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#285832 - 09/15/06 09:57 PM Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do?
solaron Offline
Newbie

Registered: 09/12/06
Posts: 11
Loc: Cincinnati, Ohio
Just checking for a friend to see if anyone has heard anything about the Shaolin Do style of Kung Fu. Real? Scam? Worthless? Good? Heard both good and bad things about Grandmaster Sin The, but only from unlearned people (the supporters and detractors could only repeat stuff they'd heard from a friend's brother's cousin, etc).

Thanks!

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#285833 - 09/15/06 10:24 PM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: solaron]
MattJ Offline
Free Rhinoplasty!
Prolific

Registered: 11/25/04
Posts: 15634
Loc: York PA. USA
Check this thread:

http://www.fightingarts.com/ubbthreads/s...ue#Post15795506

You may want to search on Bullshido. Sin The's claims about his training and the origins of the art are suspect. The training at the schools is not likely to be good, but apparently there are some decent ones. Check it out first before you join.
_________________________
"In case you ever wondered what it's like to be knocked out, it's like waking up from a nightmare only to discover it wasn't a dream." -Forrest Griffin

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#285834 - 09/15/06 10:39 PM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: solaron]
Fisherman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/16/03
Posts: 1656
Loc: Colorado, USA
solaron,

Like Matt said, location is a kay part of this.
Where are you located? I spent a few years within the Shaolin Do system before moving on to other things, I may be able to help.
PM if you like.
_________________________
Chris Haynes

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#285835 - 09/15/06 11:46 PM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: Fisherman]
solaron Offline
Newbie

Registered: 09/12/06
Posts: 11
Loc: Cincinnati, Ohio
Thanks for the speedy replies!

The location in question is Blue Ash Shaolin Do, in Cincinnati, Ohio. It's not too far away from Bill Leonard's place, from what I hear. The site is www.ohiosd.com.

I don't think that a shady history matters to my friend... but it may. It doesn't really, to me, if the art itself isn't fake. I doubt you'll find a 100% authentic 'Shaolin' style anywhere in the world - Shaolin temples these days even are becoming tourist traps for aspiring MAs.

Either way, if anyone knows anything about the Cincy Shaolin-Do, I'd love some feedback. I will probably try it with him.

Thanks!

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#285836 - 09/16/06 07:10 AM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: solaron]
BaguaMonk Offline
Member

Registered: 12/18/04
Posts: 404
Loc: DALLAS TX BABY
I would stay away from shaolin do...I guess if you've never trained in a martial art before I would understand. But their advertising tactics, lineage hoax, and various other suspect things really throws most people off. Also because I have been at a similar "McDojo" before, one with a charismatic teacher...and very isolated practice. You will understand what I mean later..
_________________________
Truth comes from the absolute stillness of the mind...

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#285837 - 09/16/06 09:38 AM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: solaron]
Fisherman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/16/03
Posts: 1656
Loc: Colorado, USA
I am not familiar with this group. If there is nothing else in your area, you may want to check them out.
The Shaolin Do that I attended, while it's lineage is questionable, did have a pretty good program. Lots of good conditioning, sparring, and a ton of forms - if thats what you are looking for.
I don't think the art itself is fake, but I do queston how the material was actually obtained befoe being passed along by Sin Kwan The.
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Chris Haynes

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#285838 - 09/17/06 04:52 PM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: Fisherman]
Shouji Offline
Member

Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 272
Loc: VA
Well, before I say anything, I want you to know that I am currently learning Shaolin-Do Kung Fu. My Grandmaster holds 9th Degree in Hap Ki Do and Kung Fu. He also holds 8th degree in Tae Kwon Do. As you can imagine, he is running the Dojo pretty much all day, everyday. He is a great man, and he is ALWAYS in the classroom teaching, and never takes a day off unless it is REALLY important. (btw, a sign of a good teacher is that he/she is always in the class, not just sending a higher level student to teach).

Kung Fu is one of the oldest fighting arts known to mankind. It means, "hard work" and, "always learning". Its divided between two systems, external and internal. The external system is identified with the Shaolin style. Most of it is animal forms (tiger, dragon, crane, snake, leopard, praying mantis, monkey, eagle claw...etc). The internal system consists of, "softer" styles, such as Tai-Chi, Hsing-I, Pa-Kua.

Also, there are over 16 weapons to learn from. As of now, I learned broadsword, 2 parts to Staff, and the Straight Sword. Others include spear, whip chain, 3-Secional Staff, Kwan-Do (halberd)...etc.

