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#271056 - 07/23/06 06:52 PM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: underdog]
Derik Offline
Cruisin' for a bruisin'

Registered: 03/05/06
Posts: 161
Theres a black belt in my style too that is in a wheelchair he devolped basicly a sign language for kicks

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#271057 - 09/03/06 05:10 AM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Ed_Morris]
Jeff_G Offline
Member

Registered: 04/15/06
Posts: 222
Loc: Midwest
How about the guy who came into the club one night carrying a baseball bat? He looked like he had just had the business end of that bat used on his face in the past 24 hours. He also appeared to have self medicated with a bottle of something.

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#271058 - 09/03/06 08:00 AM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Jeff_G]
underdog Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1270
Loc: Mansfield, MA U.S.A.
Sounds like for this guy I call the police.
_________________________
The older I get, the better I was!

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#271059 - 09/03/06 10:49 AM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Ed_Morris]
migo Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 09/03/06
Posts: 573
Loc: Burnaby, BC, Canada
1. the person is average height, but well over 350lbs.

>> no problem, big guys are great to work with

2. the person has multiple face peircings and tells you they won't remove them but is willing to risk it.

>> tata, no way a cross face won't rip some of them out

3. the person mentions, for religious reasons, they will not engage in any 'ceremonial' or iconic things like wearing rank, bowing, or speaking a foreign language nor recite any codes.

>> fine by me, but they've gotta shake hands and show proper respect

4. the person is obviously a transgender female, (was male-is now a female, without operation).

>> no problem there

5. tells you they will pay x money to learn 1 particular kata or skill.

>> how big is x?

6. the person happens to be your sibling's ex-spouse who is cuurently going thru a nasty legal battle with each other.

>> I'd have to think about it, but as long as they pay and don't cause trouble, why not?

7. a student who always pays on time and in full, but consitantly only shows up to one class per month.

>> ehh, that's a tough one, I'd probably give them a discount

8. a person who has double the amount of MA experience as you and visibly more skill than yourself, but is humble about it.

>> no problem at all, I'd welcome them

9. someone who is not particularly interested in the Art, but more in the exercise aspect.

>> sure, as long as they don't become a hindrance

10. a student of another school, who you know will be taking the other art simultaneously

>> no problem at all, unless they'd be entering competitions, if it's the same type of competition at both schools, then no, that would be some issues, completely different style, I'm all for it

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#271060 - 09/05/06 11:12 AM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Ed_Morris]
Uchinanchu Offline
Member

Registered: 02/09/06
Posts: 99
Loc: Okinawa, Japan
Edsan, Hisashiburi ne.

As usual, your posts can be quite thought provoking at times....and humbling. You are already a great "teacher" whether you realize it or not.
I know it's been quite awhile since I have posted anything, so I thought I would chime in for once (instead of just lurking). I found everyone's posts interesting, in that they were all so similar in answering the questions. On that note, let me answer your questions in my own fashion.

Teaching on a military installation for a few years (under contract) was quite a pain. When dealing with the military, you run into all sorts of "interesting" people that you HAVE to deal with in a certain specific way (usually outlined in the contract). Also, you must go thru a costomer service class (if contracted thru MCCS) so as not to loose potential "customers".
Needless to say, one gets tired of having one's hands tied as to how one "runs a business". I did not start teaching to make money. I did it to honor my obligation to my sensei and his teachings. So, I basically became a very bad business man and ran things EXACTLY the way I wanted to.

So to finally answer your questions (in my own fashion), if I ever return stateside, I will not advertise, so the only students that I will ever encounter will be ones that have a direct invitation from myself, or have a formal letter of introduction from a third party.
Once they have been evaluated, I will then decide if I wish to keep them on as a student. Harsh sounding? Maybe, but as I said, I am NOT a business man.
As I have stated in earlier posts, my sensei's dojo is always open and we welcome all interested parties...but rules of a dojo are not to be taken lightly. If it is your dojo, you can be as "flexible" with your rules as YOU wish to be. If it's ran like a business, well, you have obligations other than passing on your teachings, to worry about.
Sorry if this sounded preachy. It's not meant to be. Just running a school under contract left a bad taste in my mouth for quite awhile...
_________________________
All streams flow to the sea because it is lower than they are. Humility gives it its power.

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#271061 - 09/05/06 11:48 AM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Ed_Morris]
Galen Offline
Member

Registered: 11/07/04
Posts: 381
1. the person is average height, but well over 350lbs.

Not only would they not be turned away, I would encourage them to come in and train as long and hard as is safe for them. Being one who was once overweight myself, I have nothing but respect for anyone who faces that challenge and is resolute to beat it.

2. the person has multiple face peircings and tells you they won't remove them but is willing to risk it.

As far as I am concerned, its not only their safety at risk. Itís the students they train with. Sorry. The piercings are removed (all of them) for class, or they donít train.

