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#298493 - 11/01/06 10:38 PM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: cxt]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Cxt,
In response I would say, Why shouldnt you?

At its very core, every art suggests that its way of defense is the best to be offered. If you dont believe your training to be the best you shouldnt be doing it. Thats not directed at you, but to anyone in general. If someone says that they think there way is better and that they want to see if that is the case, why not oblige then? If you training is better, shouldnt you win, showing the other man what he is doing wrong in the process? To me it seems like alot of the TMA guys dont do this because they are afraid to have there art exposed as anything other than superior. MMA guys challenge constantly, maybe not to outsiders but certainly within the gym, as it is the best way to test one's skills.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#298494 - 11/01/06 11:28 PM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: Chen Zen]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
Hmm, and all this time I thought that it was an individual who made the art, not the other way around. So if Ray Lewis challenged you to a fight and beat you, you would or should begin training to be an All Pro linebacker so you can defend yourself?

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#298495 - 11/01/06 11:32 PM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: medulanet]
IExcalibui2 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 05/20/06
Posts: 961
Loc: New York City
more like find out how Ray Lewis beat you in the fight and improve yourself in that manner. If he tackled you to the ground and then started to ground & pound then obviously thats something that you need to pick up on, not his occupation...unless he fights be tackling people constantly.

Well I would say the MMA guys that would challenge are guys who fight in MMA competitions or something similar, as they would carry that fighter mentality with them. I doubt a humble and quiet MMA man would go up to a kungfu master and challenge him, its out of character.
_________________________
"you're going to work till you wish you were dead and then keep going.." -Sgt Slaughter

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#298496 - 11/01/06 11:43 PM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: IExcalibui2]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
Umm, have you ever played ball? He would probably just knock you out with his forearm as if he was trying to stand you up and take on your block. Or maybe he would just body slam you on the concrete head first. Look man, I'm talking about attributes and aggression, not any MMA stuff you have trained. Ray Lewis doesn't need martial arts. Therefore, his pro football is enough to beat most people because of AA, attributes and aggression. But that doesn't mean everyone taking roids and learning how to hit is the answer. So just because someone beats you does not mean his training is NECESSARILY going to make you better.

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#298497 - 11/02/06 12:10 AM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: medulanet]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Im not implying that it would. However, i believe it would force you to take a hard, unbiased look at what you are doing and where you need improvement.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#298498 - 11/02/06 12:35 AM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: Chen Zen]
medulanet Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
Yes, looking at what you do critically to continually improve is a good thing. I do this in my own art regardless of anyone challenging me. Maybe you are right and those who do not do need to be challenged and have some sense knocked into them.

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#298499 - 11/02/06 04:22 AM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: medulanet]
billyg Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 8
Quote:

Umm, have you ever played ball? He would probably just knock you out with his forearm as if he was trying to stand you up and take on your block. Or maybe he would just body slam you on the concrete head first. Look man, I'm talking about attributes and aggression, not any MMA stuff you have trained. Ray Lewis doesn't need martial arts. Therefore, his pro football is enough to beat most people because of AA, attributes and aggression. But that doesn't mean everyone taking roids and learning how to hit is the answer. So just because someone beats you does not mean his training is NECESSARILY going to make you better.



Ray Lewis might not need martial arts but surely the techniques he would use in a fight should have counters somewhere in the T.M.A world? I think if a pro footballer could beat a trained fighter then the trained fighter isnt that well trained and should consider training the same way as the person who beat him.

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#298500 - 11/02/06 07:28 AM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: billyg]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Lets not forget what this is about.

It's a simple challenge to fight. That doesn't mean to the death or even severe injury. Whatever people agree to is acceptable don't you think?

I still don't think there is a big deal about accepting a challenge to fight another person from another discipline or even the same discipline. If two able-bodied and willing adults enjoy the contact and competition, there should be nothing to stop them - providing that there is an agreed upon structure to the challenge (rules, or lack thereof, and refs or what-have-you).

Nothing STUPID like a duel with weapons for Christ's sake. There ARE a lot of idiots out there and some are reading this probably.

If one person doesn't accept a challenge from another, I don't see that as a big deal either. It doesn't mean you're a coward. It could simply mean that you choose not to fight. Maybe the challenger is an idiot with an ego problem and you'd rather not even get involved. That's totally understandable.

People get into martial arts training for a variety of reasons. Not every one of us is "hard-core". You don't have to be to enjoy what training has to offer.

Almost EVERYONE trains for some measure of self-defense skill however. I would only hope that those who ARE training for self-defense, do engage in some manner of hard sparring occasionally so as to fully understand what fighting is like. I believe that's only common sense.

Challenges aren't necessary in order to immerse yourself in harder training however. So long as you do so at least occasionally within your own schools/gym should be sufficient.

That said, stepping out against other stylists for those willing to do so is a great learning experience that can't be simulated any other way.

At the end of the day, its up to the individual.


-John

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#298501 - 11/02/06 08:27 AM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: JKogas]
Eveal Offline
the freshmaker

Registered: 10/15/04
Posts: 303
I agree with John here. Alot of martial artist are scared to get there butts handed to them so they can learn also alot of so called "masters" get beat in matter of seconds because they never train to handle full out aggression from an opponent. They are simply comforable being the top dawg of their "dojo" and are scared to come down off their pedestal to be showed where their weakness are.

Why do you think MT/boxing and BJJ or wrestling is the major styles of MMA. It is because these back grounds are hardcore aggressive styles pound for pound. So to me I think challenge matches are a great thing due to circumstance. Things should be looked at:

1: Don't challenge me during my class disrupting it.

2: I will find some information/background about the challenger. Think about an xcon newly released wanting to test out some new muscle he packed on in the slammer.....

3: Like John said it should be controled structured and have witnesses just incase also waivers are a must.

Brandon
_________________________
Be "Water" my friend!

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#298502 - 11/02/06 12:07 PM Re: Challenging in MMA [Re: migo]
cxt Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 09/11/03
Posts: 5823
Loc: USA
migo

To bad there is not a "heavy handed sarcasm icon" sounds like I need one here because you missed my point utterly.

I can "challange" Chick Liddel all I want---he not going to do anything but laugh.

So if the "pros" DON'T take challanges from every yahoo that wanders near them---why "should" anyone else??
_________________________
I did battle with ignorance today.......and ignorance won. Huey.

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