From my honest perspective, avoid Kung Fu unless you truly understand Martial Arts in general. It is 99.7% form form form. Doing these forms, you learn to apply them in real life situations. There is no sparring (at least in my class).

It is possibly the hardest art to learn. Its often looked down upon because, "they" say that the Katas used in the forms wouldn't work in real life. This is not true. It all depends on how hard you train at it, and how much you truly believe in the art. It is far more complex of the 3 my Grandmaster teaches (in his own words).

Also noted, Kung Fu is heavily the opposite of everything Bruce Lee says. Kung Fu is limited only because the forms are strict, and must be done in the exact way it is taught, no exceptions. Although myself, I personally favor Bruce Lees philisophys.

There you have it.
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The only thing a belt is good for is to hold your pants up

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#285839 - 09/18/06 08:31 AM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: Shouji]
Fisherman Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/16/03
Posts: 1656
Loc: Colorado, USA
Shouji,

I think that it is good that you are happy with where you are training and hold your teacher in high regard.
I do have to differ with some of your points that you are trying to make. As you might have seen in the other post, I too have spent quite a bit of time at a school that holds the Sin The teachings etc. I hold no ill regret about the time that I spent there because it put me on the path that I'm on today.

Quote:

Its divided between two systems, external and internal. The external system is identified with the Shaolin style. Most of it is animal forms (tiger, dragon, crane, snake, leopard, praying mantis, monkey, eagle claw...etc). The internal system consists of, "softer" styles, such as Tai-Chi, Hsing-I, Pa-Kua.



This is only true of the Shaolin Do system. Not all schools do all of these different things. As a matter of fact, a lot of places focus on one or two of the above mentioned styles within their system. As far as learning a martial art is concerned, I think that this is a much better approach. You have more time to devote yourself to one style and get good at it rather than spreading yourself thin by learing so many different things. You can have the time needed to perfect principles and techniques rather than just learining form after form.

Quote:

From my honest perspective, avoid Kung Fu unless you truly understand Martial Arts in general. It is 99.7% form form form. Doing these forms, you learn to apply them in real life situations. There is no sparring (at least in my class).



The kungfu at the Shaolin Do scholls are 99.7% forms. You do not learn how to apply forms by doing them, sorry, it just doesn't happen that way. You need to at least spar to get a slight grasp of what fighting is like. Furthermore, you must train how to apply the principles and techniques the form is trying to convey. If you are in a fight or even in sparring for that matter, you will not be able to apply the form as you learned it. Fights are random and therefore you must be able to attack and defend as such. Forms will get you nowhere if you don't know how to use them properly to train. Forms don't teach you how to fight, training methods do.

Quote:

It is possibly the hardest art to learn. Its often looked down upon because, "they" say that the Katas used in the forms wouldn't work in real life. This is not true. It all depends on how hard you train at it, and how much you truly believe in the art.




The hard training will get you speed, stamina, and strength, but when it comes to actual martial skill, forms alone aren't going to cut it. You need to learn how to train the principle and techniques imbedded in the forms with others, spar, etc. if you want to effectively learn how to apply your art, even if it is just in self defense.

Best regards,
_________________________
Chris Haynes

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#285840 - 09/18/06 10:24 AM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: solaron]
tarpshack Offline
Newbie

Registered: 09/18/06
Posts: 10
Unfortunately I cannot weigh in on the Shaolin Do authenticity debate. I do not have the martial arts experience or historical knowledge. However, I can speak for the Blue Ash Shaolin Do school and its teachers as I have recently joined this school. It is excellent. I'm not sure if other martial arts are like this, but I can tell right away that you get out what you put into it. The instructors are very talented. Their instruction is good and personalized as needed. There is sparring, and there is conditioning. I mostly chose this particular school because I knew a couple people there, but it has turned out to be an excellent choice. I would recommend you check it out if you are interested. I wouldn't normally go promoting my school on here to anyone who mentioned Shaolin Do, but you specifically asked about my location. I thought it might help your decision to hear from someone who has started taking classes there.

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#285841 - 09/18/06 02:52 PM Re: Anyone know anything about Shaolin Do? [Re: tarpshack]
ashe_higgs Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 04/15/06
Posts: 593
Loc: phoenix
basically, what fish said.

but i do have a buddy who does shaolin do, and he's a scrapper. although, most of what they train at his school is form.

that's not bad in and of itself. not everybody wants to train as hard as a thai boxer.
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falling leaves discipline, concentration & wisdom

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