3. the person mentions, for religious reasons, they will not engage in any 'ceremonial' or iconic things like wearing rank, bowing, or speaking a foreign language nor recite any codes.

I would try to explain that some of these trappings are simply part of the curriculum, and not reflective of any religious stances one way or another. If they still refused, they have demonstrated a willingness and demand to be above the other students, and refuse to follow protocol. Gone.

4. the person is obviously a transgender female, (was male-is now a female, without operation).

Cant think of anything more irrelevant. They would be more than welcome to train.

5. tells you they will pay x money to learn 1 particular kata or skill.

To me that is like a student pilot saying ďI only want to learn how to take off.Ē

Nope.

6. the person happens to be your sibling's ex-spouse who is cuurently going thru a nasty legal battle with each other.

If I got the impression that their desire to train is pure, they would be more than welcome.

7. a student who always pays on time and in full, but consitantly only shows up to one class per month.

It would be made clear that their progress would likely be commensurate with their attendance. If they want to pay full dues and only take advantage of one class per month, thatís their call. No issue.

8. a person who has double the amount of MA experience as you and visibly more skill than yourself, but is humble about it.

Why someone like that would want to pay to attend a class that they wont learn much from is beyond me, but I would certainly not turn them away.

9. someone who is not particularly interested in the Art, but more in the exercise aspect.

They reasons for training are their own, and as long as they follow the curriculum, more power to them.


10. a student of another school, who you know will be taking the other art simultaneously.

I openly encourage my students to train in other styles and other arts. I recommend that they wait until they have a solid foundation in one before trying another, but its hardly a rule. No problem.

G
_________________________
Nothing imperfect is the measure of anything!

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#271062 - 09/10/06 01:40 PM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Ed_Morris]
vegantkd Offline
Member

Registered: 09/06/06
Posts: 121
"4. the person is obviously a transgender female, (was male-is now a female, without operation)."
isn't it illegal to turn away someone for this reason?

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#271063 - 09/10/06 03:03 PM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: vegantkd]
underdog Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1270
Loc: Mansfield, MA U.S.A.
It may or may not be illegal. I think it depends on the state. Some states come pretty close to making it illegal. It is probably foolish. Firstly, someone's sexual orientation or sexual identification, or sexual anything else, ought never to enter the discussion. The only time it should ever become an issue, regardless of sexual attributes, would be if someone (1) sexualized the physical contact which is unavoidable in martial arts,(2) used vulgar language or other sexually inappropriate language or sexually harrassing language (3) was inappropriately coming on to others in the school (4) shunned the dress code and was not dressed properly for class. If none of these are an issue, then who cares?
_________________________
The older I get, the better I was!

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#271064 - 09/10/06 03:53 PM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Prizewriter]
pepto_bismol Offline
infinite kudos

Registered: 03/04/06
Posts: 480
Quote:

The only person I have ever seen turned away from class was a man who had a criminal record and didn't declare it to the instructor. (Police check turned it up). He lasted 2 lessons.




he has done his time, doesn't he deserve a second chance?
_________________________
YAY pepto bismol! No... not... kryptonite

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#271065 - 09/11/06 02:10 AM Re: would you ever turn a student away? [Re: Ed_Morris]
crablord Offline
th3 t4sty sn4ck

Registered: 08/10/06
Posts: 1530
Loc: Australia, QLD, GC
Quote:


1. the person is average height, but well over 350lbs.

are we talking muscle or fat here? if its fat then no.

2. the person has multiple face peircings and tells you they won't remove them but is willing to risk it.

nope, depending on the piercings, if small then yes.

3. the person mentions, for religious reasons, they will not engage in any 'ceremonial' or iconic things like wearing rank, bowing, or speaking a foreign language nor recite any codes.

nope, religion [censored] me off. If they cant wear the uniform or bow then [censored] em. (srry lol)

4. the person is obviously a transgender female, (was male-is now a female, without operation).

no, i can imagine how awkward it would be if i had to spar with a transexual. that is if i didnt just leave then and there. So no go on this one.

5. tells you they will pay x money to learn 1 particular kata or skill.

Sure i guess...no harm done

6. the person happens to be your sibling's ex-spouse who is cuurently going thru a nasty legal battle with each other.

sure, if the guys nice then why not..plus, who says we like our siblings

7. a student who always pays on time and in full, but consitantly only shows up to one class per month.

yep, no harm done again.

8. a person who has double the amount of MA experience as you and visibly more skill than yourself, but is humble about it.

sure, nothing wrong with that

9. someone who is not particularly interested in the Art, but more in the exercise aspect.

Yep, sure. as long as he did what he was told.

10. a student of another school, who you know will be taking the other art simultaneously.

absolutely. This is a good thing.


_________________________
"They say the only way to kill a lion is with a rear naked choke, but I'd just kick it in the head"

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