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#293489 - 07/09/08 05:51 PM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: MattJ]
Ames Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 1117
Good call Matt. I've found the same thing. The footwork in Aikido has saved me numerous times.

I also will echo eyrie's comment that if you are trying to apply technique rather than principle you're not really trying to apply 'Aikido' at all. However, that being said, I have applied variations of techniques (mostly ikkyo and irimi nage) in live grappling situations--but I wasn't 'trying' to do Aikido, the oppurtunity just presented itself and I took it.

--Chris
_________________________
"Seek not to follow in the footsteps of the men of old; seek what they sought."
--Basho

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#293490 - 07/09/08 08:49 PM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: Ames]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10813
Loc: North Carolina
2 years later and guess what? My opinion hasn't changed ANY. Wow!

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#293491 - 03/03/09 08:04 PM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: JKogas]
KungFu2U Offline
Banned Troll

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 3
Aikido fails of the basic burden of proof, i.e. they don't substantiate their claims, that it's as effective in self-defense as MMA; and therefore the claim must be taken as false.

Likewise, the problem with the "well it's not meant for use against MMA," also fails because either this means that it's simply better to train in MMA, or that Aikido is better on the street but not in competitive testing (in which case then they haven't substantiated that claim either).

So basically their argument can't be accepted, because they haven't met their burden of proof (and anecdotes are not proof).

As for Aikido technique, it can usually be very much simplified under technical fighting, while the Aikido-mysticism about "harmony" and "energy" is simply more confusing than constructive, compared to terms like "momentum" and "relative motion." I can usually teach someone more in 10 minutes of technical fighting, than 10 years of traditional methods.

However if you want to start a cult, to cash in on gullible students who spend a lot of money because they saw Seagal-movies-- rather than condemning them/him as the anathema that they are, to your purported philosophy of "non-violence--" then Aikido is great for psyching out suckers who'll believe anything, and don't mind dogmatic hypocrisy as well as psychadelic brainwashing... or playing Russian Roulette with their lives in self-defense situations


Edited by KungFu2U (03/03/09 08:21 PM)

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#293492 - 03/04/09 11:00 AM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: KungFu2U]
Ames Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 1117
Quote:

So basically their argument can't be accepted, because they haven't met their burden of proof (and anecdotes are not proof).





Your argument(s) can't accepted, not "theirs". It's you who have answered 'for Aikido'.

Quote:

Likewise, the problem with the "well it's not meant for use against MMA," also fails because either this means that it's simply better to train in MMA, or that Aikido is better on the street but not in competitive testing (in which case then they haven't substantiated that claim either).





Neither of these claims is accurate.

Quote:

As for Aikido technique, it can usually be very much simplified under technical fighting, while the Aikido-mysticism about "harmony" and "energy" is simply more confusing than constructive, compared to terms like "momentum" and "relative motion."




Terms like "momentum" and "relative motion" also have to be defined for many. Further, the terms would really only help you with roughly 10% of any Aikido technique. There is more going on than momentum or relative motion, and your attempt at labeling the techniques as this would only block progress towards figuring out what else is going on.

Quote:

I can usually teach someone more in 10 minutes of technical fighting, than 10 years of traditional methods.





"More" as in what? More as in how to use momentum? Great, now what about all the other stuff going on?

Before you ask me "what stuff"? Please understand that I am PURPOSELY not stating it, because I want YOU to tell me, after all you can teach me more about Aikido in 10 minutes than my Sensei could in 10 years right? So how about you enlighten me as to what else is happening in the techniques, as well as providing clear descriptions of how it works?

Quote:

However if you want to start a cult, to cash in on gullible students who spend a lot of money because they saw Seagal-movies-- rather than condemning them/him as the anathema that they are, to your purported philosophy of "non-violence--" then Aikido is great for psyching out suckers who'll believe anything, and don't mind dogmatic hypocrisy as well as psychadelic brainwashing... or playing Russian Roulette with their lives in self-defense situations




Thanks for the info, troll. Now tell me, in what way is Aikido a "cult". And what the hell do you mean by "psychadelic brainwashing". I suggest you sign up for an 'Introduction to Critical Thinking' class at your local community college, before you post your drivel on here.

Do enlighten me as to what is happening in Aikido techniques, as well as describing the physical process in scientific terms though.

--Chris
_________________________
"Seek not to follow in the footsteps of the men of old; seek what they sought."
--Basho

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#293493 - 03/04/09 11:20 PM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: Ames]
KungFu2U Offline
Banned Troll

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 3
This proves my point about the irrational nature of Aikido mindset, similar to saying that pro wrestling is fake: methinks thou doth protest too much to believe the protesting.

Quote:

Thanks for the info, troll.



Actually trolls are the ones who can't handle intelligent dissenters.


Edited by KungFu2U (03/04/09 11:38 PM)

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#293494 - 03/05/09 07:59 AM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: KungFu2U]
iaibear Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/24/05
Posts: 1304
Loc: upstate New York
Bingo!

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#293495 - 03/05/09 12:11 PM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: KungFu2U]
Ames Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 1117
Quote:

Actually trolls are the ones who can't handle intelligent dissenters.




Actually, I think I handled you just fine. Obviously you have no idea of what Aikido even is, despite saying you could teach someone it in "10 minutes." Am I wrong? Great. Tell me the principles at work in an Aikido technique, and the physics involved.

Also, your comment that Aikido students are the product of "psychodelic brainwashing" is so far from any thing like "intelligent dissent", its truly not even funny.

One more chance to clarify the argogant ignorance of your first post, or you will be banned. It's up to you smart guy.

--Chris
_________________________
"Seek not to follow in the footsteps of the men of old; seek what they sought."
--Basho

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#293496 - 03/05/09 02:06 PM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: Ames]
KungFu2U Offline
Banned Troll

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 3
Warned you, now you're banned.

Go find another forum to display your stupidity.

-Chris


Edited by Ames (03/05/09 02:39 PM)

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#293497 - 03/05/09 03:19 PM Re: Aikido in MMA [Re: KungFu2U]
Ames Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 1117
With that out of the way, I'm goint to what I probably should have done awhile ago and lock this thread, as I don't see it going any further.

As always, if you have something you really, really want to add, p.m. and we can discuss it being opened again.

--Chris
_________________________
"Seek not to follow in the footsteps of the men of old; seek what they sought."
--Basho

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