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#315232 - 02/08/08 01:35 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: ITFunity]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Quote:

Quote:

ITFunity, our WTF flag comes directly from the WTF in Korea and was brought back by one of our students upon his visit there.




How did the student get it? Did they buy it in the Kukkiwon building? Did they have to show documentation that they were a member of an WTF NGB, as individuals can not be members of the WTF, only nations can be. Did they buy it at the authorized TKD stores in the area or at the TKD museium there?

I think you are missing my point. I am not talking about buying an official trademark flag made under copyright protections vs a bootleg knock off counterfit one. WTF flags are easy to come by, just like soccer jerseys, official ones & knock offs as well. ITF flags are very hard to come by & one probably would not hang one in their school, unless they were ITF. Ycan be both an individual member of the ITF, as well as a registered school.

So the fact that one has or hangs a WTF flag in their school, regardless of its sourse, is not a good indicator of its official status with the WTF or its member nations.




I don't know all of the details but I will give you what I know. The gentleman is a firefighter and had gone down to South Korea as there is a division that competes and this is something he is very interested in. He was given a tour of the WTF facility and where he got the flag from, don't know any other particulars. Also a WTF Korean fighter also traded him track uniforms. The flag then was brought back as a gift and given to our Instructor and it proudly hangs on our wall beside the Korean Flag and the Canadian Flag.
_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#315233 - 02/08/08 01:42 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: ITFunity]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Quote:

Quote:

As for one-steps, I wasn't saying they should be the same but at standardization would be a good idea, you can at least agree with that coming from an ITF school.




No way, no how, never!
The ITF 1 steps are not standardized. The way they start is. For example, both attacker & defender stand i/f/o each other, in a pararell ready stance, at a distance pre-determined by the attacker, depending on the attack to be used. The attack is done from this position, without going back into a walking stance with low block & attacks with any & all attacks are allowed, not just a punch with the right forefist. You can only do 1 attack & 1 counterattack. There are examples of this in the Encylopedia, but they are just that. Our 1 steps are a SD drill, where the attacker must try to hit the defender, with all available attacks. In the case of all step sparring, 1, 2 & 3 steps, as a student advances, the attacks should be more spontaneous & realistic.




We differ on this then. I feel that if you are under one banner then there should be a standardization of what is taught from one school to the next so that when tested you can test anywhere or train anywhere; much like the ITF can.

Our one-steps the two stand across from each other with one attacking and one defending. The defender uses multiple defenses starting with easy ones such as block/striking the punch while at the same time punching them in the jaw. The higher you get the more intense they get including sweeping, tripping, takedowns, arm breaks, knees, etc. Number 3 would be a block/strike to the attacker's punching arm, while punching them in the jaw, then grabbing the wrist, stepping into the opponent so your hips are parallel, then pull wrist and sweep with your leg; when they hit the ground you turn the arm so their elbow is against your knee to simulate a break of the arm and then you punch them again in the face. At colored belt there are 9. At 1st Dan then you learn 26 self defense moves, at 2nd Dan you learn more and so on.

The attacker is not just throwing their arm out but are trying to punch the defender in the jaw and is stressed the higher you get up. If you don't move then you get hit and you learn really fast.

All one-steps are for self defense.
_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#315234 - 02/08/08 02:40 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: badachagi]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

I think it would make more sense for the *Kukkiwon* and ITF to be in talks for merger, as those are the two analogous organizations for their particular style of TKD.




No way that will happen before ITF & WTF work something out!


Quote:

This is just my personal speculation, but I don't think the WTF has a whole lot to gain by "merging" with ITF, at least in regards to its status as the world governing body for sport TKD competition. It's already acheived all of that w/out the ITF.
If anything, I would think that merger talks would be more about bringing WTF and ITF sparring competition rules to be more in sync so as to officially open up the possibility of more ITF players competing in WTF competitions. Also, the politics of the art are very much wrapped up in the politices of NK and SK, so perhaps these merger talks are really a way for both countries, on a very vey small level, bto begin to work collaboratively on a common goal.




Absolutely!

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#315235 - 02/08/08 02:43 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: badachagi]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

My personal thoughts: As a Korean-born American, I would love to see NK and SK reunification. While I am a KKW TKD practitioner for 20+ years, and I love sport TKD competition, I have much respect for Chang Hon practitioners, and I have even learned several of the ITF forms. I think the ITF forms are actually pretty cool looking, but I'll be honest and say I'm not such a big fan of the sine-wave thing. Assuming the rules can be worked out to be agreeable to both organizations, I think having large masses of ITF fighters in WTF competitions can only improve the quality of TKD competition fighting./quote]

Well even a high ranking official in the WTF feels the same way about the ITF Tuls. Bet I could change your mind if I taught you SW!

