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#292158 - 10/12/06 09:27 AM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: senseihonor]
BulldogTKD Offline
Member

Registered: 05/11/05
Posts: 294
I have seen this first hand once and can understand some situations. We had testing and one of the senior instructors was up in the viewing area eating or she just finished eating and the school owner called her down to ether demo a form or do her form with a another student as a shadow, and she just shook her head no! So I can see how things can happen.

I guess I think the student you refer to should not have even made it that far in rank. Also, it makes me wonder why she is even there and is another case of coddling and hand holding, of compromising the Martial Arts? I often wonder why attitudes like this go un checked. This isnít a control thing for me but a respect thing. If a student acts like this there is a break down in communication some ware.

Martial Arts is a journey, a way of life, not just a thing too do or a place too go. As an instructor your job is to help mold a student and to help them on there journey and help them develop themselves but not be a babysitter. On the students part, there job is to be a receptor and to welcome the guidance of the instructor. If one doesnít like the guidance of the instructor then it is time to leave and to find someone that you want to help you on you journey.

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#292159 - 10/12/06 01:28 PM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: BulldogTKD]
harlan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 07/31/04
Posts: 6665
Loc: Amherst, MA
Interesting discussion...and timely. Up until last night, I've never considered saying 'no' to instruction. Last night I did. I did so with respect, and some humour...but I was definitely trying to 'get out of it'.

Guess what? I still had to do the technique.

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#292160 - 10/12/06 02:25 PM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: harlan]
Ed_Morris Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 11/04/05
Posts: 6772
that'll learn ya!

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#292161 - 10/13/06 03:19 PM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: harlan]
senseihonor Offline
Member

Registered: 09/09/06
Posts: 62
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Like you, I had never said "no" to a sensei before. It just didn't occurr to me that this was a possible way out.

However, I injured myself fairly badly this Spring and had no choice about what I could/could not do in class. In this case, I hobbled into the dojo & told my Sensei before the warm-up what I was not able to do. He ignored my limitations (that's my Sensei for ya' ) and expected me to keep up with everyone. If he asked me why I wasn't doing a particular technique, I had to say: "I can't because of my injury." My Sensei didn't give me the "look" of disapproval, nor was he overly sympathetic, but this is an example of saying "no", with a justifiable reason (in my mind anyway!) behind it.

Now I have to make sure I don't abuse that little excuse if I'm asked to do something I don't want to...

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#292162 - 10/14/06 10:31 AM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: senseihonor]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3116
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Senseihonor:

<<Well said.

<quiet self-amused laughter> Once in a ~blue moon~ I get something right.... every so often .

Here IS a perfect opportunity to speak with your instructor DIRECTLY and explain you misgivings... ask him/her what your role SHOULD be, and explain what you wanted to do in that situation....

Its the perfect time for communication
Jeff

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#292163 - 10/14/06 09:21 PM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: Ronin1966]
senseihonor Offline
Member

Registered: 09/09/06
Posts: 62
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Quote:


Here IS a perfect opportunity to speak with your instructor DIRECTLY and explain you misgivings... ask him/her what your role SHOULD be, and explain what you wanted to do in that situation....

Its the perfect time for communication
Jeff





I *did* speak with my sensei the next day. I mentioned to him what my initial reaction to the student was and that I was interested, from a teaching perspective (mine) why he didn't say anything about her rudeness. He said that "you have to have some intelligence" (when dealing with this kind of student). At the time, I was confused as to why his silence was considered "intelligent".

After reading the various perspectives offered in this thread, I think I'm beginning to appreciate my sensei's approach a little better. Or at least consider dealing with this type of situation in a different way than my initial gut-reaction, which was to discipline the student, then explain etiquette to her.

Thank you for reminding me to check ahead of time what I'll be required to do. I usually do ask, but I didn't in this case. It was a last minute request to help out, I didn't have a lot of time to think about what I was doing, and I'm not very experienced in teaching, especially with this group of students.

Boy, I thought the "sensei" title, and the shiny new BB to go along with it would make things easier - not harder. Looks like *I* have a lot to learn...

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#292164 - 10/15/06 08:56 PM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: senseihonor]
Ronin1966 Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 04/26/02
Posts: 3116
Loc: East Coast, United States
Hello Senseihonor:

It is a difficult job that is for sure!
Be well,

J

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#292165 - 10/18/06 11:34 AM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: senseihonor]
schanne Offline
breaks things

Registered: 02/18/04
Posts: 4370
Loc: Woodbury NJ
I'm new(ish) to teaching and so far have mostly been assisting my sensei in class.

Then it's up to the owner to care for matters like you have stated. Your just a teacher and they are his customers..$$$$$$.... let him deal with unrully students, that is unless he gives you thumbs up to dicipline at your discression.
_________________________
The way of the warrior does not include other ways... Miyamoto Musashi Schanne

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#292166 - 10/21/06 08:59 PM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: schanne]
senseihonor Offline
Member

Registered: 09/09/06
Posts: 62
Loc: Ontario, Canada
<<unless he gives you thumbs up to dicipline at your discression.>>

I think this is always a good point to clarify with the Sensei - *before* class.

In this case, the lesson was reinforced for me because I've had a chance to rabbit on about it in this forum.

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#292167 - 10/22/06 03:30 PM Re: Students Who Say "No" [Re: senseihonor]
trevek Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/15/05
Posts: 3337
Loc: Poland
Senseihonor,

so did she ever pass her grading?
_________________________
See how well I block your punches with my jaw!!

Supporting everyone saying "nuts to cancer"

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