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#289832 - 10/13/06 07:34 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: Unsu]
shoshinkan Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 05/10/05
Posts: 2662
Loc: UK
double standards - welcome to life...........

In fairness everyone calm down and discuss the topic like adults please
_________________________
Jim Neeter

www.shoshinkanuk.blogspot.com

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#289833 - 10/13/06 07:39 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: Unsu]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Unsu wrote
Quote:


What's personal? Where's the attack?




To be specific:

Quote:


You are just as clueless as……




And,

Quote:


Lesson for today:
Get on Google, search for "clue" and get one...





Really that isn’t much of an affront and personally, I don’t care what you call me or think of me. The thing is, I’ve not had the first dealing with you yet on this forum and you start right out of the gate with a rant that is more aimed at me than anything else.

Thus, if you want to debate that’s fine, I love nothing more. If you want to throw down, fine there as well. Lets meet up and get it on. Otherwise, when in Rome, do as the Romans and play along. State your point, don’t be a pr*ck about it and we’ll get along just fine.


Quote:


And aren't you a mod?




Yes, but not of this forum.


Quote:


Why are you calling me a phallus? Doing the exact same thing you did got me booted from FA.com. What's up with the double standard mods?





So you got booted from FA.com?? That's this site. What name were you going by then?

And why aren't you using your real name here like I am big guy?


I called you a “phallus” simply because, one good turn deserves another. You started in on me and I fired back. That’s the way it is funboy.


Quote:


Look I never said anything about you specifically.





You stated:

Quote:


You are just as clueless as the folks who thought having a BB in karate or kung-fu meant you could fight.




So there is nothing specific about me there?


Again I really don’t care what you think about me. But if you want my attention, you’re going to have address me with some respect.

Quote:


If what I posted hit home and your conscience is calling you out then so be it, but don't blame your self-esteem issues on me. Where I grew up we call that "showing your a--".





Unfortunately for you, nothing you said hit a nerve with me, other than how you were saying it. About 50 percent of what you were saying has some validity. Where I grew up, we called that being about “half-assed”.



Quote:


I can gandle ANYTHING anyone on here, even you, dishes out. Beyond that I looove to debate. Bring it on...





That’s good that you can handle words big boy. If you want to debate with me, you’d better be able to. But you’d BETTER also have some damned sense. That’s the part about you that I’m thinking is lacking the most.


-John

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#289834 - 10/13/06 07:51 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: Unsu]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Probably the part where you called him clueless. Just a guess. While i dont know that you necessarily directly attacked him your post did have a rather unpleasant tone.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#289835 - 10/13/06 08:07 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: Chen Zen]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
Yeah you know Chen, I really don't mind anyone speaking their mind, so long as there is a certain measure of respect shown.

It's one thing to state an opinion about training. That's what this place is FOR. I mean, everyone knows how *I* feel about things. I give my opinion about certain practices but I don’t disrespect PEOPLE personally (until I have been disrespected, then all bets are off).

Once someone stats his opinion about me, it becomes personal. That's just something that, although it really doesn't phase me, can't be allowed on this forum, lest it will go straight down the toilet. If we allow one to do so, we'd have to allow EVERYONE to talk as much sh*t about each other as they chose. That’s the reason why I called him out on this.

Unsu, you have the right to speak your mind here. That right however ends at MY nose. Please take this into consideration if you’d like to enjoy a hassle free experience on this forum.



-John

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#289836 - 10/13/06 08:17 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: JKogas]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Quote:

Yeah you know Chen, I really don't mind anyone speaking their mind, so long as there is a certain measure of respect shown.

-John


I hear ya John. Ive had to deal out some punishment myself. I dont know what it is about these new guys as of late. While there has been a few quality users joining up it seems like the majority of them are are just asking for trouble. Rather sad to have to waste valuable space and time dealing with that sort. Nothing we havent handled before though.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#289837 - 10/13/06 08:21 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: Chen Zen]
JKogas Offline
Prolific

Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 10818
Loc: North Carolina
I'm betting when he comes back, he's on his BEST behavior.



-John

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#289838 - 10/13/06 08:32 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: JKogas]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
I hope not it just got entertaining. LOl. JK. We need as few posters of that nature as possible.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#289839 - 10/13/06 11:57 PM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: Unsu]
ANDY44 Offline
Revolutionary!

Registered: 07/01/06
Posts: 814
Quote:


Everyone's always talking about how the punches in boxing are so powerful and simple and such, however I've never heard someone talk about the advantages of the straight and reverse punches used in Karate and TKD. Could anyone fill me in on the pros and cons of this style of punching?





