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#295726 - 10/23/06 03:46 PM Yamane-ryu Bo katas
aoishi Offline
Member

Registered: 10/05/05
Posts: 123
Loc: Massachusetts
Does anyone know if there are any Yamane-ryu Bo katas that can be seen or downloaded on-line?

Thanks!

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#295727 - 10/23/06 08:45 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: aoishi]
Chatan1979 Offline
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Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 338
Loc: Mahomet , Illinois
Choun No kun can be found on YouTube.com. Just do a search.
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#295728 - 10/23/06 09:58 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
aoishi Offline
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Registered: 10/05/05
Posts: 123
Loc: Massachusetts
I just searched and found none.

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#295729 - 10/23/06 10:12 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: aoishi]
Chatan1979 Offline
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Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 338
Loc: Mahomet , Illinois
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7409114150011820936&q=kobudo

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6896457208527856597&q=kata

while the second video is listed as a goju system, Choun No Kun was created by Chinen, the founder of Yamani Ryu Kobudo
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#295730 - 10/23/06 10:19 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
Chen Zen Offline
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Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
I dont know much about Kubudo, but are the demos and kata always done so slow? From a technical standpoint it looked ok other than the foot stabbing movements and low line attacks.
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#295731 - 10/23/06 10:35 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chen Zen]
Chatan1979 Offline
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Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 338
Loc: Mahomet , Illinois
Many Bo kata contain foot stabbing or geden tsuki movements. they are actually very very effective. For an experiment, try tapping the top of your foot with a bo. It doesnt feel too good. Also alot of low thrusts are followed by a upward flick of the bo which indicates a thrust between the legs of the opponent followed by a groin shot .
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#295732 - 10/23/06 10:45 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
Chen Zen Offline
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Registered: 02/09/03
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Loc: Ms
I know it would be rather unpleasant and the flick is a decent way to cover your tracks but to me it is too "iffy." It would seem to me that someones moving foot would be a rather hard target to hit under pressure. Also it would seem to me that your upper gate is very poorly protected at this time. If the opponent had a stick the could hit you hard in the face while you try to stab the foot.
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#295733 - 10/23/06 10:56 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chen Zen]
Chatan1979 Offline
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Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 338
Loc: Mahomet , Illinois
Keep in mind that Weapon kata are open to interpretation just as much as empty handed kata. While some people only view weapon bunkai as weapon vs weapon, others may view it as weapon vs empty hand or some other combination. You also need to take into consideration the movements leading up to the low thrust. It is very possibe, ( and I am not looking at the video right now , but I am quite familiar with it) , that the moves leading up to the low thrust lead the opponent into leaving himself open down low.
Also, in many cases a low thrust can be seen as a preparation for a sand flick. Many okinawan kata are interpreted to be taking place on a beach. Sunakake is the technique of using a bo, or eku to flick sand into the face of your opponent. Choun no Kun and many other bo kata contain this move in some form or another. While the practicality may not seem immediately evident to one person, it is quite apparent to someone else.


Edited by Chatan1979 (10/23/06 10:57 PM)
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#295734 - 10/24/06 12:03 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
aoishi Offline
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Registered: 10/05/05
Posts: 123
Loc: Massachusetts
Thanks for helping with those.
I am a complete novice at Bo and still working on the first kata and I don't even know what it is called! But I do know it is Yamane-ryu. I did not see the kata among any of the ones there.
The first move of it is cat stance, right foot forward with bottom of bo forward (as if striking shin area?).

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#295735 - 10/24/06 08:49 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
Chen Zen Offline
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Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Wouldnt it be easier to "scoop" the sand with your foot? To me its all about simplicity while keeping the tightest defense possible. As far as striking someone who is low or foced to go low, I would use something a little more broad like slapping the stick across him rather than poking him with it.
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#295736 - 10/24/06 09:52 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chen Zen]
Chatan1979 Offline
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Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 338
Loc: Mahomet , Illinois
True that a broader strike may be more accurate on a large target. But just like there is a diference in penetration between a regular fist and a one knuckle strike, the purpose is in penetration. You will have pain on a much deeper scale with a more precise strike with a small weapon, like the tip of a bo, or the foreknuckle of your fist.
And yes , many kata do contain sand flickng with the feet. But you need to understand also that some bo katas can be done with an Eku ( oar). the paddle of the oar works tremendously in this manner.
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#295737 - 10/24/06 11:13 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
Chen Zen Offline
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Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
I agree that you do want that penetration. I stab with a bo just not the feet. I lean more towards the chest or head.I would stab the foot with a sai, but not in the sense that most people just thought of. As for the oar or paddle, would that not change the physics of the movements since the weapon is no longer balanced like a bo? Also i could see trapping the foot or slapping it being much easier with something narrow in thickness but broad in width like a paddle.
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Lao Tzu

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#295738 - 10/24/06 11:18 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chen Zen]
Chatan1979 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 338
Loc: Mahomet , Illinois
Actually a well made Eku (oar), not just a regular canoe oar, will have very good balance. An oar is sometimes called the advanced bo because it still has all the elements of a bo, but with the paddle yoo have a broader surface, but you can also cut with the edge. I have seen video of bamboo tameshira wari with the oar. Where the eku cut right through the wood like a blade. You work with what you have.
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#295739 - 10/24/06 11:44 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
medulanet Offline
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Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 2142
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona USA
Yamani? The second kata looks nothing like the Yamani Ryu I have been exposed to. Matsubayashi Ryu has a close link to the Yamani Ryu style of bojutsu and that kata may have sequence and basic techniques similar to a kata by Chinen, but it bears no resemblance to Yamani Ryu. The other two are sai and tonfa and I believe Toshiro Oshiro was the one who created them as he tried to apply principles of Yamani Ryu Bojutsu to the other okinwan weapons, but classicaly there was only bojutsu in Yamani Ryu.

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#295740 - 10/25/06 12:03 AM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
So instead of stabbing or trapping the foot I could cut off the toes? Sounds great!
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"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#295741 - 10/25/06 04:55 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chen Zen]
CVV Offline
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Registered: 08/06/04
Posts: 605
Loc: Belgium
The Chuon no kon resembles the Matayoshi form, but not an exact version. It is simplified/modified in several area's. Maybe it's from another school with the same roots as Matayoshi's version or a modified version for own use.

As for stabbing the foot with the bo, it's a very common technique in bo an quite suprising when applied to you. There is almost no body movement although the bo thusts about 100cm forward.

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#295742 - 10/26/06 12:13 AM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: CVV]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
I admit, I would be amazed if it hit.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#295743 - 10/26/06 07:28 AM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chen Zen]
Chatan1979 Offline
Member

Registered: 03/21/05
Posts: 338
Loc: Mahomet , Illinois
Watch the video clip here.
http://www.wonder-okinawa.jp/023/eng/013/004/index.html

And CVV, I am aware of the Matyoshi version of Choun no Kun. In fact we practice the Matayoshi, and the Yamani version.
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#295744 - 10/26/06 10:19 PM Re: Yamane-ryu Bo katas [Re: Chatan1979]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Nice stuff
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