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#315236 - 02/08/08 02:45 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: Dereck]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

I don't know all of the details but I will give you what I know.




Please do so Dereck, as both of us Sir, can learn something. Thanks

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#315237 - 02/08/08 02:54 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: Dereck]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Quote:

We differ on this then. I feel that if you are under one banner then there should be a standardization of what is taught from one school to the next so that when tested you can test anywhere or train anywhere; much like the ITF can.
Our one-steps the two stand across from each other with one attacking and one defending. The defender uses multiple defenses starting with easy ones such as block/striking the punch while at the same time punching them in the jaw. The higher you get the more intense they get including sweeping, tripping, takedowns, arm breaks, knees, etc. Number 3 would be a block/strike to the attacker's punching arm, while punching them in the jaw, then grabbing the wrist, stepping into the opponent so your hips are parallel, then pull wrist and sweep with your leg; when they hit the ground you turn the arm so their elbow is against your knee to simulate a break of the arm and then you punch them again in the face. At colored belt there are 9. At 1st Dan then you learn 26 self defense moves, at 2nd Dan you learn more and so on.
The attacker is not just throwing their arm out but are trying to punch the defender in the jaw and is stressed the higher you get up. If you don't move then you get hit and you learn really fast. All one-steps are for self defense.




Yes under standarization, most things are taught the same. How they are applied in actual situations depends on who is attacking, how they are attacking, the enviornment of where the attack takes place & of course, who is defending. No disrespect intended, but what you seem to be describing is more like a SD drill that actually be better described as a MA routine, as it appears that one player does an attack, which seems limited to a punch, then "strikes a pose". many would argue, this can actually be counterproductive from a SD standpoint.

It is imperative for one to know the purpose of what they are doing. The purpose of our 1 step sparring appears different from yours. So looking at the 2nd training secret of TKD, what is your, or your school's or organization purpose for 1 step sparring?

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#315238 - 02/08/08 03:27 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: ITFunity]
von1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 260
only our sparing is sports oriented it is another tool for most all of the participants, our other training incorporates methods to put everything together for realistic application and/or self defence including hand techniques.

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#315239 - 02/08/08 03:39 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: ITFunity]
Dereck Offline
Prolific

Registered: 10/04/04
Posts: 10413
Loc: Great White North
Quote:

It is imperative for one to know the purpose of what they are doing. The purpose of our 1 step sparring appears different from yours. So looking at the 2nd training secret of TKD, what is your, or your school's or organization purpose for 1 step sparring?




There are many things but first it must be understood that though these are set drills it is not meant to mimic like a pattern; not to mention that each individual is different in size shape and how they do their techniques to a certain degree.

As an attacker you must strike for the jaw. You must strike with force and speed to catch the defender off guard. Plus your must have good falling techniques whether your are swept and land on your side, pulled forward to the ground, or tripped. Grant it these are self defense techniques and most of the learning is on the defense side but the attacker must be ready for all that is going to happen to them. They will be hit and will be hit hard. At blue belt and up it is mandatory to actually strike the person and this helps you to understand impact and dealing with being hit.

As the defender you have to get off centre line or you will be hit in the jaw/face. You have to react quickly to the punch to and strike it as we are taught there is no such thing as blocks, we strike and strike hard and the more advanced the more it hurts but you expect it. There is so much that goes on and how you react and it gives your different ideas of what can be done in a situations similar to this. Knees, elbows, joint breaking, sweeps, trips, pulling your opponent off balance, striking vital areas and the such. I consider these highly useful techniques and my falling skills have sky rocketed because of these and have been commented on by other schools as having excellent falling techniques. Plus you have timing, distance and many other aspects that are vital. One-steps are more beneficial then any pattern in my opinion as it actually applying techniques against somebody.
_________________________
"IF I COME ... I'M BRINGING THE PAIN WITH ME"

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#315240 - 02/08/08 10:09 PM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: Dereck]
ITFunity Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/15/06
Posts: 2053
Yes it sounds like you have given me an good explanation on how you do 1 steps. However, I see don't know what the purpose is. I also think that you describe a tough or hard use of techniques, which I think is good. But again, please tell me what the purpose of 1 steps are? Why do you do them? Thanks

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#315241 - 02/09/08 10:05 AM Re: Does any one here train in WTF Tae Kwon Do [Re: Dereck]
von1 Offline
Member

Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 260
Dereck


I second badagachagi, the WTF does not issue dan certs.

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