ok dragon, you can take a breath now. lol

he musta had some seriously bad karate instruction, if any, all i saw was "what i've been told"
there is plenty of "jujutsu" in karate, it is in kata, a sub art called tuite, or torite. much like chin na is a sub art of alot of chinese systems, and that is the part of the art where joint locks, and takedowns and such are taught.
i also don't agree you have to study enshin or kyokushin to get good karate.
i like jujutsu allot, but from a certain perspective, i'd say in some ways karate is more complete than jujutsu, as allot of jujutsu systems had very little striking. however anything and everything is in karate if you know how to look for it.
just the opinion of someone who really doesn't know too much about karate other than what he's read (me)

FlyingDragon just owned himself; it's best not to criticise the punctuation of others when you're lacking in that department yourself.

one of the best martial arts i have ever learned is probley ju jitsu but still everything has a weakness.and the only ways to enhance that weakness and make it less affective is to train hard and try out many many different styles of martial arts,...and mix them up because in the street you are going up against grapplers or throwers or even worse a resseler and you need to focus on that grappling techniques if you just do one style of martial art it may not be affective, its all about the focus.now I am doing aikido tonight ok, and as I go there i am going to learn about sword techniques and arm techniques but even one style of martial arts is affective very affective against the worst apponents. I dont use that word enemy I use the word apponent because I have rspect for the enemy always and I have understanding of others.

and still. it does not matter how good you are at any martial art, you will never ever be perfect and that is the ultimate weakness of all we can just aim to be the very best and there is always some teachers in some of the most best schools in town, and even they dont teach you how to get out of locks and grapples. so just take note of what I am saying because I know what I am talking about but not 100% ok?.

*sound of FD's sarcasm flying over migos' head*

lol, style better then style for practicality.

Haven't we finially established that this crap should be taken off the boards. I know you have a right to your opnion my man, but realy one more bad mouth to karate and efficicany and im gonna take my student loan and start giving out painfull pratcial seminars concerning just how exactly it completly depends on the person over the art!

you had a bad karate expirence, ok, you had 25 years of bad karate ok, you have a right to your opnion ok, but stop and think, please i know it hurts, what kind of educated discussion or informed debate can you start by trash talking one completly general wing of the martial arts, the best your ever gonna get is the line of [censored] off karate ka ready to tell you what for!!

so i guess i'll replay along the same wavelength, hope this one's completly comprehendable..your mother wares army boots and your senesi is stealing your money!!

where are you from? cause if the best sensei in town doesn't teach how to get out of holds, or grapples...go somewhere else.
in the end, i guess we all need to remember to try not to bash other arts. cause someone else loves that art, and its up to them. if you dont like karate, stick with jujutsu...or try kung fu..or silat...or something.

Jiujitsu is a " GREAT " martial art and can be very effective on the street! But, so are others, both striking and grappling. Ideally, it's best to train in both. The street is soooooo unpredictable. Many times, especially with multiple opponents, if you cannot escape, it would be more beneficial to stand up and strike. Stay out of reach until you can escape or help arrives. Going to the ground, or tying up in a clinch could be very bad w/multiple assailants!

Of course there are times a grappling art would be more useful. A restraining situation with 1 attacker is an example. Trying to remove an attacker from a victim is another. Plus many more.

The thing to remember is each art has strengths against certain "street situations". Unfortunately, there are multitudes of "situations"! Weapons, single attackers, single drunk/high/etc.attackers, multiple attackers, ambushes w/single, multiple sober/drunk/high attackers w/weapons ..........so on and so forth!

There is no "best" art for street confrontations. It's best to prepare for "all" confrontations in the case escape is impossible.

I thought style vs style type arguements were way way outdated and old fashioned or is that just me? I mean I can imagine competitions where the point is to compare schools/styles for fun. However, the old throwing down the gauntlet of "my style is better than yours" is, in my opinion just silly now. The impression I read from these boards is that there is no crap art, but there are crap schools, trainers (and students) in every art. As there are excellent ones too. Anway my bad, I made a pointless post to a pointless sort of a debate :-).

ok I made the worse mistake of my life going to aikido this guy charges you like ma wounded bull and secondly its just not affective enough to get out of a grappling move ju jitsu is one of the best martial arts i have ever learned and my hanshi is the best teacher i have ever had in my intire life. I am not leaving ju jitsu I am with it forever and 4 life.