The potential for power with the typical reverse punch is decent. The drawback is that these are usually trained off the hip which is only going to get you knocked the F' out in a real fight. People who train to actually FIGHT keep their hands up.


-John




Quote:


Yeah and people who train real karate keep their hands up and in front of them when they fight.






http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBbaH3CIVTc&mode=related&search=


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASGFOKC2lTM&mode=related&search=
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-4605245861799874378&q=karate+knockouts

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=6192629332384833142&q=karate+knockouts

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=5802308196935672841&q=karate

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-738567329119735266&q=karate

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=6925356458397814201&q=karate

Not all karate ka or even other fighting styles(hate that word) have their hands up and in a good position and chin down for a good defence

And guys like this one with good left hooks or any guy with a decent technique will exploit it.
John does have a good and valid point. Maybe if the none believers got in and sparred with this boxer?
Having said that I dont think this apply's to everybody including most knowledgeable karate ka.
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=2471286240673428878&q=boxing

Quote:



This is the truth- you can either fight or you can't. You can either draw or sing or you can't.





If your refering to inherited traits for fighting then fine. Other wise most people either with out or very little of those traits can be trained to fight or at least fight better than they could in the worse case scenario.
But you are wrong to say either a person can fight or cant fight
Quote:


Get real and quit lumping every TMA type into the category of wackling who can't squabble.




He doesnt he tests the water.Prove it to him.

Quote:


You are just as clueless as the folks who thought having a BB in karate or kung-fu meant you could fight.




You are wrong again John isnt clueless. He says what he thinks unless you can prove him wrong by evidence. Not speculation
Quote:


Most that go to learn how to fight without that in them, environmentally implanted in them, will still be weak when it comes to the real deal.




Debatable.Inherited fighting traits doesnt always mean the person has a greater advantage. There are other variables

Quote:


So to reiterate: you can either fight or you can't. Certain activities may enhance your skill-set, but nothing will make a grown person who is past their neurologically/biologically most plastic stages of life a real fighter.






I totaly Dissagree. Define what you think is a real fighter?

Quote:


Fighters are born, bred then groomed, but if it ain't innate and learned at a young age the best you can hope for is to be in good shape and to learn some combat principles. Luck is your best weapon in a self-preservation scenario if all you do is practice limited fighting and ring sport. It's been proven over and over.





Some people are born with inherited traits that would help a fighter. Some are not but that still doesnt stop some one if they train hard enough from becoming a good fighter.

Quote:


Lesson for today:
Get on Google, search for "clue" and get one...IMHO





If i compare what John has stated on this forum to what you have stated then perhaps it is you that should look up clue using google.

I am not defending John as such he sees thing his way I see them my way. But the what you are missing is most of the time he does know what he is talking about. He doesnt seem to like kata or some types of karate based on what he has seen and to be quite honest I agree with him. Except I dont think John has seen real karate or real karate kata and kata application. That isnt his fault.

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#289840 - 10/14/06 02:17 AM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: ANDY44]
Umbra_777 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/03/06
Posts: 148
Quote:

This is the truth- you can either fight or you can't. You can either draw or sing or you can't.


In order to refute this point we need look no further than the U.S. Army. Either it is possible to train people to be fighters or the Army has an amazing ability to recruit only those with natural talent.

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#289841 - 10/14/06 07:39 AM Re: Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. [Re: JKogas]
ANDY44 Offline
Revolutionary!

Registered: 07/01/06
Posts: 814
Quote:

I'm betting when he comes back, he's on his BEST behavior.



-John




Boxing hands better the Karate hands poll. How many believe and train that boxing hands are better then Karate hands in the street?
Quote:


I believe that boxing hands are better then Karate hands in gloved sparring using the basic 5-6 punches, but not in the street.

If my intent is to injury or end a fight quickly, Karate hands are better, target selection, use of entire body and control.

How many work the bags with different hand formations, elbow, forearms, shoulders, hips, knees and head butts??? You fight how you train.

No wrong or right just a poll?







Hi John. Instead of getting angry and going way off topic can you direct me to any discussions on clinch work on the forum? And regards booting people off the forum well as I see it if you guys want to let off steam then others should be allowed to with in reason with out resorting to booting people off. Chen Zen and John this is the karate forum please either discuss the topic or its deviations or start a new topic .


Jim, shoshinkan and.Brian S.
My Apologies for jumping in your shoes.





Thanks Andy


Edited by ANDY44 (10/14/06 07:52 AM)

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