:

Ali was known to KO with his jab




Ali was the greatest but he wasnít a power hitter. Now Larry Homes knocked people out with his jab.




Quote:

Despite not requiring the force of most punches, there are things you can do to fascilitate KO power in your jabs. You can use a falling step, a springing stepÖ




When taking that step, you can rock or dip. This might save you from eating a straight punch as you step in.

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#328025 - 03/12/07 10:12 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: JKogas]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:

I will also use the jab when circling toward the power (rear) hand of my opponent. As we are taught not to circle to the power side of our opponent (as it sets you up for the right hand), it becomes obvious that this is a rule that will have to be broken, otherwise all you would see are boxers constantly moving around in a tight, counter-clockwise circle




When moving to their power side you can waltz.



Quote:

Another good use for the jab is as a set up a double leg shot.




Yep, post the jab and then change levels.





Quote:

The jab can be thrown as a sort of reverse hammerfist as well. I like this especially when I shoulder roll away from a straight punch. With good timing, it catches them wide open as they are throwing their shot. You'd treat this no differently than any other jab and use it as a set up for the cross or any other attack combination.


Quote:

Lastly, when throwing the jab, I don't want to have my head over my arm. That tends to raise you up and takes power away from the punch. I like to throw moving my head away from the punch, slightly toward the rear hand while stepping forward with my lead leg (this if I'm wanting to land the jab with a little more authority).





These last two quotes sound FUBAR to me but maybe something was lost in the translation, I think I need to see video to know what youíre doing exactly.

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#328026 - 03/12/07 10:18 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Quote:


These last two quotes sound FUBAR to me but maybe something was lost in the translation, I think I need to see video to know what youíre doing exactly.





Tell ya what, getting a feel for them is even better. Where ya located? Perhaps we can train sometime? Showing is always better than telling. I love to train with everyone. I can show you how I make these work for me and perhaps you can give me some insight into YOUR training.



-John

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#328027 - 03/12/07 10:52 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: JKogas]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:


Tell ya what, getting a feel for them is even better. Where ya located? Perhaps we can train sometime? Showing is always better than telling. I love to train with everyone. I can show you how I make these work for me and perhaps you can give me some insight into YOUR training.



-John


Iíd like to train with you too sometime John. Unfortunately Iím closer to Alaska (Western Canada, up north) than I am to North Carolina.

As for my training

Boxing is the base for my striking with some Muay Thai added in (Iím a former amateur kick boxer)

Wrestling and Jujitsu make up my grappling (Iím a former high school wrestler)

I was training for MMA but Iím really too old for that now (40+), so I just train lightly these days.

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#328028 - 03/13/07 12:44 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Larry Holmes knocked people out with a lead straight. Don't confuse the lead straight with a jab. The mechanics are similar but totally different usage.

The lead straight looks like a jab, but is more akin to the cross. Basically, it's a straight punch delivered with force that is supposed to ko people like a cross. It's not fast as the jab but more powerful, and it's not powerful like the cross but faster.

That's a little Muay Thai for ya

Chen, thanks for doing this for me, I'm not so good on the outside and there's no way I'd be able to write like that, thanks man.

John, thanks for the extra info, the backfist has been a powerful tool in my arsenal but I rarely use them as my instincts tells me to either go for the jab or body hook, but it's just me that need more training.

Anyone got any questions?

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328029 - 03/13/07 12:53 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
No problem Taison. I love these types of posts.

As for the backfist, I use this alot in conjunction with my jab. If I can slip, the backfist is great for getting around obstructing limbs and making good contact. Or after a solid feint. If you work it enough, it can be as fast or perhaps faster than your jab.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#328030 - 03/13/07 01:02 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:

Larry Holmes knocked people out with a lead straight. Don't confuse the lead straight with a jab.....That's a little Muay Thai for ya


There is no universally accepted nomenclature in the martial arts; in fact there isnít even a standard for boxing or wrestling.

So a rose by any other nameÖ

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#328031 - 03/13/07 01:05 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Sure about that?
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#328032 - 03/13/07 01:17 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Chen Zen]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:

Sure about that?




Yes, very sure!

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#328033 - 03/13/07 01:34 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Don't know what you're talking since I have no idea what nomenclature means, sorry, my English isn't as good as it should be (try learning another language while taking hits to your brain and then study German afterwards).

Anyway, to most people lead straight and jab looks exactly the same and people think it's a jab, but there's a difference. The lead straight is a mix between the cross and the jab, done with the lead hand.

The jab, is a snappy punch done in conjunction with a step forward of the lead leg. It's very snappy like a whip, so the whiplash effect is the main power of it.

