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#287324 - 09/21/06 02:45 AM Grappling multiple opponents.
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
To be fair, before I start this post I want it to be known that grappling isnt my specialty. I dont discredit grappling in anyways but I dont enjoy it much. Claustrophobia. However I can hold my own on the mat. And I do train in this area of MA.

With that said let me get to the point. Ive recently had conversations where the speaker has said that they would grapple multiple opponents. To these people I say, join reality, we miss you.

The simple fact of the matter is that it is never smart to try and fight more than one person. On the ground or otherwise.

Here is my definition of self defense= the ability to return to freedom.

Mobility is key to this idea. You must be able to move freely at all times to defend, attack, and escape. Lyaing on your back doesnt facilitate this.

When you are on the ground, your hands are full. You must control your opponents arms, (if only momentarily) then you must figure out a way to subdue him quickly all the while controlling your own arms and him fighting back with all his might. While you are doing this you have to hope that your attacker is alone. If your hands are busy working his hands or limbs. Whats protecting you? What protects you once you are so committed? The level of committment to groundfighting is as much or higher than the committment you have made once you are mid flight into a jump kick. Way too much.

I dont care who you are. You could be Royce Gracie himself. two average grapplers.Let me say it again AVERAGE grappler will easily beat out one good one. Especially if the weight is relatively close between all three combatants. And for those of you who say strength isnt a factor in grappling: get real! If thats the case I have some people Id love you to meet on a mat. Then We'll see if your money is where your mouth is. So members, whats your thoughts?
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
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#287325 - 09/21/06 06:28 AM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: Chen Zen]
crablord Offline
th3 t4sty sn4ck

Registered: 08/10/06
Posts: 1530
Loc: Australia, QLD, GC
lol i remember a higher belt telling me once during grappling, " its not strength, its technique", of course using nothing but strength I pinned him to the ground and won the round
_________________________
"They say the only way to kill a lion is with a rear naked choke, but I'd just kick it in the head"

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#287326 - 09/21/06 08:22 PM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: crablord]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
Happens all the time. People get cocky because there gym partner is weaker or doesnt fight as hard as he would on the street. Then when they get beat boy do the excuses start flying! But oh no it was never strength
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#287327 - 09/22/06 07:17 PM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: Chen Zen]
Rumble Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/05
Posts: 92
Ok this is just my opinion so everyone dont get bent out of shape especially the moderators lol....pure power or strenght can beat almost any technique. Take for instance Matt Hughes without his freakish strenght he would be nothing. By the way I cant wait for the BJPenn vs. Matt Hughes fight. Im rooting for my local brother BJ to knock the crap out of Hughes.


Edited by Rumble (09/22/06 07:30 PM)
_________________________
Talk is cheap take it to the pit.

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#287328 - 09/22/06 07:28 PM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: Rumble]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Quote:

Ok this is just my opinion so everyone dont get bent out of shape especially the moderators lol....pure power or strenght can beat almost any technique.




There has to be an extreme strength imbalance between the opponents for that to be true.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#287329 - 09/22/06 07:57 PM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: MattJ]
Rumble Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/05
Posts: 92
Quote:

Quote:

Ok this is just my opinion so everyone dont get bent out of shape especially the moderators lol....pure power or strenght can beat almost any technique.




There has to be an extreme strength imbalance between the opponents for that to be true.




Wrong. All you need is a little strength imbalance or that little edge for the outcome to be in your favor.


Edited by Rumble (09/22/06 08:17 PM)
_________________________
Talk is cheap take it to the pit.

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#287330 - 09/22/06 08:14 PM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: Rumble]
Chen Zen Offline
Professional Poster

Registered: 02/09/03
Posts: 7043
Loc: Ms
I believe it would have to be a fairly substantial difference. Not huge but not small either.
_________________________
"When I let Go of who I am, I become who I might be."
Lao Tzu

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#287331 - 09/22/06 11:26 PM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: Chen Zen]
crablord Offline
th3 t4sty sn4ck

Registered: 08/10/06
Posts: 1530
Loc: Australia, QLD, GC
yep, if anyone has seen fearless, that fight scene with the big guy? Thats the type of imbalance that you would need lol. Take bob sapp for instance, hes huge, but cro cop beat him. I agree that power can be matched to technique, but power only gets you so far. A blend is good
_________________________
"They say the only way to kill a lion is with a rear naked choke, but I'd just kick it in the head"

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#287332 - 09/23/06 01:11 AM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: crablord]
Rumble Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/05
Posts: 92
Quote:

yep, if anyone has seen fearless, that fight scene with the big guy? Thats the type of imbalance that you would need lol. Take bob sapp for instance, hes huge, but cro cop beat him. I agree that power can be matched to technique, but power only gets you so far. A blend is good




Oh no crablord you been watching too many JetLee movies lol...As that big guy in the movie Fearless in real life would rip Jet lee in half with ease and as for Bob Sapp as big as he is for his weight he is weak for his size and cant fight for sh!t lol.....Also size and pure power is two different things. Also that big guy in the fearless movie is the same guy in the new Ongbak movie I forget what the original title was but in the American version I think its called the Protector or something like that lol.....but it is a good movie with all tommys stunts,acrobatics and flashy moves I especially like the part where he was fighting the multiple guys using the joint bone breaking techniques. AAHH sh1t now what was I talking about again lol lol......


Edited by Rumble (09/23/06 01:13 AM)
_________________________
Talk is cheap take it to the pit.

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#287333 - 09/23/06 01:16 AM Re: Grappling multiple opponents. [Re: Rumble]
crablord Offline
th3 t4sty sn4ck

Registered: 08/10/06
Posts: 1530
Loc: Australia, QLD, GC
He was in troy too. big guy at the start? I met him too once lives in brisbane. Oh yeah i didnt say jet would win, i said if technique could really lose to power you would need a big imbalance, like a guy jets size vs bigdude. technique of course not being the silly little breakdance kicks he did!
_________________________
"They say the only way to kill a lion is with a rear naked choke, but I'd just kick it in the head"

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