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#313439 - 01/08/07 03:48 PM Ready Position Interpretation
Ads Offline
Member

Registered: 01/02/07
Posts: 37
Any thoughts on the ready position taken before starting a pattern. Studying TKD the first pattern we learn is Chon-Ji, which starts with arms out-stretched at waist level. This is easily interpretated is a double punch to the stomach area from a double lapel grab, or maybe JUST a ready position! Any ideas from your patterns?

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#313440 - 01/08/07 08:21 PM Re: Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ads]
BrianS Offline
Higher rank than you
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 5959
Loc: Northwest Arkansas
If you want to make some interpretations and put them into practice the move can become practical OR it can just mean ready,either way wouldn't be wrong.

My own interpretations would be defense against wrist grabs or a push.
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#313441 - 01/09/07 01:17 PM Re: Ready Position Interpretation [Re: BrianS]
Ads Offline
Member

Registered: 01/02/07
Posts: 37
I was hoping for interpretations from all patterns and styles. I have found all sorts of uses for the various ready positions and some are useful, some are not so. Studying TKD I only know of these patterns but all MA patterns must start from some stance, so what do these mean? Maybe a description of a patterns start with an interpretation.

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#313442 - 01/09/07 02:28 PM Re: Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ads]
student_of_life Offline
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Registered: 10/12/05
Posts: 1032
Loc: Newfoundland, Canada
the ready position for kata or forms will varry from style to style, also different kata in any style could have different ready positions.

the most widely used in karate and tkd forms is the standard feet shoulder with apart with the hands either down by the sides in fists or slightly out infront of the body.

as i was tought one interpretation is that a self defence encounter may begin with your hands in a non combative position, there for its usefull to train how to "enter" with a technique from and reletivly unagressive position.

that being said, many dan rank kata in my style of karate have different starting positions, like bassai dai, jion, and empi. there uses more or less could be aimed at begining a fight by breaking an opponenetsgrip on you and applying a kind of wrist or arm lock. thats just one way. for example the one application to the oppening of bassai dai could be that your opponent has grabed your wrists and is temporarly holding your right hand infront of your body. hence the closed hand position, from there your left hand could be sed to hold his hand on your arm as you apply a wrist lock, or used as extra leverage to pry it out of his grip.

for the standard begining with feet shoulder witdth apart andhands either in front of you or at yor sides, well the application of the position will varry depending on what the next move is. for example in heian shodan, from the begining position the first downward block could be a takedown,armlock or kidney strike. in heian nidan, it could be a defence against a bear hug. the static position by its self dosen't offer much potential on its own, but followed up or preceded by other movements the application become endless.

yours in life
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#313443 - 01/09/07 04:16 PM Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ads]
Ronin1966 Offline
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Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3116
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Ads:

A double stomach punch, FROM a lapel grab??? Pretty please explain this more.... my lapels are being grabbed and I am somehow hitting you in the stomach from that ~victim~ position??? Look forward to hearing this more, cannot fathom how that works...

Okinawan kata often (IMHE) have a fist covered position (sternum height) which rolls downward (ie remaining covered the entire distance) and then opens and the hands proceed to both sides of the body.

That rolling motion demonstrates a simple wrist lock,

Jeff

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#313444 - 01/10/07 02:10 PM Re: Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ronin1966]
Ads Offline
Member

Registered: 01/02/07
Posts: 37
Ok, I did a quick search to find a picture (rather than taking one of myself). I have tried it many times and a downward double fist strike into this area is enough to make the opponent let go, or at least distract them for the next technique. Another alternatative to this basic movement is for someone coming in for a rugby type tackle and striking down into their head. Or, as I found out while experimenting this move with my girlfriend (whos nearly 1 foot shorter) its the perfect position for a strike to the meat and veg. Perhaps!

http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl...%3Doff%26sa%3DN

Thanks for the other comments, thats the sort of info im looking for.

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#313445 - 01/11/07 09:12 AM Re: Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ads]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3116
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Ads:

Hummmmngh, thank you for the picture! Much clearer now...What direction are these punches again? Looks like intimate point blank range, and a very straight line at that, if I understood your starting position correctly??? (Did I?) How do you get body weight into the technique given the minimal/negative range? (ie hands starting below the waist ending up essentially plainer <sp.?> 4-6 inches off your torso)

Does this work if/when lifted-raised off ones feet?

<<rugby type tackle and striking down into their head.

Yikes... awfully hard boney surface to be punching . I might possibly see the two hands thrust FORWARD sufficently, preventing the completion of a tackle, but your foot positioning is completely unsustainable for that maneuver to be effective.

<<Or, as I found out while experimenting this move with my girlfriend

A wise man....

<<Thanks for the other comments, thats the sort of info im looking for.

Happy to help. Since we are on the topic... do your feet move OR have a particular position as your hands do ???

Jeff

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#313446 - 01/11/07 02:21 PM Re: Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ronin1966]
Ads Offline
Member

Registered: 01/02/07
Posts: 37
Move 2 in this pattern (or technically move 2) in turning left 90degrees into a down block which I'd use as a throw following the first strike. In regards to power generation; starting with arms by side and snapping them out creates enough power when practiced hundreds of times. Buy hey, this is just 1 interpretation of the opening move which the beginner learns.
The point I was trying to make starting this thread was that the opening stances gets overlooked as anything effective, when they shouldnt.

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#313447 - 01/11/07 05:34 PM Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ads]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3116
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Ads:

<<Move 2

The kata (Okinawan lineage) I possess all contain the 100% identical opening. Functional by itself with no adjunct movements attached/required. All patterns contain the same initial hand gesture/position, regardless of their respective movement #2 afterwards...

Are your patterns different in this regard, one piece attached to a larger sequence??? The Okinawan and chinese derived arts seem self-contained for lack of a better terminology?

<<arms by side and snapping them out creates enough power when practiced hundreds of times.

Cannot see it myself but... wouldn't be the last time I missed something. So I did not misunderstand anything, The hands go from hanging by ones side (alebt stffly so) to being in front of ourselves as if pushing a shopping cart with fists...

<<the opening stances gets overlooked

Or as being solely symbolic summarily without function It is insanity to seek no function...

Jeff

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#313448 - 01/12/07 01:29 AM Re: Ready Position Interpretation [Re: Ronin1966]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Is there always some secretive interpretation? Cant ready position just mean "ready"? Why does it have to be more than that? There are so many other things of greater value to explore.
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