The straight lead, is a follow-through type of punch. It's done by stepping forward with the lead leg, rotation of the upper body to add momentum, and rotation of the hip to add power, and the punch is throw forward with power, which is aimed "through" the target. Usually this punch is done if you're really good with slipping by rotating your upper body and head.

Done with speed, it looks exactly like a jab to most people, even martial artists, that's why some boxing organizations didn't recognize it as a technique. Bruce Lee recognized it, many Cuban and Central American nation also does.

If you're good at slipping by rotating your upper body, this is a very good technique but some times people prefer to deliver body or head hooks from the slip, so figures.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328034 - 03/13/07 02:19 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
nomenclature

a system or arrangement of names
a system to assign names to a given field
a body or system of names
the names or terms comprising a set or system


Quote:

There is no universally accepted nomenclature in the martial arts; in fact there isnít even a standard for boxing or wrestling.




Quote:

that's why some boxing organizations didn't recognize it as a technique.



You just proved my point, thanks.

Let us not argue about what terms we should be using, it will only get in the way of us discussing the techniques.

Using your terminology; I donít jab much but I do use a straight lead a lot.

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#328035 - 03/13/07 02:26 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Err.. no problem?

Seriously, I had no idea what you two were talking about. LoL!

Anyway, yeah, nomenclature. Thanks for the new word.

Back to jabbing.

Before, before I dropped jabbing, I used to jab the biceps a lot since my opponents used to have really good defense. Anyone else tried wearing down your opponents in the same way?

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328036 - 03/13/07 06:32 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Quote:

Iíd like to train with you too sometime John. Unfortunately Iím closer to Alaska (Western Canada, up north) than I am to North Carolina.





Damn, that ALWAYS Seems to be the case with folks! Just my luck I suppose.


Quote:

As for my training

Boxing is the base for my striking with some Muay Thai added in (Iím a former amateur kick boxer)

Wrestling and Jujitsu make up my grappling (Iím a former high school wrestler)

I was training for MMA but Iím really too old for that now (40+), so I just train lightly these days.





I'm soon to be 42 and still train. I'm not training to compete but I still love to spar and wrestle with anyone. Light training is really all that's required for the most part. You know, for timing, etc. I try and maintain my current brain cell count and don't see any reason to do otherwise.


-John

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#328037 - 03/13/07 06:48 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: JKogas]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:


Damn, that ALWAYS Seems to be the case with folks! Just my luck I suppose.




Iím still waiting for someone to build a transporter, beam me up Scotty.


Quote:


I'm soon to be 42 and still train. I'm not training to compete but I still love to spar and wrestle with anyone. Light training is really all that's required for the most part. You know, for timing, etc. I try and maintain my current brain cell count and don't see any reason to do otherwise.


-John




Yea the older I get the less I like being KO. I think Iíll join the rest of the geriatrics in the park for some Tia chi and then Iíll take a nap.

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#328038 - 03/13/07 07:43 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Chen Zen]
Legend of the Hungry Wolf Offline
Member

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 221
great stuff, i love the "lets go technical" articles. Keep it comming
_________________________
Hakkyokuseiken Senpuken-terry bogard

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#328039 - 03/13/07 08:04 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Legend of the Hungry Wolf]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
I have another tip;

Aim your jab at their forehead, thatís right the forehead. The idea is that the jab will pop the head back lifting the chin for you to hit with a follow up punch like a cross.

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#328040 - 03/13/07 08:05 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
I got a better one.

Aim for the throat. The human mechanic is like this; The eyes sees the jab coming, it knows if the jab hits the throat it may be fatal, so the chin goes down to protect it. Bang, KO.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328041 - 03/13/07 08:20 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:

I got a better one.

Aim for the throat. The human mechanic is like this; The eyes sees the jab coming, it knows if the jab hits the throat it may be fatal, so the chin goes down to protect it. Bang, KO.

-Taison out


I respectfully disagree.

I good fighter will have his chin already down and protected, a hard target to get on a trained guy, hence the desire to pop the chin up.

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#328042 - 03/13/07 08:28 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Problem is there aren't many "good fighters" after 6-7 rounds.

I can barely keep my hands up after 6 rounds of fighting, not to mention keeping my chin and shoulder up.

Well, it's my fault I didn't mention this before but oh well.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328043 - 03/13/07 08:36 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
6 or 7 rounds!!!!!

When I kick boxed back with the dinosaurs, fights were limited to 5 rounds. My fights were sanctioned by the WKA and I was an amateur fighter.

What sanctioning body governs your fights and are you a pro?

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#328044 - 03/13/07 08:48 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Hmm...

Amateur boxing fights are 5 rounds.
Pro boxing fights can be upto 12 rounds, but mostly limited to 10 rounds.
MT rounds are most of the time 5 rounds, but can be extended upto 7 rounds depending on circumstances.
AKB (the full-contact karate version) are 5 rounds.
Kickboxing can be upto 7 rounds depending on circumstances.

What sanctioning body governs my fights?
I'm a pro? Not really, I'm just a beginner

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

Top
#328045 - 03/13/07 09:15 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
ExCon Offline
There is no plan C

Registered: 03/02/07
Posts: 203
Quote:

Amateur boxing fights are 5 rounds




5 rounds? Is that a typo?

Quote:

I'm just a beginner




You won't be for long.

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#328046 - 03/13/07 09:21 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: ExCon]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Wah lao, heng sia. . .

Amateur fights are 4 rounds, each round is 2 minutes with 1 minute break between them.

Quote:

I'm just a beginner



Sarcasm.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

Top
#328047 - 03/13/07 11:51 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
matt_mcg Offline
Member

Registered: 03/08/06
Posts: 113
The jab, as taught to me in savate, sounds a bit more like a hybrid between the straight lead and the 'jab' as described above. It's quick and 'whippy' and comes back as fast as it goes out but there's usually a fair bit of hip rotation and twisting around the ball of the lead foot with the heel of the lead foot lifting slightly.

However, I'd not normally do a step foward while delivering the punch except to the extent that I might be moving forward already. We also practice jabbing while backing away from an oncoming fighter too, as a defensive technique to fend them off (as well as other things like chasse frontals and the like).

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#328048 - 03/13/07 11:56 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: matt_mcg]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Your jab is like everyone's jab.

A straight lead you punch "through" your target. The jab is more to create a "whiplash" effect. That's basically the difference.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328049 - 03/13/07 12:57 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
Tom2199 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 834
Loc: England
I actually figured out the difference between these 2 while opening the post, got me thinking about the jab

I use the jab a lot because of my reach and iv landed punches a number of times to the neck mostly with hooks though, doesn't matter who you are you cannot defend yourself perfectly 100% of the time.

If your catching him a lot with the jab and want to bully him a bit or show your strength go in with the left straight hey presto a bit more power behind the shot, like you say not as quick but more likely to slip straight through the guard as well.

Also double and triple those jabs up, or jab then left straight, left straight etc... miss the first time then push straight through with the second and rock his head right back.
_________________________
Vet

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#328050 - 03/13/07 01:01 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
Umbra_777 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/03/06
Posts: 148
Quote:

Larry Holmes knocked people out with a lead straight. Don't confuse the lead straight with a jab. The mechanics are similar but totally different usage.

The lead straight looks like a jab, but is more akin to the cross. Basically, it's a straight punch delivered with force that is supposed to ko people like a cross. It's not fast as the jab but more powerful, and it's not powerful like the cross but faster.

That's a little Muay Thai for ya

Chen, thanks for doing this for me, I'm not so good on the outside and there's no way I'd be able to write like that, thanks man.

John, thanks for the extra info, the backfist has been a powerful tool in my arsenal but I rarely use them as my instincts tells me to either go for the jab or body hook, but it's just me that need more training.

Anyone got any questions?

-Taison out



I propose the next "Lets Go Technical" be the lead straight because I am not sure what you mean. (I thought a straight punch was the one they do in Karate.)

-Umbra

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#328051 - 03/13/07 02:16 PM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Umbra_777]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Can do if Taison gives the word.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#328052 - 03/14/07 12:14 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Chen Zen]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Go ahead if you want to, I'm only here to facilitate communication but don't exhausts all the topics.

You know, give it some time. But I'm thinking about discussing the lead straight next time. It's one of my "gooder" punches I've got.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328053 - 03/14/07 01:53 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
By all means then jk
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

Top
#328054 - 03/14/07 01:55 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Chen Zen]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
Feel free to start it if you want, I'll just add info.

-Taison out (aka lazy [censored])
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

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#328055 - 03/14/07 02:00 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
See now Im confused. are you doing it or am I? cause I dont mind either way.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

Top
#328056 - 03/14/07 02:10 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Chen Zen]
Taison Offline
The Forum Dragon
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/06/05
Posts: 3629
Loc: BKK, Thailand
You're confused? Me too.

Ok, you can start it.

-Taison out
_________________________
I got two fists.. Don't make me use my head as well!

Top
#328057 - 03/14/07 02:16 AM Re: Lets Go Technical Part 5 [Re: Taison]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Ok got it!
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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